75 AUD for a record... are we serious?

[Hergest]

14 hours ago, audiofeline said:

And the new records have all been digitally remastered along the way.  So I wonder if there is any benefit to buying new LPs, apart from being able to indulge in the nice artwork.

 

I never get this argument as it assumes that people's digital and analogue replay are of the same quality. I've got a 20 year old Cyrus cd player just plugged into the CD rca of my pre amp but my analogue system has been thought about, chopped and changed, researched, honed to a T and costs the same as a pretty good motor car so a record being digital will still sound substantially better on my system that the comparable cd. In fact, any record played back on my record player sounds so good that it's years and years since I last gave a toss as to whether any point in the recording/ mastering chain was digital, analogue or a combination of both. So there is a benefit to buying new lps (even at $75) as they will sound brilliant on my hifi compared to if I bought the cd.

[Guest]

Just now, Hergest said:

 

I never get this argument as it assumes that people's digital and analogue replay are of the same quality. I've got a 20 year old Cyrus cd player just plugged into the CD rca of my pre amp but my analogue system has been thought about, chopped and changed, researched, honed to a T and costs the same as a pretty good motor car so a record being digital will still sound substantially better on my system that the comparable cd. In fact, any record played back on my record player sounds so good that it's years and years since I last gave a toss as to whether any point in the recording/ mastering chain was digital, analogue or a combination of both. So there is a benefit to buying new lps (even at $75) as they will sound brilliant on my hifi compared to if I bought the cd.

I agree.

 

$75 for the latest Billie Eilish or Harry Styles is $75 too much, however $75 for a great pressing of Tubular Bells for those who have never heard it, is probably the best $75 money can spend.

 

I do take the OP's point though. Most things being punched out these days aren't worth spending $75 on, not when you can get an original for half the price and usually for better quality as well.

 

The fact modern made music is being pressed on vinyl is more a marketing ploy than anything else IMHO.

 

$75 for an original press I can easily see, but $75 for a BOB or MOV I just don't understand.

 

 

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Hergest said:

 

I never get this argument as it assumes that people's digital and analogue replay are of the same quality. I've got a 20 year old Cyrus cd player just plugged into the CD rca of my pre amp but my analogue system has been thought about, chopped and changed, researched, honed to a T and costs the same as a pretty good motor car so a record being digital will still sound substantially better on my system that the comparable cd. In fact, any record played back on my record player sounds so good that it's years and years since I last gave a toss as to whether any point in the recording/ mastering chain was digital, analogue or a combination of both. So there is a benefit to buying new lps (even at $75) as they will sound brilliant on my hifi compared to if I bought the cd.

 

It's more a comment on how most modern records, including represses have gone through a digital mastering process that makes them sound pretty bad. Many (but not all of course) releases fall into this camp which makes a repressed vinyl sound way worse than the original.

 

Many modern vinyl represses of old classics just sound like their CD counterpart dumped onto vinyl (so in other words, inherently worse than CD) so what's the point.

 

Not all of course. There are some modern pressings that sound fantastic.

[Citroen]

I'll still buy at these insane prices, as like any addict, I need my fix.

 

I just wish it was a cheaper habit!

 

5 hours ago, kelossus said:

That Leonard Cohen album is available for $42 delivered. If it were an Amazon AU/US stocked item it would be even cheaper.

Cost me NZ$52 (AU$50), what with shipping and 15% GST added.

 

When I got back into buying new vinyl circa 2010, I was paying between $20 and $30 for a standard release.  That's $23 to $35 inflation adjusted.

 

 

 

[Citroen]

50 minutes ago, TDK said:

I agree.

 

$75 for the latest Billie Eilish or Harry Styles is $75 too much, however $75 for a great pressing of Tubular Bells for those who have never heard it, is probably the best $75 money can spend.

 

I have Tubular Bells on vinyl. I wouldn't pay $75 for this or for Billie Eilish.

 

But I would certainly prefer her to TB. Have you heard your album? Its actually a masterpiece of clever writing and excellent vocals.

[Hergest]

1 hour ago, TDK said:

 

Many modern vinyl represses of old classics just sound like their CD counterpart dumped onto vinyl (so in other words, inherently worse than CD) so what's the point.

I fail to see why that would be inherently worse and my argument would still stand that if the playback system for a record is far superior than that for a CD then the record would sound better. If it sounds better is the goal, not what the master is.

[hired goon]

2 hours ago, TDK said:

... however $75 for a great pressing of Tubular Bells for those who have never heard it, is probably the best $75 money can spend.

 

Idano ... do ya reckon if I digitalamized a flat transfer of the Tubular Bells master tape to 24/192 hi-res (or whatever the standard is these days) that anyone would pay $75? Okay maybe some audiophools but the average punter? 

