4 minutes ago, ICUToo said:

Solidsteel racks, El Tel?

 

No. Bespoke birch racks from @SonicArt

 

These are beautiful.

 

Delrin spacers to enable each shelf to float free of the legs.

 

I'm just gently tightening everything up and sorting the level.

Next up will be sorting power amd populating the rack with kit. Busy day here... 🥵

they look good.

Let us know if they sound any different

 

3 hours ago, ICUToo said:

they look good.

Let us know if they sound any different

 

 

For digital, not so much difference that I can notice. For vinyl, yes. It has shown me how poor my previous setup was. Bass frequencies have tightened-up. For the improvement on the vinyl, it's worth the price of entry (which was quite modest in comparison to some of the usual suspects on the market). These racks are good value, the quality is much higher than the price-point would suggest. It just goes to back-up my mantra that cost alone is no arbiter of outcomes.

 

@SonicArt - thank you - your OCD and diligence has produced something quite special.

Looking good, I like the pic in the vinyl spinning thread, its all come together nicely!

I noticed with the same rack in my room the digital had more harmonic detail, at first it seemed like bass was slightly reduced but I think it was more a mental artifact. I feel shelves around the 24-26mm range are the best choice for a more lively room, and the 18-20 size may provide a little less damping and more suited to well damped, carpeted etc rooms. I will be interested to see what you find by adjusting the tension of the legs, gently tight together vs really tight together, knowing how this affects tonearm mounts it will be interesting to see if you notice changes, yours are the first with Delrin footers, not spikes.

3 minutes ago, SonicArt said:

Looking good, I like the pic in the vinyl spinning thread, its all come together nicely!

I noticed with the same rack in my room the digital had more harmonic detail, at first it seemed like bass was slightly reduced but I think it was more a mental artifact. I feel shelves around the 24-26mm range are the best choice for a more lively room, and the 18-20 size may provide a little less damping and more suited to well damped, carpeted etc rooms. I will be interested to see what you find by adjusting the tension of the legs, gently tight together vs really tight together, knowing how this affects tonearm mounts it will be interesting to see if you notice changes, yours are the first with Delrin footers, not spikes.

 

I'm finding the vinyl nothing short of transcendental right now. It honestly sounds like I dropped over 10 grand on a new TT/cart; I don't want to mess with it as it is sounding so natural. Mrs Tel walked in and commented that everything is just a tiny bit tighter and more focused. The cartridge seems to be tracking faster and more accurately than before and I assume that is the Delrin separators doing their thing.

 

The new location for the TT in the room from months ago is also rotated 90 degrees and moved away from an are where the floor had a 2 degree slope for the last 3 metres into the corner. Now it is on a pretty flat section of floor and along with the very minimal Delrin footer adjustments to level the whole unit, the MoFi Ultradeck adjustable feet needed only 2-3 turns on 2 corners to get the spirit level bang-on.

Congratulations on the new listening space Tel.

 

Along with everything else in the room, the new racks from @SonicArt look terrific. Now that some "other things" are finally in the process of getting sorted, I am hoping to finally get some decisions made in the near future, about what will be my last system.

Some of those Sonic Art racks  look like they would be a great part of the final product, so hopefully in the near future I too can place an order for some Sonic Art racks. 

 

All the best,

Paul. 

14 minutes ago, parrasaw said:

Congratulations on the new listening space Tel.

 

Along with everything else in the room, the new racks from @SonicArt look terrific. Now that some "other things" are finally in the process of getting sorted, I am hoping to finally get some decisions made in the near future, about what will be my last system.

Some of those Sonic Art racks  look like they would be a great part of the final product, so hopefully in the near future I too can place an order for some Sonic Art racks. 

 

All the best,

Paul. 

 

Thanks, Paul. Still have some tweaks to come including acoustic treatments to dial-out some of the detrimental effects of the room, but it is getting closer to end-game environment at which point it is just down to kit changes from thereon.

