Classifieds (NEW) is Now Live (Updates posted here)

[StereoNET]

With massive thanks to all - the new Classifieds system is now out of Beta, and is stable.

 

Thanks to all for your patience as we worked through some mostly minor bugs on launch.

 

Virtually everything reported was fixed, along with functionality changes suggested and implemented throughout the process.

Now that we are out of Beta, that does not mean development stops - quite the opposite.

 

What will happen now though is that we won't be doing overnight updates (unless a major bug or security issue is discovered).

Instead, we will now work through version releases as they are tested and ready. For example, we are currently on V1.0.1 - there are a number of changes already made for V1.0.2, which we are testing on a development server before we push it live to our site.

 

We will now update here when the app has been updated, along with a changelog for each version when implemented.

 

Thanks again for all your help, and in particular the volunteer mods, the Beta test group, and of course you all for your ongoing support.

Your're welcome to still report issues (via the Support channels please), or ideas/suggestions can be made in reply to this thread. 

All ideas and suggestions will be considered - but please understand there are often limiting factors that determine whether something is feasible or not.

 

Ongoing How To tutorials will continue to be created and stickied here. If you have ideas for what needs a basic tutorial, let us know.
Once we have documented all the How Tos, we will condense them into an indexable single point of reference.

[Guest]

Classifieds has been updated to V1.0.2

 

Changelog

• Default Electrical Disclaimer removed from non-relevant categories
• Categories and subcategories can now be marked as read
• Fee Payable displayed when member selects Change Price function
• Add Feedback button added on mobile view
• New Classifieds Categories widget created (not implemented at time of this post)
• Fixed bug with Adding Type in Media categories not displaying in selectable list

[Guest]

Any feedback / suggestions / improvements or use cases we haven't considered?

 

(Bugs still to be reported in Support please, not here).

[Dystoria]

Now the dust has settled I'd like to re suggest the "make an offer idea" I had suggested early in the testing noting it's not an auction function but a way to filter out genuine offers vs low balling. Different ways to configure this so it is not onerous on the seller (they would control the lowest acceptable price point and how often they received notification eg daily / end of the sale if it's not sold etc).

[Jakeyb77_Redux]

9 hours ago, Dystoria said:

Now the dust has settled I'd like to re suggest the "make an offer idea" I had suggested early in the testing noting it's not an auction function but a way to filter out genuine offers vs low balling. Different ways to configure this so it is not onerous on the seller (they would control the lowest acceptable price point and how often they received notification eg daily / end of the sale if it's not sold etc).

Can we set an automated response system for offers? 
I suggest 

accept

reject 

absolutely no 

 

[Dystoria]

6 minutes ago, Jakeyb77_Redux said:

Can we set an automated response system for offers?

That's what I was thinking. The seller would set a baseline price and anything below the price would receive a polite rejection. Anything above the baseline would be considered. The seller would set how often they want to be notified and maybe there could be an option to display the top 3 offers at the expiry date. This could be super customised to meet seller requirements.

[Guest]

Totally open to ideas, but I'm not seeing the benefit of this over a simple conversation? Sell the idea to me

I still see a low ball offer as an opportunity. Your ability to close the deal is only really as good as your negotiation and sales skills.

 

[Jakeyb77_Redux]

4 minutes ago, Marc said:

Totally open to ideas, but I'm not seeing the benefit of this over a simple conversation? Sell the idea to me

I still see a low ball offer as an opportunity. Your ability to close the deal is only really as good as your negotiation and sales skills.

 

I think the suggestion given is like is available on eBay.

You can set parameters for offers that are either accepted or erected automatically by the system. So if you list an item at $500 you can set the system to automatically accept anything above $450 and decline any offer that’s less or whatever you choose the parameters to be.

Means you don’t have to reply to lower offers as the system would send an automated rejection with a suggestion to increase the offer. 
I’m not really for or against it but that’s how it works 

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, Jakeyb77_Redux said:

So if you list an item at $500 you can set the system to automatically accept anything above $450 and decline any offer that’s less or whatever you choose the parameters to be.

 

Totally personally speaking, I always found that feature of eBay pointless. Why list it for $500 if you're prepared to (automatically) accept $450. Why not list at $450 in the first place and get a quick sale? If someone then offers $400, simply say no. Again, this is all just negotiations. Some people are naturally better than others. 

 

Perhaps it would encourage people to start communication. I could understand that. But I'm sure if they were genuinely interested in the first place, they won't hesitate clicking the now obvious "Contact Seller" button. And anything has to be better than Facebook's "Is this still available" automated message. To which you say, "yes" within seconds, and you never heard from them again. What the actual is with that?

 

[Dystoria]

I don't use the features on eBay or FB marketplace so can't directly comment. I would say I agree with Marc, an auto accept seems pretty redundant.

 

I see different benefits for seller's and buyers.

 

Sellers: 

 

Can set a minimum to filter lowballers.

 

Able to test out the market price. If they receive offers around 10-20% less (if this is how they set the filters) then they might get a better idea how much the product is worth in the current market (that is if it doesn't originally sell which then leaves the door open to choose the best offer or person to sell to).

