Kii Audio Owners and Discussion Thread

[TerryO]

9 minutes ago, Snoopy8 said:

I missed this.  Did you actually have a Statement to compare or are you speculating?

 

No I'm not speculating, before receiving both recently I asked the the distributor how they compare and he has a Statement.

 

 

* edit.

 

Just to clarify I wasn't saying with a Phoenix added to a Zenith you have a Statement, it was obviously a play on words, however from what I was told its pretty close.

 

cheers,

Terry

Edited February 7, 2021 by TerryO

[Ray H]

 

 

15 minutes ago, TerryO said:

 

No I'm not speculating, before receiving both recently I asked the the distributor how they compare and he has a Statement.

 

 

* edit.

 

Just to clarify I wasn't saying with a Phoenix added to a Zenith you have a Statement, it was obviously a play on words, however from what I was told its pretty close.

 

cheers,

Terry

Aarrrgggghhhhh!

 

Thats really not something I really needed to hear Terry, my arm can be so easily twisted.

 

You have well and truly piqued my interest in the Phoenix now, thanks so much.
 

Edit - @TerryO can you explain what elements are improved ?

Edited February 7, 2021 by Ray H

[TerryO]

2 hours ago, Ray H said:

 

 

Aarrrgggghhhhh!

 

Thats really not something I really needed to hear Terry, my arm can be so easily twisted.

 

You have well and truly piqued my interest in the Phoenix now, thanks so much.
 

Edit - @TerryO can you explain what elements are improved ?

How about this Ray, rather than me tell you what improvements it made in my system how about if you are happy to pay for couriers and insurance both ways then I’m happy to ship it to you to try out for a week. Then if it doesn’t do the job you won’t have to invest in one to find out. ...

 

cheers,

Terry

Edited February 7, 2021 by TerryO

[Ray H]

25 minutes ago, TerryO said:

How about this Ray, rather than me tell you what improvements it made in my system how about if you are happy to pay for couriers and insurance both ways then I’m happy to ship it to you to try out for a week. Then if it doesn’t do the job you won’t have to invest in one to find out. ...

 

cheers,

Terry

Very thoughtful and generous offer Terry, most appreciated. Pm to coordinate sent.

[wikeeboy]

On 06/02/2021 at 11:49 PM, gibbo9000 said:

Congratulations on the RCM, and bugger on the teething problems.  You have taken the same steps I use when using the XLR Analog Inputs. 

Quick thoughts - you changed the XLR input setting to analogue in the Kii Controller, rather than on the speakers (as the Controller overrides)? And it isn't a balanced / single ended setting issue on the RCM?

2m Black settings sound OK - it will go over the 5.0mv but not enough for a slight reduction in gain to handle. 

 

Thanks for the reply @gibbo9000 All settings in the Kii were correct. Unfortunately it seems the Sensor's gain at 5.0mv is too high clipping the kii's input. 

[gibbo9000]

1 hour ago, wikeeboy said:

Unfortunately it seems the Sensor's gain at 5.0mv is too high clipping the kii's input

Can't find a spec anywhere on what full scale voltage the Kii's expect on XLR / Analogue, but I expect standard around 2.0 Volts.  Based on my somewhat convoluted experience it is possible the 2m Black / Sensor could be significantly over that.
When experimenting with ADC's, here was one of my experiences:

• 2m Black (5.0 mV Full Scale spec) via Phone Preamp (fixed Gain spec of 1.7mV in for 200mV out - I extrapolated to 5.0mV in for 600mV out)
• Using the Uwe Beis ADC calibrated for 2 Volt Full Scale input I expected to be well 'under' volume on the output side given expected 600mV from Phono Preamp - but the ADC reported heavy clipping.
• To stop the clipping I had to wind the expected Full Scale input voltage of the ADC out to 3 Volts -  with that all was fine
• That all implies the voltages out the cartridge / preamp were up to 5 times higher than I read from specs . . . .

That could cause Kii ADCs to clip - but I would have thought reducing the Sensor's expected input voltage from 5.0mV to 0.9mV would bring it under control without sacrificing quality . .

Edited February 8, 2021 by gibbo9000

[gibbo9000]

On 01/02/2021 at 8:42 PM, Snoopy8 said:

Am using Iso Pucks under the speakers and they do make a difference by removing smearing, thus enhancing detail.

 

Following your discussion last week I thought I would give the Iso Pucks a go.  Must admit I was a little sceptical I would hear any demonstrable difference, but I am amazed.  Completely agree with @Snoopy8 view - but would would put the impact in the 10 - 15% range.  A real tightening and sharpening of detail and positioning.

 

Mine are on the Kii Stands filled with sand blasting grit, using spikes through carpet to concrete slab.

