Warren Jones Posted June 20, 2023 Posted June 20, 2023 Sorry for keeping this off topic but I thought this needed a response. Lets put some perspective here. The P3 is a great TT, I haven't had the opportunity to hear one yet, but it's 3 to 4 times the price of an SP10mk2. On the cogging issue yes the SP10 uses a core motor and yes with the platter removed you can see the poles passing the stator slots. Cogging will be reflected in the W&F measurements, W&F specs the P3 is 0.015% and the SP10mk2 is 0.025% using the same JIS standard so the P3 is 100ppm (parts per million) better. The SP10 will cog at 33.3Hz here is a spectrum plot of an SP10mk2 playing a 1kHz tone from the Ultimate Analog Test LP I did a couple of years ago. I've marked on the plot where the 33.3Hz artifact would be and there is no tone above the noise floor. Scale is 5Hz/division and 10dB/division. 1 1
TP1 Posted June 21, 2023 Posted June 21, 2023 On 20/06/2023 at 10:52 PM, Warren Jones said: Sorry for keeping this off topic but I thought this needed a response. Lets put some perspective here. The P3 is a great TT, I haven't had the opportunity to hear one yet, but it's 3 to 4 times the price of an SP10mk2. On the cogging issue yes the SP10 uses a core motor and yes with the platter removed you can see the poles passing the stator slots. Cogging will be reflected in the W&F measurements, W&F specs the P3 is 0.015% and the SP10mk2 is 0.025% using the same JIS standard so the P3 is 100ppm (parts per million) better. The SP10 will cog at 33.3Hz here is a spectrum plot of an SP10mk2 playing a 1kHz tone from the Ultimate Analog Test LP I did a couple of years ago. I've marked on the plot where the 33.3Hz artifact would be and there is no tone above the noise floor. Scale is 5Hz/division and 10dB/division. Expand Fair enough Warren. My point wasn't to bag the SP10 Mk2. I always have been a huge Technics fan and still have their gear. I mentioned it in the context of how much research and development went into the P3 and the fact that I doubt that the modern belt drive turntables have that amount of tech input. Still, Technics did come out with their SP10 MK3 with a new motor and heavier platter that improved things. BTW, I forgot to mention that most of the P3 platter weight is on the periphery, no doubt to maximise the flywheel effect. 3
metal beat Posted August 26, 2023 Posted August 26, 2023 OMA K5. An affordable baby brother to the K3. Bargin price of US 119k sans Schroeder arm I prefer the look over the K3 1 1
stevoz Posted August 27, 2023 Posted August 27, 2023 On 26/08/2023 at 3:05 PM, metal beat said: OMA K5. An affordable baby brother to the K3. Bargin price of US 119k sans Schroeder arm I prefer the look over the K3 Expand Love your sense of humour.....but somehow I don't think you were joking! 1
metal beat Posted August 27, 2023 Posted August 27, 2023 (edited) On 27/08/2023 at 6:27 AM, stevoz said: Love your sense of humour.....but somehow I don't think you were joking! Expand Steve. US 119k on anything other than a house is a rip off. Let alone a turntable!! Edited August 27, 2023 by metal beat 2 1
Ian McP Posted August 27, 2023 Posted August 27, 2023 https://www.coolgales.com/product-category/brands/schroeder/ https://nirvanasound.com/schroder/
Pops110 Posted August 27, 2023 Posted August 27, 2023 On 26/08/2023 at 3:05 PM, metal beat said: OMA K5. An affordable baby brother to the K3. Bargin price of US 119k sans Schroeder arm I prefer the look over the K3 Expand It’s slightly less offensive to the eyes but it’s still fugly. I think he should stick to designing speakers. The Schroeder arms are very cool looking but certainly not cheap. 1
Antipodean Brad Posted September 13, 2023 Posted September 13, 2023 I may be late to the party, but ... https://www.denon.com/en-au/shop/turntable/dp3000ne 10
Guest Posted September 13, 2023 Posted September 13, 2023 On 13/09/2023 at 6:58 AM, Antipodean Brad said: I may be late to the party, but ... https://www.denon.com/en-au/shop/turntable/dp3000ne Expand Was about to post the same thing - very nice!