 

I reckon that most people couldn't tell the difference between sufficiently hi-res digitimal and quiet vinyl (given similar quality gear) yet they are willing to pay more for the 12" objet d'art, hence the much higher prices.

 

--Geoff 

[audiofeline]

8 hours ago, Tim D said:

I just walked past a St Vinnies and decided to have a quick look at the vinyl section.

 

Almost all the records were between $10 and $25!

 

I'm talking Richard Clayderman, Burt Bacharach and lots of 60's stuff that I wouldn't pay $1 for and not even in great condition!

 

I think vinyl prices are getting a little unrealistic...

That occurred in my local op shop some time ago, I created a thread about it.  They have since reverted to the previous and reasonable pricing. 

[audiofeline]

11 hours ago, astormsau said:

Im with the OP, I was in JB the other day as well and noticed prices have gone up quite a lot in the last 12-18 months.

...   Perhaps it's just because it's Christmas time?

I would expect JB to have their 20% off sale very soon, an indication of the profits they make from the music sales.

[Hydrology]

13 hours ago, kelossus said:

 

That Lenard Cohen album is available for $42 delivered. If it were an Amazon AU/US stocked item it would be even cheaper.

 

 

Please point me in the direction - I have a burning desire to spend money (while I have some!)

[kelossus]

27 minutes ago, Hydrology said:

Please point me in the direction - I have a burning desire to spend money (while I have some!)

$42.77 from an international seller or a tad over $50 from within Australia.

 

https://www.amazon.com.au/gp/offer-listing/B07XW6QVJW/ref=tmm_vnl_new_olp_sr?ie=UTF8&condition=new&qid=1577189405&sr=1-1

Edited December 24, 2019 by kelossus

[mkaramazov]

8 hours ago, TDK said:

 

I do take the OP's point though. Most things being punched out these days aren't worth spending $75 on, not when you can get an original for half the price and usually for better quality as well.

 

The fact modern made music is being pressed on vinyl is more a marketing ploy than anything else IMHO.

 

I have also been shocked by new vinyl prices,  including the supposed "sale"  vinyl at JB Hifi.

 

What I  don't get is that many of the new presses are derived from a digital master, and many of these files are available for purchase elsewhere as 24 bit files,  at sometimes less than half the price of the vinyl (for example Billie Eilish's "When we fall asleep... " which was $50 on vinyl in JB this week,  but is available as a 24/44 file for about $20). By definition, regardless of the quality of one's rig,  the vinyl will be inferior because of the limitations of the vinyl format - unless something is wrong with the 24 bit digital file you are comparing it to.

 

Just to be clear,  I don't mean to say all new vinyl records have to sound worse. I know there are special pressings etc out there,  I have some myself. (I recently bought one of the Gillian Welch vinyl releases,  which is a completely analogue master).  But many new releases I just don't get, particularly where a high quality  digital file is available cheaper .

 

Of course,  I understand that SQ isn't driving much of the current demand for new vinyl, but a range of other factors - packaging,  fashion etc. 

 

[kelossus]

4 minutes ago, mkaramazov said:

What I  don't get is that many of the new presses are derived from a digital master, and many of these files are available for purchase elsewhere as 24 bit files,  at sometimes less than half the price of the vinyl (for example Billie Eilish's "When we fall asleep... " which was $50 on vinyl in JB this week,  but is available as a 24/44 file for about $20). By definition, regardless of the quality of one's rig,  the vinyl will be inferior because of the limitations of the vinyl format - unless something is wrong with the 24 bit digital file you are comparing it to.

The Steve Wilson reissue of Ziggy Startdust is from a digital source. When comparing the hi-res digital file vs the vinyl through a Directstream and VPI Prime....The turntable absolutely destroys the Directstream,

 

Vinyl is in no way limited, quite the opposite,  but those were fighting words so I had to mention it.

[Addicted to music]

1 hour ago, audiofeline said:

I would expect JB to have their 20% off sale very soon, an indication of the profits they make from the music sales.

its still on, ends Jan 1st

 

https://www.jbhifi.com.au/collections/music

[Wayne Elliott]

17 hours ago, Addicted to music said:

$17 to $18! for a LP and when CD rolled onto the shelf it was $25-30.   Some of my collection still have the price tag still stuck on it and where I bought them from,  most were from a record store called “Inner Ear” in Clayton which was just a stone throw from the train station.  Sadly it’s no longer there...  you were also able to order any title and label, wait a few weeks and it’ll arrived.  

 

You can see why JB is taking on the task,  CD at $10-20 a pop isn’t a money making venture these days,  streaming and downloads are eating into this market, walk into a JB store and some of the shelves are now taking over with LP, lots of them starting from $30 plus....   there’s no other chain selling them and dedicated shops from yesteryear are no longer the norm.