 

Gibbo

[Snoopy8]

3 minutes ago, gibbo9000 said:

Mine are on the Kii Stands filled with sand blasting grit, using spikes through carpet to concrete slab.

The ISO Pucks are certainly a cost effective way to reduce smearing. Together with other things, I now have a soundstage that is large and precise, yet musical.

 

My stands are not filled, sitting on timber laid on concrete slab. 

[wikeeboy]

On 08/02/2021 at 1:36 PM, gibbo9000 said:

Can't find a spec anywhere on what full scale voltage the Kii's expect on XLR / Analogue, but I expect standard around 2.0 Volts.  Based on my somewhat convoluted experience it is possible the 2m Black / Sensor could be significantly over that.
When experimenting with ADC's, here was one of my experiences:

• 2m Black (5.0 mV Full Scale spec) via Phone Preamp (fixed Gain spec of 1.7mV in for 200mV out - I extrapolated to 5.0mV in for 600mV out)
• Using the Uwe Beis ADC calibrated for 2 Volt Full Scale input I expected to be well 'under' volume on the output side given expected 600mV from Phono Preamp - but the ADC reported heavy clipping.
• To stop the clipping I had to wind the expected Full Scale input voltage of the ADC out to 3 Volts -  with that all was fine
• That all implies the voltages out the cartridge / preamp were up to 5 times higher than I read from specs . . . .

That could cause Kii ADCs to clip - but I would have thought reducing the Sensor's expected input voltage from 5.0mV to 0.9mV would bring it under control without sacrificing quality . .

 

Thanks for the rundown mate. I've found some specs and the gain at 5.0mv is 55db which is way over the usual 40db, and there is now way to reduce the gain any further. New cart required

 

[wikeeboy]

Comparison of Heavenly Soundworks, Buchardt, D&D, and Kii.

 

https://audiophilestyle.com/ca/reviews/review-heavenly-soundworks-five17-r984/

[Snoopy8]

9 hours ago, wikeeboy said:

Comparison of Heavenly Soundworks, Buchardt, D&D, and Kii.

 

https://audiophilestyle.com/ca/reviews/review-heavenly-soundworks-five17-r984/

Thank you. But oh no, that Bob again!  He seems to go with the wind, with gushing reviews each time he finds a new setup.  I think he does not know what sound he likes, hence, wild swings in opinion at each review, contradicting previous reviews.

[Jventer]

33 minutes ago, Snoopy8 said:

Thank you. But oh no, that Bob again!  He seems to go with the wind, with gushing reviews each time he finds a new setup.  I think he does not know what sound he likes, hence, wild swings in opinion at each review, contradicting previous reviews.

I would suggest reading the review, it includes various speakers (not just one)

[Snoopy8]

56 minutes ago, Jventer said:

I would suggest reading the review, it includes various speakers (not just one)

I have read all his reviews, in their entirety, and many of his posts. He gushes a lot. Firstly, he loved his Kii Three to bits, then A500 and now Heavenly Soundworks, all in a matter of months.

 

His style is not to my liking...  

 

[frednork]

I found the review a bit difficult to really understand the differences as it seems a bit contradictory and doesnt really  tell me what to expect.  Am a bit confused in a comparison on the bass with the 4 speakers mentioned.  The thing that is clear is that he liked them for their rightness but in the end that doesn't tell me much.

 

 I suspect there will be many of these type of speakers from small manufacturers that challenge or eclipse the performance of the more established companies but to me the value equation starts to become about longevity as these are essentially all in one proprietary systems that may/may not be supported in (possibly very few) years to come.  

[cazzesman]

On 10/02/2021 at 9:14 PM, gibbo9000 said:

 

Following your discussion last week I thought I would give the Iso Pucks a go.  Must admit I was a little sceptical I would hear any demonstrable difference, but I am amazed.  Completely agree with @Snoopy8 view - but would would put the impact in the 10 - 15% range.  A real tightening and sharpening of detail and positioning.

 

Mine are on the Kii Stands filled with sand blasting grit, using spikes through carpet to concrete slab.

 

Gibbo

 

Hiho Gibbo & Snoopy8,

 

My Kii 3's are on their stands filled with sand and spiked to a hardwood floor (with protection disc's)   My Kii's actually sit on a 10 ml compressed rubber mat.

 

Did you have anything between the speaker and top plate prior to the introduction of the ISO pucks?

 

The Kii3 s weigh in at 19kg so what range of ISO puck did you use?

 

Regards Cazzesman

 

 

[Snoopy8]

17 minutes ago, cazzesman said:

 

Hiho Gibbo & Snoopy8,

 

My Kii 3's are on their stands filled with sand and spiked to a hardwood floor (with protection disc's)   My Kii's actually sit on a 10 ml compressed rubber mat.

