On 12/10/2019 at 6:42 PM, agelessgoodguy said:

Have a chat to Cherry Energy or PM me for a contact, only do high quality installs. As for rebates make sure your energy supplier gives you at least 0.20 / KW/hr ok.

Very well noted and thank you sharing the the info. 

How much should one be paying for a 13kw system?

 

  I see them advertised now for just under 6k.

 

 Yet others are over double at 13k for JA Solar panels and Sungrow inverters as one example.

 

Hard to comprehend that panels and inverters with similar specs can vary so much.

Edited January 24, 20233 yr by metal beat

If you work from home, or retired, and have a battery or better yet an EV with bi-directional charging (not many yet, Nissan Leaf, Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV, Ford E-150) AND your state has approved V2H/V2G charger & install such as SA I’d be looking to purchase a set-up which incorporates the EV & V2H. Don’t purchase a house battery. 
Also, if the V2H/G and EV is too expensive, or, state hasn’t yet approved this but you spend a lot of time at home during the day then look at a battery install and consider a Wholesale Power supply like Amber. We use their SmartShift program, and being retired/at home a lot we now use a lot more energy in the daytime (I.e main meal in daytime) /charge up battery when solar is producing heaps, or energy supply costs are low or even -ve (which means we get credit). Hot water is heated via solar or grid, stove is induction, heating and cooling is reverse cycle AC,,,,,, blah blah blah. 
Just need to put more insulation in the ceiling. 
Currently looking at bi-directional charging and an EV as this has just become a reality in SA although approval is still on a one-by-one approval  process.  Progress takes time , and, if you want to be at the pointy end it unfortunately costs. 

2 hours ago, frankn said:

If you work from home, or retired, and have a battery or better yet an EV with bi-directional charging (not many yet, Nissan Leaf, Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV, Ford E-150) AND your state has approved V2H/V2G charger & install such as SA I’d be looking to purchase a set-up which incorporates the EV & V2H. Don’t purchase a house battery. 
Also, if the V2H/G and EV is too expensive, or, state hasn’t yet approved this but you spend a lot of time at home during the day then look at a battery install and consider a Wholesale Power supply like Amber. We use their SmartShift program, and being retired/at home a lot we now use a lot more energy in the daytime (I.e main meal in daytime) /charge up battery when solar is producing heaps, or energy supply costs are low or even -ve (which means we get credit). Hot water is heated via solar or grid, stove is induction, heating and cooling is reverse cycle AC,,,,,, blah blah blah. 
Just need to put more insulation in the ceiling. 
Currently looking at bi-directional charging and an EV as this has just become a reality in SA although approval is still on a one-by-one approval  process.  Progress takes time , and, if you want to be at the pointy end it unfortunately costs. 

Just remember it’s “bi-directional”.  So on demand the grid will call for to use the battery storage in you EV, this usually involves during the night,  I hope it allows you to set the levels that you want,  not all EVs will be at home charging during the day,  it’s usually you go home and do the charging during the night.   Great concept that gives alternate options and to utilised the EV battery.

11 hours ago, metal beat said:

How much should one be paying for a 13kw system?

 

  I see them advertised now for just under 6k.

 

 Yet others are over double at 13k for JA Solar panels and Sungrow inverters as one example.

 

Hard to comprehend that panels and inverters with similar specs can vary so much.

when you compare specs,  go for products that suit your needs, especially the environment you’re in,   If you live on costal areas, you’ll obviously need PV that can stand salt exposures and wind tolerance,  usually LG panels will fit the bill here.   If you’re like me, 5-20km from the coast line,  there is little need for that capability.   
Inverters will depend on your environment, whether you have tree shade extra.  Either way always opt for panels that are 1/2 cells, this ensures if shade falls on one part of the panel(top to bottom). The other 1/2 will still operate.   If you have plenty of shade, I’d go for micro inverters or optimisers,  this will give you the best outcome however it gets expensive.    With  micro inverters stick to the known brands,  that also go with string inverters.    I can’t give you a figure on 16kw,  that’s something you have to discussed with the players out there in this field, however note that most will not survive after the state gov incentive disappears. 