cafe67 Posted September 13, 2023 Posted September 13, 2023 On 13/09/2023 at 7:07 AM, Hydrology said: Was about to post the same thing - very nice! Expand very scandi chic , and funky looking arm
mattd2308 Posted September 16, 2023 Posted September 16, 2023 On 13/09/2023 at 6:58 AM, Antipodean Brad said: I may be late to the party, but ... https://www.denon.com/en-au/shop/turntable/dp3000ne Expand Obviously just been released. Looks classy as, could be my next TT. 1
Peterbean Posted October 27, 2023 Posted October 27, 2023 On 21/07/2008 at 6:18 AM, 2sheds said: As a follow up to the Titillating Tonearms series, and due to overwhelming demand (Keith_W made a veiled reference in another post), I will now post my follow up - Tanatlising Turntables. Covering the many ways of spinning a 2 cent blob of black vinyl, the turntables or record players, as they were commonly called in Australia will not necessarily be restricted to top end models or current models. Please feel free to add your favourites to the post with the name, whether it is currently available and any notable comments. I will start with my particular favourite. http://www.ayre.com/images/products/DPS_Turntable_image.jpg dps 3 (Price around $10,000) The deceptively simple and elegantly styled dps 3 with Schroeder Model 2 tonearm and outboard (not shown) 3 phase power supply and a plinth made from layered Plexiglas, cork, birch plywood and heavy damping foil on a damped granite base. Make sure you have an alternative as the dps 3 (like all Schroeder tonearms) has a waiting list of around 18 months. cheers 2sheds Expand Are you related to the mythical 2 sheds Jackson? 1
dgau88 Posted November 7, 2023 Posted November 7, 2023 On 17/06/2023 at 12:00 PM, TP1 said: I'm in the P3 camp as well, except that in engineering terms I think it leaves all the other so called exotic turntables for dead. Pioneer discovered the relationship between the drive plane and a high mounted pivot-point, something that other manufacturers like Clearaudio latched on to much later. But Pioneer did the impossible ( no-one has done it since) in that they achieved the design with a very powerful direct drive motor. The P3 motor itself is the closest thing you can get to a linear motor. I know that Onkyo claimed that their PX-100M had a linear motor but take apart a P3 and you will see the most seamless induction setup for a direct drive. Take the platter of a technics SP-10 Mk2 for example and switch the motor on and you will see the motor cog from pole to pole stopping momentarily as it reaches each pole. Of course the platter /flywheel smooths things out once attached but there is still a small amount of the cogging effect left. Remove the platter/flywheel from a P3 and you will see the motor rotate smoothly with perfect equanimity which contributes to the incredibly smooth operation of the system. And given that you have a very powerful direct drive motor - with near as perfect rotational accuracy you also get dramatic transients and bass. The Pioneer design is also free from rumble and rivals the better belt drives in this regard. Finally the unique and dare I say 'over-engineered" approach to acoustic isolation is totally effective. Pioneer still service these machines in Japan and I had my P3a tonearm rebuilt by them . The turntable itself had an overhaul using all new high grade capacitors and conversion to 230V using a potted high capacity Plitron transformer . To me its the perfect high tech platform , all the others look speccy to be sure but they strike me as derivative since no-one it seems but one of the giants in technology can design and produce a powerful direct drive turntable that can beat belt drives at their own game yet bring the advantages of direct drive. The only thing that can be improved upon is the tonearm, not that its bad but for modern cartridges, other tonearms can do it better. The P3a arm is better still but not in the same league as the the new frontrunners. I suspect that is why Groovemaster did their thing because it will allow the P3 to reach new sonic heights with a top line tonearm. I was going down that road with Artisan Fidelity. We had agreed on a design ( mahogany gloss) and price but something didn't quite feel right. I couldn't help thinking it would bastardise a classic so I withdrew from the deal and haven't regretted it. Expand TP1 Totally agreed about the P3 tonearm. I changed the arm and the performance is stunning. Want to try the FFYX air float tonearm and see. Anyone here use the external tonearm base with the P3? Actually, I want to buy a sp-10mk2 with the epa-500, the epa-500 have few armwand that can play different compliance for different cartridge, any one had experience with the epa-500? is it worthwhile to try? 2 1
TP1 Posted November 9, 2023 Posted November 9, 2023 On 07/11/2023 at 3:57 AM, dgau88 said: Actually, I want to buy a sp-10mk2 with the epa-500, the epa-500 have few armwand that can play different compliance for different cartridge, any one had experience with the epa-500? is it worthwhile to try? Expand I still have an EPA -500. It is definitely a first rate tone arm but getting different arm wands might prove to be a bit more difficult. If you get the right wand to match your cartridge you will not be disappointed. The EPA-100 is also a brilliant tonearm and the the rarer EPA-100 MK2 is on an other level.
Antipodean Brad Posted November 9, 2023 Posted November 9, 2023 VPI Dragon. Premiering this weekend at Capitol Audiofest. per monoand&stereo.com 5 1
dgau88 Posted November 9, 2023 Posted November 9, 2023 Just receive the EPA-500 with 4 armwand. still waiting for the technics sp-10 with acrylic plinth. 3 3
mattd2308 Posted December 28, 2023 Posted December 28, 2023 www.denon.jp/ja-jp/blog/12797/index.html Interview with developer Ryo Okaseri about new Denon DP 3000-NE (2 parts) Not a bad read, take knowledge from their previous iterations of their DD TT's in the development. Also, from reading on forums, people critical of it being made in China, he quotes: Okaseri:DP-3000NE is made in China. This is also something that surprised me this time, but the production plant in China made products with a very high degree of precision. The motors, tonearms, platters, and MDF cabinets that I just talked about are of higher quality than we expected. This was a bit beyond my imagination. Their manufacturing technology, including the minimum production number, is truly amazing. It would be difficult to make a record player of this quality at this price in Japan today. 3 1
Ian McP Posted January 19, 2024 Posted January 19, 2024 Bourdereau a French "equivalent to German EMT perhaps? Shame about the music. https://hifivintage.eu/en/collection/5084-bourdereau-td-56-3-.html
Guest Posted February 10, 2024 Posted February 10, 2024 A beautifully reconditioned Pioneer P3 available for sale here (Polish site):- https://www.fryderykdanielczykstore.com/product/gramofon-pioneer-exclusive-p3-classic-vintage-po-calkowitej-rewitalizacji/
metal beat Posted February 11, 2024 Posted February 11, 2024 On 10/02/2024 at 6:24 AM, Hydrology said: A beautifully reconditioned Pioneer P3 available for sale here (Polish site):- https://www.fryderykdanielczykstore.com/product/gramofon-pioneer-exclusive-p3-classic-vintage-po-calkowitej-rewitalizacji/ Expand Wonderful table. Mine has not missed a beat since buying one 15 years ago. 1
cafe67 Posted February 12, 2024 Posted February 12, 2024 (edited) https://hiconsumption.com/tech/brian-eno-turntable-ii/ $20 k tho Edited February 12, 2024 by cafe67 2
2Brix Posted February 18, 2024 Posted February 18, 2024 (edited) oi @cafe67 it's 20,000 quid innit? (so close to $40,000) Edited February 18, 2024 by 2Brix 1
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