 

Did you have anything between the speaker and top plate prior to the introduction of the ISO pucks?

 

The Kii3 s weigh in at 19kg so what range of ISO puck did you use?

 

Regards Cazzesman

Each ISO Puck can take 9 kg. In theory, can use just 3, but for stability, I use 4.  They come in a box of 2, so will need 4 boxes.

 

I was previously using Isoacoustics Aperta stands, leftover from my previous setup, but they are too tall.  My Kii stands are not filled.

[gibbo9000]

20 minutes ago, Snoopy8 said:

Each ISO Puck can take 9 kg. In theory, can use just 3, but for stability, I use 4.

Same here - 4 x ISO Puck per speaker.  Didn't have anything between stands and speakers before.other than the standard rubber strip on stands.  I found it a bit hairy getting the pucks under the speakers - a few weird angles and ultimately a call out to the wife to help for help!! Would feel very exposed with 3 per speaker

 

Edited February 13, 2021 by gibbo9000

[gibbo9000]

Hey All, 

There is a great discussion to be had around our views, perspectives, and third party reviews of the emerging 'High End' active scene - D&D, Kii, Buchardt etc.  It is great to see the evolution in technology and lower price options entering the scene. 

But we risk completely diverting the Kii owner's thread if we keep it here - so I suggest we create an 'Emerging Active Speaker - SCR, Kii, Buchardt, D&D, Soundworks' thread and move the broader discussion there.  May also round up some other threads on similar themes.  Is it close enough to be an Owner's Discussion to keep under Speakers Owners or does it belong up a level?

Gibbo.

[Snoopy8]

22 minutes ago, gibbo9000 said:

Hey All, 

There is a great discussion to be had around our views, perspectives, and third party reviews of the emerging 'High End' active scene - D&D, Kii, Buchardt etc.  It is great to see the evolution in technology and lower price options entering the scene. 

But we risk completely diverting the Kii owner's thread if we keep it here - so I suggest we create an 'Emerging Active Speaker - SCR, Kii, Buchardt, D&D, Soundworks' thread and move the broader discussion there.  May also round up some other threads on similar themes.  Is it close enough to be an Owner's Discussion to keep under Speakers Owners or does it belong up a level?

Gibbo.

Good idea.  Suggest you create a new thread. As the OP of both threads, you can then request the Mods to shift posts..

[cazzesman]

https://www.clarkrubber.com.au/collections/rubber/products/19426p-anti-slip-rubber-matting

 

I have been using this under my Kii 3's.  I thought it was 10 mil but it is 6.

 

Regards Cazzesman

Edited February 13, 2021 by cazzesman

[gibbo9000]

3 hours ago, gibbo9000 said:

Hey All, 

There is a great discussion to be had around our views, perspectives, and third party reviews of the emerging 'High End' active scene - D&D, Kii, Buchardt etc.  It is great to see the evolution in technology and lower price options entering the scene. 

But we risk completely diverting the Kii owner's thread if we keep it here - so I suggest we create an 'Emerging Active Speaker - SCR, Kii, Buchardt, D&D, Soundworks' thread and move the broader discussion there.  May also round up some other threads on similar themes.  Is it close enough to be an Owner's Discussion to keep under Speakers Owners or does it belong up a level?

Gibbo.

 

New thread started - feel free to add your views to kick things off. 

 

[Snoopy8]

Decided to revisit my settings.  Thought people will be interested in the impact of changing the boundary settings. For non-owners, you can adjust the boundary setting depending on how close the speakers are to the wall and corner.  Set to -12 at corner, -6 near wall, 0 free standing.  The blue line is -6, red is 0 which is what I am using in my family room, largely untreated.

 

 

I do not have the BXT module (and will not get it past the front door if I tried!).  Has anyone measured the Kii Three with and without the BXT?

[gibbo9000]

Just noticed a new firmware release for Kii Control as of 19 March - anyone tried it?  Seems to be mainly about simplifying the Menu structure, but I haven;t tried it or got my head around the changes outlined.

Gibbo

[Snoopy8]

Have more measurements & tweaks for my setup here.

 

[TerryO]

Just fitted some bass traps today, now I actually know how they look and the sonic improvement they deliver in that room I will order the same again for the rear wall corners, then I'll do the wall treatments.

The TV room is a sonic disaster and I will not always have the Kii's in there to off set the rooms deficiencies, as I intend to cycle them with the ATC's and Fyne’s between the two rooms so treatment is definitely required.  

 

... cheers

Edited March 27, 2021 by TerryO