3 hours ago, Addicted to music said:

Just remember it’s “bi-directional”.  So on demand the grid will call for to use the battery storage in you EV, this usually involves during the night,  I hope it allows you to set the levels that you want,  not all EVs will be at home charging during the day,  it’s usually you go home and do the charging during the night.   Great concept that gives alternate options and to utilised the EV battery.

Yes, correct. But we are retired so the car is around most of the time, and, we already have a house battery. 
The wholesale pricing is good if you can be flexible on the time of use with energy. 
And, we get credit if we use the grid when the price is -ve which is usually in summer/shoulder months/11am-3pm when there is already a lot of renewables going into the grid. 

I just saw the thread title "Solar System Recommendation" and clicked on it thinking we were discussing alternate places to live as a result of faster-than-light travel!

 

Edited January 28, 20233 yr by Hydrology

I have a 4.6Kwh Solar system in the north of UK and after 4 years I added a Powervault battery system 8 KWh

This didn’t last the day so last month I added another 4 KWh and 12 seems to have hit the sweet spot even though it’s only just hit Spring in the UK and my Solar-production isn’t high yet.

 

Now I can run my house inc Hot Tub entirely off the Solar and batteries.

until 10.30pm when I can recharge the battery using low cost Electricity then 7.30am the new day cycle repeats.

 I was lucky and bought the. 8 Kwh battery system at a discounted price £3500 and the extra 4 KWh another £3500

my Solar paid for itself in 5 years with the fit payment alone.

 

Extra saving using power as the Solar is produced helps as does the Older UK meters that run in reverse when Solar is produced.

The Energy supplier know this as they pay us the fit payments but don’t do anything to move us to smart meters.

 

12 hours ago, Barthog24 said:

I have a 4.6Kwh Solar system in the north of UK and after 4 years I added a Powervault battery system 8 KWh

This didn’t last the day so last month I added another 4 KWh and 12 seems to have hit the sweet spot even though it’s only just hit Spring in the UK and my Solar-production isn’t high yet.

 

Now I can run my house inc Hot Tub entirely off the Solar and batteries.

until 10.30pm when I can recharge the battery using low cost Electricity then 7.30am the new day cycle repeats.

 I was lucky and bought the. 8 Kwh battery system at a discounted price £3500 and the extra 4 KWh another £3500

my Solar paid for itself in 5 years with the fit payment alone.

 

Extra saving using power as the Solar is produced helps as does the Older UK meters that run in reverse when Solar is produced.

The Energy supplier know this as they pay us the fit payments but don’t do anything to move us to smart meters.

 

You’re lucky. In Sydney we get moved to smart meters for “free”. 

I had a 5kW system installed about 8 years ago.  SMA SunnyBoy 5000TL single phase inverter and 20 panels (can't remember the brand but made in Singapore) configured in 2 x 10 panel arrays on the north side of the house.  Average yield of the system has been a tad over 8MWh per year with zero maintenance other than the occasional panel washing.  It gets pretty hot and dusty out here so air-conditioning during summer is a must.  So far it has operated faultlessly so pretty well happy with that aspect of the investment.  The only downside is Western Power now only pay a mere 7.136c / kWh for the energy you feed back into the grid and charge 27.3277c / kWh for what you consume from the grid.  Supply charge is 97.9714c / day.  So my last power bill for 62 days was $320.07 which averages out at a net cost of about $5.16 per day.

 

Last 62 days

Exports to grid                             929kWh at 7.135c / kWh         = $66.28cr

Imports from grid                      1063kWh at 27.3277c / kWh = $290.49

Supply Charge                                                                                 =   $60.74

GST                                                                                                      =   $35.12

Net savings on energy bill for the 62 days                               =    $5.45                                                           

 

Estimated total energy used is 1992kWh of which 46.6% came from renewable energy generated by my own PV system.  Obviously my electricity bill would have been a lot higher if I didn't have a PV system.  As you can see the 929kWh of electricity I fed back into the grid over the billing period of 62 days only just covered the supply charge despite generating about 30kWh of electricity per day.