 

Mark at SonicArt has been an awesome partner on this journey, Paul. He hasn't just flogged me some kit and left me to it; he's been in constant contact over the last two days helping me fine tune everything. Mark is very OCD (we're kindred spirits!) and wants the same outcomes that you would want; he will not rest until he is satisfied and that will likely be at a tighter tolerance and acceptance criteria than most people you could meet.

Some significant changes in the pipe-line here at Wongaburra.

 

It looks like I will be setting sail upon the seas of Dirac Live Bass Control. After being married to the concept of pure analogue from the pre onwards for a long time, I am going to relent. Progress in the DSP space now has more value in my eyes than the purist approach I held for such a long time; put simply, the best steps I can make in my system now is how I make up for the room itself and DSP is mature and good enough for me to trust it and expand my horizons.

 

Naturally this has had me take a long hard Paddington-Bear-stare at everything else in the preamp and power amps arena and as a consequence there may well be some rationalisation to come so watch the classifieds...

5 hours ago, El Tel said:

Naturally this has had me take a long hard Paddington-Bear-stare at everything else in the preamp and power amps arena and as a consequence there may well be some rationalisation to come so watch the classifieds...

What are your initial thoughts, Tel?

2 minutes ago, Bisguittin said:

What are your initial thoughts, Tel?

 

I'm aiming at Arcam for the new pre and a pair of monoblocks I think.

 

This potentially means that the McIntosh MA352 and the Lumin T2 could be moving on. I'm going to test the solution with new kit before doing anything though. Been guilty of trading-out stuff that I ought to have kept in the past.

@El TelI'm aiming at Arcam for the new pre and a pair of monoblocks I think.

 

I was thinking the same thing after reading about their new processors, seems a no brainer with all the tech and

I'm only talking about 2 channel.

Maybe Arcam's PA240 will be enough for your scenario Tel, it will be probably come back to musical preference as well.

5 minutes ago, maximus said:

I was thinking the same thing after reading about their new processors, seems a no brainer with all the tech and

I'm only talking about 2 channel.

I've totally swallowed the koolaid on running a HT processor with Dirac Live, Bass Control (and soon to be ART). So much so that I have a circa $60k MSB DAC sitting idle in my shelf as I run Roon direct from my AV pre.

 

Running multiple subs, Bass Control is nothing short of incredible. I reran my measurements the other night and my in room measured response with twin subs and my mains for 2 channel listening is looking (and sounding) great. I'm excited to see how much better I can get this. I expect that the dip I have around 60 Hz is a room mode and ART may help that out. *note this is with a Harman +6dB target curve applied in Dirac.

 

4 hours ago, BugPowderDust said:

I've totally swallowed the koolaid on running a HT processor with Dirac Live, Bass Control (and soon to be ART). So much so that I have a circa $60k MSB DAC sitting idle in my shelf as I run Roon direct from my AV pre.

 

Running multiple subs, Bass Control is nothing short of incredible. I reran my measurements the other night and my in room measured response with twin subs and my mains for 2 channel listening is looking (and sounding) great. I'm excited to see how much better I can get this. I expect that the dip I have around 60 Hz is a room mode and ART may help that out. *note this is with a Harman +6dB target curve applied in Dirac.

 

 

I don't want to turn this into a Dirac Live thread but what I've found using it is that is that one can somewhat shape the target curve to will to get a flatter frequency response measured in REW. I've read of some criticism of Dirac Live that it doesn't measure low bass frequencies slow enough which may or may not contribute to the less than perfect measured corrected response in some cases, such as yours and such as mine. Regardless, like I mentioned previously I've shaped the target curve to improve the frequency response as measured by REW and you could do this as well. In the example above you could shape the target curve to counter that 60-80Hz dip and then measure again with REW. I found I had to do this a few times to get a more even measured corrected response.

Edited March 31, 20232 yr by Satanica

8 minutes ago, Satanica said:

In the example above you could shape the target curve to counter that 60-80Hz dip and then measure again with REW. I found I had to do this a few times to get a more even measured corrected response.

