Silver vs Copper Interconnects

[Martykt]

58 minutes ago, Bill125812 said:

Bet I bit my lip harder      Some cable makers try to do the right thing 

While your particular situation allows a business model where you can offer better prices that other cable makers may not your obvious integrity and honesty is a great example for anyone in the industry.  

[John0001]

Well I for one am interested to learn about the differences different materials make. I don't really understand why someone who is aggressively anti-cable would waste their time in a cable related thread.

[Martykt]

3 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said:

Why would you read it carefully, it's coughhorshit...

It's always a good skill to look through marketing hyperbole to see what actually is being said.

2 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said:

Keeping a straight face LOL

Why?

It would actually be a good thing for the general public to understand what costs are involved in manufacturing and bringing a product to market and why its rrp price is listed as it is.

[bob_m_54]

1 minute ago, Martykt said:

It's always a good skill to look through marketing hyperbole to see what actually is being said.

Why?

It would actually be a good thing for the general public to understand what costs are involved in manufacturing and bringing a product to market and why its rrp price is listed as it is.

Cable cost for 1M interconnect <$30.00, 2 X Connectors.. go all out $60.00, labour (industrial labour costs for general one off job) $150.00 (and that's generous) marketing.. ?? fark knows, throw a couple of hundred there... Yeah, stretching to go beyond a few hundred, even with the bullshite...

[rantan]

11 minutes ago, Martykt said:

While your particular situation allows a business model where you can offer better prices that other cable makers may not your obvious integrity and honesty is a great example for anyone in the industry.  

..and yet, there is one particular participant in this thread who believes that all cable makers are the enemy (not you @bob_m_54)

[bob_m_54]

14 minutes ago, John0001 said:

Well I for one am interested to learn about the differences different materials make. I don't really understand why someone who is aggressively anti-cable would waste their time in a cable related thread.

Actually, different materials can make a difference. It's just not as profound and magical as some of the manufactures will have you believe.

[Luc]

1 minute ago, rantan said:

are the enemy

Who?(Go on, whisper it)

[rantan]

3 minutes ago, Luc said:

Who?(Go on, whisper it)

Only at 60Db down

[Luc]

1 minute ago, rantan said:

Only at 60Db down

Haha.

 

(Some Saturn love going on elsewhere RT. They don't get much better than them. Bran nu too)

[Martykt]

17 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said:

Cable cost for 1M interconnect <$30.00, 2 X Connectors.. go all out $60.00, labour (industrial labour costs for general one off job) $150.00 (and that's generous) marketing.. ?? fark knows, throw a couple of hundred there... Yeah, stretching to go beyond a few hundred, even with the bullshite...

Now add things like factory costs, other wages associated with the business, taxes, time spent on Research and Development, distribution costs, warranty costs, after service costs, miscellaneous costs... etc.

How many units are you expecting to sell per year?

Then there are questions like where does the product need to be placed in the market to be successful?

[Martykt]

35 minutes ago, rantan said:

..and yet, there is one particular participant in this thread who believes that all cable makers are the enemy (not you @bob_m_54)

Yes there definitely are those who believe all cable makers are pedlars of snake oil and the enemy and quite often speaks of their own psychology than it does of the industry.

The truth is many cable manufacturers are just people like you and I who are just trying to make a living by in this particular situation making cables that they consider better than a basic cheap cable.

 

[Metal-Fan]

1 hour ago, Martykt said:

Yes there definitely are those who believe all cable makers are pedlars of snake oil

Let me clarify. I did say "boutique Cable" makers. To me that means the obvious culprits but perhaps in hindsight I should have made that point a little more clearly.

 

I know that there are plenty of honest hard working cable makers that do not charge an arm and a leg.

 

I have cables from some of these makers and they were very well priced. I purchased them because they look good and you know they are made properly (which costs very little) and I didn't get ripped off.

 

Did they sound better than any of the stock cables supplied - no, of course not.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 26, 2020 by oldf%$ker

[bob_m_54]

1 hour ago, Martykt said:

Now add things like factory costs, other wages associated with the business, taxes, time spent on Research and Development, distribution costs, warranty costs, after service costs, miscellaneous costs... etc.

How many units are you expecting to sell per year?

Then there are questions like where does the product need to be placed in the market to be successful?

Yeah, I can see where you're coming from. It sounds like a poorly thought out business strategy doesn't it?

 

I mean if a supermarket egg costs 50c and a free range egg costs 60c and an organic egg costs 70c, how much should we expect to pay for the golden egg? Without having to cover the costs of finding, feeding and keeping the goose that layed it?