 

Strategies that I implemented to try to reduce power consumption from the grid:

• Use energy intensive appliances wherever possible whilst you're getting "free" energy from the sun.  i.e. put on the dishwasher, washing machine and air-conditioning during the daylight hours when the PV arrays are generating the most electricity. 
• Try to keep the electrical load under the capacity of the solar PV system at any one time so I minimise the draw from the grid.
• The other obvious is changed all the lighting to energy efficient types which I suspect most households already have.

I would like to expand my system but the WA government will then decrease my feed back to the grid tariff to a pitifully lower level, even if I upgrade to facilitate a battery storage solution.  

I've already got the highest capacity system allowable in my street due to network limitations and the fact my property is fed from its own exclusive 25kVA transformer.  All other properties in the immediate area are limited to 3.5kW systems because they mostly share the same capacity transformer over three property connections to the grid.

 

Have I got back in savings all the $8,000 I spend having the system installed?  I don't know.  I haven't done the sums yet.  

 

 

We went through Apollo Solar in June 2021 for an install using 13.32kw of premium Phono Sumec solar panels and a 10kw Sungrow inverter at a cost of $13,928. We had the inverter installed indoors under our stairs to reduce overheating/fire risk as overheated inverters can be a cause of fire.

 

Thank goodness for solar with current power costs 

 

That said, I won't be touching solar storage solutions until aluminium-graphene ion batteries are available. Lithium batteries are chemically unstable and will always be a fire hazard. No way will I ever had one on my property.

Edited April 6, 20232 yr by MattyW

Not sure if this was already covered earlier in the thread, but if one had solar roof panels (no storage batteries) and a Tesla car, could one use the car as a storage battery and use stored daylight energy at night to power your home?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 3, 20232 yr by Silver Audiophile

5 hours ago, Silver Audiophile said:

Not sure if this was already covered earlier in the thread, but if one had solar roof panels (no storage batteries) and a Tesla car, could one use the car as a storage battery and use stored daylight energy at night to power your home?

 

 

 

 

 

 

V2H is what you are asking about - yes, in various overseas countries. 
V2H is a subset of V2Grid (V2G) all of which in Australia are in the throes of being tested around the country.
You need three items, (A) cars that have bi-directional charging capabilities.

(B) Approved  Bi-directional chargers - there is one (possibly 2) currently on the market (@ ~AUD $10K each).

(C) Approval to install the charger (and associated hardware & control software) at your home from your State Electricity supplier.
Currently only 2 vehicles in Australia have (A) , one is Nissan Leaf Gen2  (Japan has been doing this for several years) , and one is the Mitsubishi Outlander PEV. 

V2Load (V2L) is not the same - this allows you to run say a fridge or charge a e-bike or such (I.e much smaller load) etc.  
In SA (not sure of status in other States & Territories )  you can apply to SA Power network to seek approval of an installation at your premises (one commercial location has so far been approved). Approval is not guaranteed, assessment is on a case-by-case basis. BUT, you have to have already purchased the bi-directional charger so you are paying a premium for being a trailblazer. 
If you have a TESLA - no they don’t allow V2H or V2G (maybe not even V2L). 

Edited July 3, 20232 yr by frankn
Add

On 5/4/2023 at 10:56 AM, Monkeyboi said:

I had a 5kW system installed about 8 years ago.  SMA SunnyBoy 5000TL single phase inverter and 20 panels (can't remember .  

I have the same inverter,  but it’s being updated so there is no LCD display, it’s all Wifi.    I’ve seen the same inverter going for over 10yrs and still going without an issue.   At the time it was this or the Fronius.    I’m now glad I stuck with a SMA that no one wanted, the Fronius was months of waiting and that’s if you’re lucky.    I’m glad I didn’t go with one of those highly efficient Chinese brand,   A colleague at work had a Chinese inverter installed the same time I had mine installed and to date the Chinese inverter had to be replaced!   

3 hours ago, Addicted to music said:

I have the same inverter,  but it’s being updated so there is no LCD display, it’s all Wifi.    I’ve seen the same inverter going for over 10yrs and still going without an issue.   At the time it was this or the Fronius.    I’m now glad I stuck with a SMA that no one wanted, the Fronius was months of waiting and that’s if you’re lucky.    I’m glad I didn’t go with one of those highly efficient Chinese brand,   A colleague at work had a Chinese inverter installed the same time I had mine installed and to date the Chinese inverter had to be replaced!   