 

Once the buyer understands the market value it might negate the seller having to relist at a cheaper price point. By example I purchased a $2000 cartridge a couple of days back originally listed at $1000. Seller was originally publically messaged an offer of $600 (plus a sumiko blackbird for retipping) which was publicly rejected and shamed (yes it shouldn't have been a public discussion anyway). Didn't sell so relisted a number of times. Finally listed at $650 (including shipping and insurance) so I picked it up. It's market value is $600. And I want the blackbird.

 

Buyer:

 

There are potential buyers, like me, who simply do not negotiate. There might be items listed at a price point 10-20% above what they are prepared to pay but are unwilling to enter into negotiations. 

 

@Marc,  you write "I'm sure if they were genuinely interested in the first place, they won't hesitate clicking the now obvious "Contact Seller" button". This isn't the case - this is your mental model around purchasing. There are social and cultural reasons why people don't negotiate. Mine is cultural.

 

My mental model (and I won't be alone here) goes like this:

 

I see a Luxman xxxx for $7000 and I think if it were 10% less, $6300, I'd buy it but don't make an offer. No one does. 2 weeks later price reduction to $6500 and it's still out of budget. Then it's unlisted for 6 weeks and I think it's sold. Then relisted at $6000 but I have moved on and purchased something else. Damn. If only I had made an offer of $6300 then all involved would be happier.

 

For me this feature offers a bit of flexibility around the purchasing process as the current process still makes both the seller and potential buyer work a bit harder than necessary (I've made other suggestions around the purchase process too).

 

All in all, the purchase process is my only bugbear with the new classifieds (still a few too many clicks to purchase, leave feedback etc). All the other customisable features are excellent and work well.

 

[Guest]

I'm still not sold, but open to changing my mind with more input from others. To me, at this point, the suggestions would actually add further steps and complication rather than making it simpler. 

 

Quote

All in all, the purchase process is my only bugbear with the new classifieds (still a few too many clicks to purchase, leave feedback etc). All the other customisable features are excellent and work well.

 

I do not see (yet) how the above would create any less clicks but in fact create even more steps. 

 

To purchase, one clicks "Contact Seller", and says, hey I'm interested at $XXXX. The seller replies either yes, or no, and the deal can be done in as little as 2-3 communications. For leaving feedback, again, it's one click from the Seller's Ad. 

 

I have repeatedley said I'm looking for ideas and suggestions and I genuinely am!

But I'm just not sold on these ideas as sincerely don't believe they simplify anything in a simple selling/buying transaction.

 

I remain open minded though and think it should be further round-tabled here.

[Ars Paart]

People often put words to the effect of "sale price is firm" on their ads if they don't want lower offers. Maybe e.g. a checkbox on the ad could communicate that?

[Guest]

I'm in danger of coming across as rejecting ideas, and I don't want that to be the case - I'm listening

 

14 minutes ago, Ars Paart said:

People often put words to the effect of "sale price is firm" on their ads if they don't want lower offers. Maybe e.g. a checkbox on the ad could communicate that?

 

The question I have, is if there was a checkbox that said "price is firm", do you think it would really stop people making a lower offer? And again, it potentially prevents interested parties from actually making contact - let's not forget the asking price today may not be the same as the price that would be accepted in 2 weeks' time.

[Dystoria]

16 minutes ago, Ars Paart said:

People often put words to the effect of "sale price is firm" on their ads if they don't want lower offers. Maybe e.g. a checkbox on the ad could communicate that?

The seller would have total control of the filters including fixed price

 

2 minutes ago, Marc said:

The question I have, is if there was a checkbox that said "price is firm", do you think it would really stop people making a lower offer?

The "make an offer" filter could simply reject the submission if it's too low.

 

3 minutes ago, Marc said:

And again, it potentially prevents interested parties from actually making contact

Absolutely! It provides flexibility for parties to communicate but ... It also provides the ability for those that don't want to negotiate the ability to do so!! Like me

[sir sanders zingmore]

10 hours ago, Marc said:

Why list it for $500 if you're prepared to (automatically) accept $450. Why not list at $450 in the first place and get a quick sale?

I think the psychology of the buyer and seller can sometimes play into this. 
I reckon in many cases a buyer who pays $450 on an item originally listed at $500 is happier than if they pay $450 on an item listed at $450. 
 

Sure they’ve paid the same price but they have the satisfaction of getting a “discount” from the buyer. 
 

As mentioned by someone already, this is often a cultural thing. 
 

From the sellers point of view, if a decent proportion of your potential buyers like to haggle, then setting the initial price at $450 is flagging your starting price to those buyers. They, rightly or wrongly, might expect that you have room to move. Then you get annoyed at the offers around $400. 

 

[Dystoria]

40 minutes ago, Marc said:

do not see (yet) how the above would create any less clicks but in fact create even more steps. 

That's correct - it's a new feature so not meant to reduce clicks.

