David.M Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 You're in the wrong thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 The ultimate analog experience isn't vinyl or tape- its a 2 pc setup with one pc as control the other set up in core mode , optimised for audio only using server2012 as os. As per any source the quality of the recording determines sound, but this digital system with any reasonable recording will give a far superior sound both in accuracy and realism than your 30 year old tape deck with its hundreds of poor sounding electrolytic capacitors, complicated EQ circuits, playback circuits with components all aged and off value, not to mention wow and flutter, same with vinyl, so many physical and electrical influences colouring the sound. Even a refurbished tape and very well made phono are no match for state of the art digital , which done right is the closest thing to realism, or analog , or whatever you want to call "ultimate" The future is here now, but its too hard for most and the serial posters are too busy telling everyone how smart they are to invest the time and effort to actually experience what is the state of the art in playback. That should get the smart-arse's attention, and there's plenty of them here. But...you get your music from itunes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve M Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) You're in the wrong thread Worthy of a thread on its own "Analog Tape Machines vs Computer Audio" , but who will be game enough to do it and has a foot in both camps to remain impartial? Edited March 20, 2014 by Steve M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acg Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Worthy of a thread on its own "Analog Tape Machines vs Computer Audio" , but who will be game enough to do it and has a foot in both camps to remain impartial? I've never heard any tape more upmarket than cassette tape and that was 20 years ago. If there are any decent R2R setups in SE Qld I'm up for bringing down my digital gear to see how they differ. It would make a good get together especially if some of the tape could be digitised. Assuming the ADC process was of suitable quality, I would not expect to hear too much of a difference, but you never know. Anthony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Once was an audiophile Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I've never heard any tape more upmarket than cassette tape and that was 20 years ago. If there are any decent R2R setups in SE Qld I'm up for bringing down my digital gear to see how they differ. It would make a good get together especially if some of the tape could be digitised. Assuming the ADC process was of suitable quality, I would not expect to hear too much of a difference, but you never know. Anthony Agreat I've never heard any tape more upmarket than cassette tape and that was 20 years ago. If there are any decent R2R setups in SE Qld I'm up for bringing down my digital gear to see how they differ. It would make a good get together especially if some of the tape could be digitised. Assuming the ADC process was of suitable quality, I would not expect to hear too much of a difference, but you never know. Anthony Rawll99 has a R2R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David.M Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Worthy of a thread on its own "Analog Tape Machines vs Computer Audio" , but who will be game enough to do it and has a foot in both camps to remain impartial? Well obviously statman is not impartial, from his pedestal he forgot to consider that any music which was originally recorded in analogue and which he plays on his digital system had to first be played on one of those old machines with all their problems otherwise he wouldn't be listening to it. At the end of the day I don't see the real value in format -v- format discussions (which often end up arguments), so much depends on the original format the music was recorded on, quality of transfers/mastering and quality of playback equipment. Assuming the best equipment (& thats an argument of it's own) & properly mastered/EQ'd music is used for each format, music recorded on analogue tape will sound best played back on tape or (if a copy is not available) vinyl & digital recordings should sound best on digital playback. I think the reality too is that at the very top end the differences between format & equipment is not 'night & day' and often a matter of taste/preference, so who is right and who is wrong. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve M Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Good points in second paragraph ...and round-and-round we go! That's why I have convinced myself that my sources (vinyl-cd-streaming) are generally sorted and, concentrate on upping the ante on loudspeaker types where I can hear the most difference, the cause and effect to the greatest extent. Steve. Edited March 20, 2014 by Steve M 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
statman Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I owned around 20 R2R decks, I owned around 500 tapes, I rebuilt the EQ and playback circuits of both SS and valve decks. I've built over 500 phono circuits, and designed many more, I've been into computer audio for more than 4 years. I reckon I'm impartial, and I'm not saying that tape doesn't sound excellent. Martin Seddons G36 into his horns is quite an experience, but the state of the art, the ultimate experience is no longer tape. And no you ***** , I dont get my music from iTunes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOMO Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Valves have become too mainstream.So has vinyl again.And even multi bit DAC chips.And headphones! So that only leaves R2R if you want the "real deal" Or you could just take up wearing a cravat and pipe smoking. As an aside this is by far the best recording I own.On vinyl but that in itself might not be why it sounds so good. Edited March 20, 2014 by THOMO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newman Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Or you could just take up wearing a cravat and smoking a pipe. The Herb Reichert solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masliko Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 (edited) That was before DACS. Vinyl does not have the edge anymore. I only returned to vinyl because mp3s sounded so bad now that DAC's have become affordable it's game changer. People who bought vinyl for the right reason (the sound) and are not just collectors who have found a medium they like to collect have realized that even vinyl on a very good system can sound bad because of all the noise if it's not a quality press. A lot of these guys are moving over to DACS because you null the problems of vinyl if you use quality recordings IMHO. Edited March 30, 2014 by masliko 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENIGMA Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 That was before DACS. Vinyl does not have the edge anymore. I only returned to vinyl because mp3s sounded so bad now that DAC's have become affordable it's game changer. People who bought vinyl for the right reason (the sound) and are not just collectors who have found a medium they like to collect have realized that even vinyl on a very good system can sound bad because of