 

The SMA came highly recommended as it has a nice clean output, very reliable and well supported here in Australia.  Prior to buying mine a friend had the same model installed at his house and like mine it hasn't had any issues.  Where I am we have fiercely hot summers with shade temperatures frequently approaching 50 deg C and very cold winters below freezing.  So far the SMA hasn't missed a beat.  I hardly look at the LCD as I use the SunnyBoy BT application to monitor the inverter's performance.

15 hours ago, frankn said:

V2H is what you are asking about - yes, in various overseas countries. 
V2H is a subset of V2Grid (V2G) all of which in Australia are in the throes of being tested around the country.
You need three items, (A) cars that have bi-directional charging capabilities.

(B) Approved  Bi-directional chargers - there is one (possibly 2) currently on the market (@ ~AUD $10K each).

(C) Approval to install the charger (and associated hardware & control software) at your home from your State Electricity supplier.
Currently only 2 vehicles in Australia have (A) , one is Nissan Leaf Gen2  (Japan has been doing this for several years) , and one is the Mitsubishi Outlander PEV. 

V2Load (V2L) is not the same - this allows you to run say a fridge or charge a e-bike or such (I.e much smaller load) etc.  
In SA (not sure of status in other States & Territories )  you can apply to SA Power network to seek approval of an installation at your premises (one commercial location has so far been approved). Approval is not guaranteed, assessment is on a case-by-case basis. BUT, you have to have already purchased the bi-directional charger so you are paying a premium for being a trailblazer. 
If you have a TESLA - no they don’t allow V2H or V2G (maybe not even V2L). 

Hi frank - I think Hyundai are testing v2g in the ionic - what I read suggests it’s just a software update to enable them - not 100% sure on this but could be a great option going forward if it becomes available?? 

1 hour ago, Andythiing said:

Hi frank - I think Hyundai are testing v2g in the ionic - what I read suggests it’s just a software update to enable them - not 100% sure on this but could be a great option going forward if it becomes available?? 

Hi @Andythiing,

That would be nice. I did ask them a couple of months ago (and I asked the same of Kia last month) but they were still saying V2L only at that time.  Do you have a link to info about this?  
I don’t know if the new Nissan Ariya EV will continue with the V2H capability- have you heard anything??
Until more car manufacturers take it up the Power Authorities aren’t going to overly worry about approval of requests to install bi-directional chargers , and, the consumer will be screwed again.  

1 hour ago, frankn said:

Hi @Andythiing,

That would be nice. I did ask them a couple of months ago (and I asked the same of Kia last month) but they were still saying V2L only at that time.  Do you have a link to info about this?  
I don’t know if the new Nissan Ariya EV will continue with the V2H capability- have you heard anything??
Until more car manufacturers take it up the Power Authorities aren’t going to overly worry about approval of requests to install bi-directional chargers , and, the consumer will be screwed again.  

One link https://thedriven.io/2022/04/25/ioniq-5-evs-with-v2g-to-create-world-first-bi-directional-energy-system/

On 6/4/2023 at 10:44 AM, MattyW said:

We went through Apollo Solar in June 2021 for an install using 13.32kw of premium Phono Sumec solar panels and a 10kw Sungrow inverter at a cost of $13,928. We had the inverter installed indoors under our stairs to reduce overheating/fire risk as overheated inverters can be a cause of fire.

 

Thank goodness for solar with current power costs 

 

That said, I won't be touching solar storage solutions until aluminium-graphene ion batteries are available. Lithium batteries are chemically unstable and will always be a fire hazard. No way will I ever had one on my property.

absolutely agreed.   If we are forced into EVs and we are still using current lithium tech,  I’d be parking it outside and not in the garage,  have the cable plugged outside the premises.    

23 hours ago, Andythiing said:

One link https://thedriven.io/2022/04/25/ioniq-5-evs-with-v2g-to-create-world-first-bi-directional-energy-system/

Thanks Andy,

that is an encouraging social & engineering trial. It looks to be a unique, and, proprietary system the two companies are progressing.  
Hopefully a spin-off will be that going forward Hyundai will offer simple bi-directional capabilities to be used in any country, on any public system.