Well worth exploring. I do know that I have nulls at about 60 and 120 Hz in the main listening position, but so far Dirac has managed to iron out the 120 Hz better than the 60 Hz. 

22 minutes ago, BugPowderDust said:

Well worth exploring. I do know that I have nulls at about 60 and 120 Hz in the main listening position, but so far Dirac has managed to iron out the 120 Hz better than the 60 Hz. 

 

Yeah, if you were to shape the target curve in response to some dips and notice that the corrected measured response doesn't change accordingly then you would know that they are nulls and so most likely it would not be worthwhile to keep applying this correction.

Edited March 31, 20232 yr by Satanica

4 hours ago, Satanica said:

I don't want to turn this into a Dirac Live thread

 

I am more than happy to give the subject a little latitude within this thread. After all, I've been reticent to get on board with room correction DSP and now it has reached the point of maturity and no small amount of plaudits, I am going to give this a fair crack. When someone with extensive experience tests the capabilities and suggests it has made $50k of DAC they had been using pretty much redundant, then you sit up and take notice.

 

Whilst I am sure this whole thing is nowhere near its full potential, the fact that Dirac Live Bass Control is now so good, and that we have a rapidly approaching evolution to Dirac Active Room Treatment providing the next gen of functionality and performance, for me, it's time to jump in. It feels like we are at an inflexion point and it is quite exciting.

15 hours ago, El Tel said:

When someone with extensive experience tests the capabilities and suggests it has made $50k of DAC they had been using pretty much redundant, then you sit up and take notice.

 

I'm another convert, having recently dropped the exclusively 2-ch high-end components out of my chain and using the Multichannel Pre for source handling and, of course, introducing Dirac Live (which also enabled the option of engaging my 2 x 18" subs for 2-ch listening) to my system. I think you make a good point in that the electronics of the mainstream have caught up, and DSP has most certainly matured now.

 

Look forward to reading about your ongoing journey.

Are you still planning on proceeding with the acoustic treatment or just relying on DSP as the complete "silver bullet" solution?

 

9 minutes ago, Marc said:

the electronics of the mainstream have caught up, and DSP has most certainly matured now.

 

Yep. I have been labelled as dogmatic (what, me?! NO!) in the past and I have been clinging to my analogue purity mantra. Time to let that go. Exciting times.

Edited March 31, 20232 yr by El Tel

Still room for tubes?

5 minutes ago, Hydrology said:

Are you still planning on proceeding with the acoustic treatment or just relying on DSP as the complete "silver bullet" solution?

 

 

The acoustic treatments are absolutely happening. The Dirac LBC will have an easier time of it if I do the right basics first. Plus, if it doesn't end up being as good as I hope and/or I decide to go in a different direction, then the panels are there from the get-go.

 

Foundations first, tinsel and baubles second.

Just now, Bisguittin said:

Still room for tubes?

 

I'm not sure how that will play with Dirac, but because that is switchable and I am a relentless tinkerer, then I see tubes being something I will continue to court, even if the MA352 is no longer in the picture. It's too much fun not to. I'll work them in over the fullness of time, even if only for the experiments.

43 minutes ago, Hydrology said:

Are you still planning on proceeding with the acoustic treatment or just relying on DSP as the complete "silver bullet" solution?

 

I have heard the benefits which 'acoustic treatment' brings to a DSP'd system (of course, @Ittaku had to redo his DSP after the room treatment!).  

 

So DSP is certainly not all you need, for perfection.

 

On 01/04/2023 at 11:03 AM, andyr said:

 

I have heard the benefits which 'acoustic treatment' brings to a DSP'd system (of course, @Ittaku had to redo his DSP after the room treatment!).  

 

So DSP is certainly not all you need, for perfection.

 

 

 

As I said:

On 01/04/2023 at 10:23 AM, El Tel said:

The acoustic treatments are absolutely happening. The Dirac LBC will have an easier time of it if I do the right basics first.

 

They are just going to take a while for manufacturing and shipping.

 

Meanwhile:

WOW!, no mucking around here.