[Martykt]

13 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said:

Yeah, I can see where you're coming from. It sounds like a poorly thought out business strategy doesn't it?

It's not necessarily a bad business strategy, it just has to remembered that audiophile cables are a niche luxury product which as a result will have a small turnover and the business model needs to be based on this.
 

A small manufacturer obviously can't compete in price with mass produced cables made in China so so instead need to try and offer a much higher quality product with the understanding that it will be more expensive that offers value in other ways.

[Martykt]

29 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said:

I mean if a supermarket egg costs 50c and a free range egg costs 60c and an organic egg costs 70c, how much should we expect to pay for the golden egg? Without having to cover the costs of finding, feeding and keeping the goose that layed it?

Shouldn't that be a Silver Egg ??  

[keinesorge]

29 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said:

 

I mean if a supermarket egg costs 50c and a free range egg costs 60c and an organic egg costs 70c, how much should we expect to pay for the golden egg? Without having to cover the costs of finding, feeding and keeping the goose that layed it?

If the golden egg is the sakra v12, then it’s $12,000 for the first meter and $7600 for every meter extra.  
 

http://www.stealthaudiocables.com/products/analog-interconnects/sakra-v12/
 

it probably sounds very nice. 

[Metal-Fan]

11 hours ago, keinesorge said:

it probably sounds very nice. 

Of course it would. It has -  Ultra low energy storage dielectric: STEALTH para-vacuum*** (Helium gas) + porous - i.e. foam-like Teflon. The Helium dielectric, combined with the multicore geometry, are the MAIN technical advantages of the Śakra, compare to the Indra. Porous Teflon has the lowest dielectric constant of all solid and semi-solid materials. Low dielectric constant = low energy storage = low distortion = fast sound. Helium gas dielectric properties is much better than even porous Teflon, better than air, and better than realistic (commercial) vacuum.

 

[ray4410]

one man's interconnect is trash another man's interconnect is his treasure 

[John0001]

To the general population anything more than a Bose cube or a pair of white Apple buds is complete madness. Just being on this forum puts you in a very small demographic who are perceived as, well, nuts. The degree of nuts just depends on your wallet. It's the same as any 'hobby'.

And for the record Silver and Copper conductors do sound different. 

[Decky]

"Helium dielectric" - seriously!!! This is beyond Trump stupid - that statement is black hole level stupid (no offence to any legitimate black holes out there - they are decent hard-working gravity...things). 

 

Helium cannot be contained even in cryostats for long periods of time due to its ability to diffuse through seals and leak-out. 

[BLAH BLAH]

32 minutes ago, Decky said:

"Helium dielectric" - seriously!!! This is beyond Trump stupid - that statement is black hole level stupid (no offence to any legitimate black holes out there - they are decent hard-working gravity...things). 

 

Helium cannot be contained even in cryostats for long periods of time due to its ability to diffuse through seals and leak-out. 

Even in powdered form?!? 

[Decky]

29 minutes ago, BLAH BLAH said:

Even in powdered form?!? 

Yeah - the powdered form is only created when you cool unicorn farts down to 1K. You can then collect that and sprinkle on your tweeters to get more HF clarity.

[Metal-Fan]

Man I just took a look at this thread -

 

"Ethernet cables for audio"

 

Those guys are getting ripped big time.

 

"With Ethernet the data either gets through the cable without any changes to it, or it does not get through at all. Ethernet has a checksum on every data packet to detect for any errors (which are rare) in the transmission and all the packets that have data changed in any any way are discarded and resent. So Ethernet cable can not not magically slightly alter the digital sound that goes through the cable."

 

Have you seen what some dodgy rip off assholes are charging for these!! People are buying them.

Edited September 27, 2020 by oldf%$ker

[muon*]

[Martykt]

4 hours ago, Decky said:

"Helium dielectric" - seriously!!! This is beyond Trump stupid - that statement is black hole level stupid (no offence to any legitimate black holes out there - they are decent hard-working gravity...things). 

 

Helium cannot be contained even in cryostats for long periods of time due to its ability to diffuse through seals and leak-out. 

Yeah sounds like they might have needed to do a bit more research on that part of the design...

 

My guess is the main advantage of this cable is the use of a non-crystalline metal for its conductor which is a curious idea.

 

I'm a bit unsure about their idea about  skin effect causing harshness in the upper midrange and treble though, there are plenty of cables that use larger gauge conductors which don't show this trait.