 

The less clicks comes into play with trader feedback. ATM it take a few steps to leave feedback (both seller and buyer). It would be easy if both seller and buyer are emailed the trade details and a link is provided in the email to provide feedback for the trade (the link would open an SNA window with the details of the trade and who the feedback is for. To make it easy there might be a list of comments the user can select and also a comment field to personalise feedback).

[Guest]

Question. Do many people actually buy without first communicating with the seller, asking questions about the condition, age, inclusions, DOA policy, etc? 

 

Do we not run the risk of removing the personal aspect of this community by making it a straight forward, "price" based transaction? My point is, communication just has to happen anyway. We're talking about complex functionality changes and major development, to suit those that are reluctant to press a "Contact Seller" button.  I still don't see any benefits - sorry!

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Dystoria said:

The less clicks comes into play with trader feedback. ATM it take a few steps to leave feedback (both seller and buyer). It would be easy if both seller and buyer are emailed the trade details and a link is provided in the email to provide feedback for the trade (the link would open an SNA window with the details of the trade and who the feedback is for. To make it easy there might be a list of comments the user can select and also a comment field to personalise feedback).

 

That aspect you suggest above is a great idea (and seperate to the rest of the discussion) .... Definitely investigating that one.

It's more complex than it appears though. It relies on the Mark as Sold button being pressed by the Seller to trigger it, then it would need to ask the username of the Buyer, before it could then Email/PM both parties.

Will investigate. 

Trader Feedback has definitely seen more use since the new Classifieds though, so it's not fixing a problem - it's just improving it, though, which I am all for

[sir sanders zingmore]

7 minutes ago, Marc said:

Do we not run the risk of removing the personal aspect of this community by making it a straight forward, "price" based transaction?

100% agree. 
Even as a seller, I’d be concerned if someone just clicked “buy” with no other communication. 

Also, it would remove the choice that the seller currently has around who they sell to. 

I want to be sure my beloved items are going to a good home
 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Marc said:

It relies on the Mark as Sold button being pressed by the Seller to trigger it, then it would need to ask the username of the Buyer, before it could then Email/PM both parties.

 

Downside of this is Buyer's don't often leave feedback for the Seller for some week's after that transaction took place (by the time it ships, gets setup). Hopefully the Seller leaving the Buyer feedback may remind them though.

[Guest]

Just now, sir sanders zingmore said:

100% agree. 
Even as a seller, I’d be concerned if someone just clicked “buy” with no other communication. 

Also, it would remove the choice that the seller currently has around who they sell to. 

I want to be sure my beloved items are going to a good home
 

 

You make another good point. I've had many PMs reported to me by Seller's concerned about the legitimacy of Buyers. Yes, scam BUYERS exist too. A few brief interactions can usually get the spidey-senses tingling.

[Dystoria]

1 hour ago, Marc said:

 

That aspect you suggest above is a great idea (and seperate to the rest of the discussion) .... Definitely investigating that one.

It's more complex than it appears though. It relies on the Mark as Sold button being pressed by the Seller to trigger it, then it would need to ask the username of the Buyer, before it could then Email/PM both parties.

Will investigate. 

Trader Feedback has definitely seen more use since the new Classifieds though, so it's not fixing a problem - it's just improving it, though, which I am all for

Yeah I see this function as more of a reminder if feedback isn't left. It could be triggered at the point of confirmation then a couple of weeks later if feedback isn't left.

[rantan]

I really do not understand how a few clicks are such an onerous task for some buyers and I also don't believe that the communication aspect of a sell/buy transaction should be avoided.

In fact it should be encouraged.

I have often made some good forum friends as a result of communication from a for sale listing.

 

Cynics may label this as trite or naive, but this is still a community and we should aspire to avoid becoming like Ebay or Gumtree where the law of the jungle applies.  Decent communication is ( or should be king )

[Dystoria]

1 hour ago, sir sanders zingmore said:

100% agree. 
Even as a seller, I’d be concerned if someone just clicked “buy” with no other communication

I agree with the sentiment but this isn't a buy feature and the seller would always have the last say in who they sell too - as it's not an auction and the offers would be private the seller might not sell to the highest offer but to their preferred offer. Indeed the buyer might also contact someone to negotiate a better price (or maybe not). 

 

I've purchased my fair share of gear through SNA (Koetsu, Schroder to $40 low end cables) and I've never had a seller show any concern about the items future.  That's not to say I don't find it important (I would of I was a seller). I'm just stating my experience.

[Ars Paart]

2 hours ago, Marc said:

I'm in danger of coming across as rejecting ideas, and I don't want that to be the case - I'm listening

 

 

The question I have, is if there was a checkbox that said "price is firm", do you think it would really stop people making a lower offer? And again, it potentially prevents interested parties from actually making contact - let's not forget the asking price today may not be the same as the price that would be accepted in 2 weeks' time.

It could just be me, but if for example someone says they won't ship and I'm in a different location I just move on. Same here, if it says the price is firm and I'm not willing to pay it I move on.  Other people may behave differently, as you noted.