Brings back some memories. Used to race over to Inner Ear at Lunchtime, every few weeks or so when I was working in Sarton Rd. Clayton, '75/78.. Bought quite a few Albums, was alway's late getting back to Work. Also would go over to the Record Store @ Monash Uni. in my Lunch Hour. Geez, I've spent some time (&Money) in Record Stores!

Edited December 24, 2019 by initforthemusic
Correction.

[stevoz]

On 23/12/2019 at 9:59 PM, awayward said:

Back in the early 1980s I was paying around $20 for import records, and earning 5 times that for my weekly income as an apprentice, house prices are more than 5 times the value, cars similar, with inflation I’d expect the normal vinyl price to be above $80 minimum now, I think we have it good, just my opinion.

That sort of sensible 'reality based' fact has no place on this forum!!

 

Seriously though, even considering that analogy, I reckon there is some 'trend' gouging going on......

Edited December 25, 2019 by stevoz

[stevoz]

On 24/12/2019 at 1:23 PM, Tim D said:

I just walked past a St Vinnies and decided to have a quick look at the vinyl section.

 

Almost all the records were between $10 and $25!

 

I'm talking Richard Clayderman, Burt Bacharach and lots of 60's stuff that I wouldn't pay $1 for and not even in great condition!

 

I think vinyl prices are getting a little unrealistic...

 

 

Vinnies seems to be one op shop chain that are very aware of the socio-economic status of where they are situated and charge accordingly but it must be said, Bacharach and Clayderman being exceptions, that the standard of what they are selling is also usually better in these higher class suburbs......where was this rip off Vinnies?

[stevoz]

On 24/12/2019 at 9:25 AM, kelossus said:

Amazon is my go to these days. They don't have everything but the prices generally can't be beat. They even stock some AP, MOFI, ORG and Speakers Corner.

 

Read this: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-02-27/amazon-australia-warehouse-working-conditions/10807308 ......or not.

[eman]

1 hour ago, stevoz said:

Read this: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-02-27/amazon-australia-warehouse-working-conditions/10807308 ......or not.

It would be interesting to hear how some of the EU Amazons operate.

[kelossus]

19 hours ago, stevoz said:

Read this: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-02-27/amazon-australia-warehouse-working-conditions/10807308 ......or not.

No different to any major Distribution Centre

 

 

Edited December 26, 2019 by kelossus

[Tim D]

4 hours ago, stevoz said:

Vinnies seems to be one op shop chain that are very aware of the socio-economic status of where they are situated and charge accordingly but it must be said, Bacharach and Clayderman being exceptions, that the standard of what they are selling is also usually better in these higher class suburbs......where was this rip off Vinnies?

Latrobe Terrace, Paddington in Brisbane.

[Wimbo]

1 hour ago, Tim D said:

Latrobe Terrace, Paddington in Brisbane.

I will not bother to even go into these places to buy LP's. They are just crap. Even if they are just a dollar. When I go to Vinnies or Lifeline, I look for clothes or jewelry and happy to pay the price if it is what I want. Saying that, , I've seen Jazz titles in our Classifieds that are outrageous prices IMO and I would never buy. 

Son got me Bowies Blackstar from JB for Chrissy and it was under $50. Have'nt played it yet as today was our first Christmas together after losing our son and bro 12 years ago. But, it will be played tomorrow and  as long as its flat, I'm a happy chappy.

[audiofeline]

14 hours ago, Wimbo said:

...Son got me Bowies Blackstar from JB for Chrissy and it was under $50. Have'nt played it yet as today was our first Christmas together after losing our son and bro 12 years ago. But, it will be played tomorrow and  as long as its flat, I'm a happy chappy.

Sorry to hear of your familiy's losses, Wimbo.  They make times like Christmas feel very different, but I hope you also were able to celebrate their lives while remembering the loss.  And also able to celebrate other aspects and enjoy the day. 

Enjoy Blackstar today, I have read reports it is a good album. 

[nkoulban]

Crazy prices for vinyl are really putting me off analogue right now.  I will be investing in a decent DAC rather than spending more on my vinyl setup.

[Goatboy]

Unless they have a sale I've consistently found JB one of the more expensive outlets, and if this is your goto for vinyl you're going to take a decent hit on your wallet. My local record store has most releases for $35 - 45, and $50 plus for imports or double albums. Prices have also taken a hit in the last year from the weak dollar. When the exchange rate was 75c + to the USD, sites like ccmusic were great options with their regular 15 - 20% off sales and cheap postage. Then you could consistently net an LP for AU$25-30. Amazon AU can also be a good option, eg I bought Midnight Oil's 'Armistice Day' triple album for $68 from Amazon, and I think JB were looking for around $100.