all the noise if it's not a quality press. A lot of these guys are moving over to DACS because you null the problems of vinyl if you use quality recordings IMHO. Quality presses can be noisy too. Yes there are noisy and pretty ordinary lp's out there but if you think vinyl does not have the edge, you are either listening to a system that is incapable or you a listening to allot of crappy noisy vinyl. Just as there are crap LP's there is equally crap digital recordings that no dac can make better. Harsh, glary, oversampled fatiguing over engineered sound. I run vinyl, CD and have a transport for my digital uncompressed downloads. Each one has it's gems and each one has some crappy recordings. There are some LP's no digital media can touch and vice versa. A lot of people a moving to DACs because of various reasons, some due to quit a bit of misinformation. It is never about the medium but the quality from which the recording and engineer put together in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masliko Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) Quality presses can be noisy too. Yes there are noisy and pretty ordinary lp's out there but if you think vinyl does not have the edge, you are either listening to a system that is incapable or you a listening to allot of crappy noisy vinyl. Just as there are crap LP's there is equally crap digital recordings that no dac can make better. Harsh, glary, oversampled fatiguing over engineered sound. I run vinyl, CD and have a transport for my digital uncompressed downloads. Each one has it's gems and each one has some crappy recordings. There are some LP's no digital media can touch and vice versa. A lot of people a moving to DACs because of various reasons, some due to quit a bit of misinformation. It is never about the medium but the quality from which the recording and engineer put together in the first place. "Quality presses can be noisy too." No they cant-because to be a quality recording they are not noisy..Maybe you and i are talking about different things?? And again,yes it does have the edge at the moment but i don't see that lasting forever as i once did. I have bought vinyl since the late 80's,and know how good it can sound and i could never see any other medium sounding better,but now i can,that is all I'm saying. And again,I'm talking generally.I'm not talking about the guy who can afford a two hundred thousand dollar system to play records on. Edited March 31, 2014 by masliko 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Good Vibe Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 E does your wife know you spent over 200K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freedom Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 (edited) And again,I'm talking generally.I'm not talking about the guy who can afford a two hundred thousand dollar system to play records on. That's the point with 'vinyl'! Sure, if you've got the MONEY then you can get a top notch turntable and the right set-up to better other mediums. But most of us haven't that luxury! I would love to hear a 'quality' vinyl set-up some day! Edited April 1, 2014 by surfpurple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENIGMA Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 "Quality presses can be noisy too." No they cant-because to be a quality recording they are not noisy..Maybe you and i are talking about different things?? And again,yes it does have the edge at the moment but i don't see that lasting forever as i once did. I have bought vinyl since the late 80's,and know how good it can sound and i could never see any other medium sounding better,but now i can,that is all I'm saying. And again,I'm talking generally.I'm not talking about the guy who can afford a two hundred thousand dollar system to play records on. The'll get noisy if their condition is poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENIGMA Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 E does your wife know you spent over 200K Shhhhh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newman Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 I would love to hear a 'quality' vinyl set-up some day! They are fantastic. 'Approaching digital'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 That's the point with 'vinyl'! Sure, if you've got the MONEY then you can get a top notch turntable and the right set-up to better other mediums. But most of us haven't that luxury! I would love to hear a 'quality' vinyl set-up some day! I've never agreed with this statement, but won't argue it here. Much better to have a separate thread "Minimum spend reqd for a kickarse vinyl frontend". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metal beat Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 They are fantastic. 'Approaching digital'. Fishing again Newman :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freedom Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 (edited) I've never agreed with this statement, but won't argue it here. Much better to have a separate thread "Minimum spend reqd for a kickarse vinyl frontend". I'm only speaking from 'experience'! If 'my' system is 'so' much behind (in the vinyl aspect) when I thought it packs a decent punch for it's weight,(for playing 'digital') then, there is a problem between the two mediums to compare 'relatively'! I would be 'very' interested to see just what 'minimum spend' would be necessary to obtain the 'equivalent' vinyl frontend, (let alone 'better' frontend)! But, as you say, another thread would be more appropriate to discuss the topic. Edited April 3, 2014 by surfpurple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Anderson Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 (edited) Good to see the flame wars are still going in this thread. Been a entertaining read. Best thing about it is all the digital guys feel the need to come into a Analogue thread and state how great their remastered off the analogue tapes stuff sounds. You go guys!! Edited April 3, 2014 by keitha 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metal beat Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Good to see the flame wars are still going in this thread. Been a entertaining read. Best thing about it is all the digital guys feel the need to come into a Analogue thread and state how great their remastered off the analogue tapes their stuff sounds. You go guys!! Sometimes I wonder if the digital fanbois jumping into analog threads are trying to convince others or convince themselves 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freedom Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Sometimes I wonder if the digital fanbois jumping into analog threads are trying to convince others or convince themselves I'll be MORE than happy to jump right in to the 'vinyl' side anyday. I've got hundreds of records, some of my all time favs! It's just the 'sound' that lets them down, pure and simple! Personally, I'm not trying to convince anyone of digital, I would just like to 'experience' the advantage of vinyl over digital (at a 'comparative' price point)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Anderson Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 (edited) What's a comparative price point? Edited April 4, 2014 by keitha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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