Yamaha Speakers Owners & Discussion Thread

[THOMO]

10 hours ago, Steve M said:

It needs to be kept in mind that the Yamaha NS1000 was designed as an extremely accurate studio monitor (in the true sense of the word, not a sales pitch like modern speakers that use this terminology). It was designed to be placed in small studio monitoring rooms, some as small as 3m x 2.5m and the sealed boxes pushed into corners gave a tight accurate sound suited to these constrained monitoring environments. Put the same speaker in a large domestic lounge room, and yes, the bass will lack warmth and character, but that does not make the speaker any less accurate.

 

The NS1000 uses the finest material and design technology in its time, possibly still unsurpassed to this day in terms of crossover, box and driver construction. The beryllium drivers do have a special sound (the snap and speed that Al M talks about) and you either cotton onto and like this sound or perhaps not? Personally, I like it and place the NS1000 at the pinnacle of sound reproduction and respect it a lot. That said, I also have had about fives pairs pass through my hands as they do not always satisfy in my large 8m x 6.5m domestic room.

 

Having lived with the NS1000 (on several occasions) and heard Thomo's Yamaha NS-75T I can understand why he is enamored by them as the 75T does sound very musical with a fullsome bass, good clarity and it behaves 'normally' in a domestic environment. Unlike the NS1000 which can be very picky about the room and the ancillaries feeding it, which can make-or-break-it. At the end of the day it doesn't really come down to personal taste - if you are chasing accurate music reproduction, the NS1000 is better built in every way and it measures and sounds that way ...its beryllium signature is crystalline and pure sounding beyond something like the titanium in the (albeit excellent) 75T.

 

As to the new kid on the block the NS5000, I am confident it will sound very good as it follows in the footsteps of the NS1000, but more importantly it should sound better in the bass as it has been designed for the home, lets hope the zylon driver material lives up up to its promise.

 

Steve.

 

 

Well yes perhaps it is a comparison of a purely studio monitor balance of the NS1000s and the more domestically friendly tuning of the NS75T.Not that I would describe the NS75Ts as being warm sounding .Indeed they can sound just as sharp as the NS 1000s but seem to respond better to warmer sounding amps/cables and sources so in that regard are more transparent than the NS1000s .That is possibly a result of using less complex crossovers rather than the drivers themselves?

A shame you did not get to hear a direct comparison with the NS1000s as I believe that would have been a good test of the hypothesis that the NS1000s sounds more "crystalline and pure" due to its beryllium dome midrange.I certainly do not hear it that way.If anything the titanium dome midrange is the clearer , higher resolution and more dynamic of the two .It is certainly the clearest and highest resolution speaker I have owned-and there have been a great many.

Edited February 9, 2017 by THOMO

[THOMO]

12 hours ago, Peter_F said:

Hi Jon

 

Which amps were you driving the NS1000's with?

I tried quite a few different amps including some I borrowed-not just from my own collection.From 28 watts to over 300 watts.

The NS 1000s did not present as especially amplifier fussy.I thought one of the better sounding combinations was with my old Sansui AU 317 integrated amp-which was a bit surprising.

[Steve M]

Agree Jon that if you put the NS1000 and 75T in the same room, many may prefer the latter as it responds nicely to most music and and sounds more complete in the bass region. In fact safe to say, if I had a pair of 75Ts I would hang on to them and just enjoy rather than analyse the music. However, if you listen out for sheer accuracy and the fine nuances around the transient attack edges and the final decay notes of piano and voice, the 1000 will reveal more. The sound quality of the 1000 is hard to describe, it holds nothing back in terms of attack and decay resulting in a pure tone, like the sound of breaking glass on a tiled floor it rings, reverberates and decays to infinity ...the same sound on a lesser speaker sounds like the glass hit a piece of cloth on the floor before breaking apart with a softer tone.

 

The best I have heard the NS1000 sounding was at another SNAer's home, in a large family room space (about 80m2), with a simple valve based system, UK World Audio Design 5881 x 40w push-pull valve amp; Music First Reference transformer volume control and a tricked up Micromega CD player. He played Jeanette Lindstrom on piano and voice, it sounded sublime pure and natural and captured the ambience in the studio room perfectly.

 

The star of the NS1000 is that large magnificent beryllium dome midrange. There is nothing special about the measurements or sound of the NS1000 tweeter and it does sound a little reserved and missing some extension/shimmer. However, its all about the 'sum of the parts' and combined with mid, woofer, x-o and strong box it produces an integrated and coherent response. In light of the magnificent midrange, shown below is my version of a speaker using the NS1000 midrange. No lack of bass or treble extension with that speaker using an 80L ported box, a Raven R-2 ribbon tweeter and a German 11" Eton bass driver ...good ol' fashioned deep and punchy bass +/- 3dB @ 27 Hz according to the WIN-ISD sims. For some reason it also has excellent imaging, especially when spread out wide in the room as shown.

 

Cheers,

 

Steve.

 

Edited February 10, 2017 by Steve M

[Al.M]

I listened to the NS5000 today under reasonable shop conditions with an $8000 Yamaha S3000 integrated amp and played my reference CDs. The amp appeared to be doing a good job of driving the speakers and producing good micro detail, drive and bass. Comparison vs the better sounding of the NS1000 types circa 1980 models and 4 pairs I have owned in the last 20 years.

 

* Treble appeared more extended and silky smooth and sweet, lots of micro detail similar to some of the best hi end Scan Speak and Seas dome tweeters

* Midrange detail and sonic snap about the same, smoother and sweeter, imaging a little better. The berylium dome may have a little more snap

* Bass much better by a subjective factor of about 2-3 times, in terms of quality, extension, texture, palpability, impact etc. It did not fail in any aspect of the perfect bass on my reference CDs. Speakers were listened to with and without rear port foam plug and there will be too much bass unplugged for most average rooms and heavy notes can intrude. Plug in does not substantially reduce extension and reduces overall bass about 30%

* Overall the sound is a lot more complete and full spectrum with no shortcoming in any area, a lot sweeter and musical sound, less fatiguing, tweeter very extended similar to a good ribbon tweeter, massive bass extension and slam, imaging appeared about 20% better given the shop setup, vocals were spectacular in the league of what might be expected among the best in conventional cone/dome box speaker designs available past and present designs. Comparison against the NS1000 in the mid and treble sonic snap, clarity and detail alone it appears similar with perhaps about 10% more so not a huge jump on those aspects alone.

* Build quality, construction and appearance is superlative in terms of a conventional cone/dome box speaker design.

 

My scoring would likely improve about 20% if heard in my home with tube preamps, KT88 tube power amp and Goldmund copy power amp. 

 

IMO my cabinet modified ported and larger enclosure NS1000 heads about 60% in the direction of bass performance towards the NS5000 and influencing the overall sound. Obviously not the same.

 

Well done Yamaha significant improvement on continuing the NS1000 legend.

 

Edited February 11, 2017 by Al.M

[Al.M]

Also, I was able to listen to some B & W 802D latest version in another shop today with different amps (Class D amps) given the different room and setup, I preferred the NS5000.

 

The 802 seemed bass light and the treble not as extended, its imaging and focus was better, however the mid range was still very very good as was the whole speaker.

[Steve M]

Good report on the NS5000, sounds like it ticks all the boxes  ...was planning to head down to West Coast Hi-Fi Malaga myself today to check them out, but got way-laid by a.dent/Andrew and Tasso who visited today.

 

Steve.

[Al.M]

Give them a heads up before u go to switch the amp on to warm up, speak to Glen from the old Morely Hifi store who is now setup at this location.

 

Suggest them to pull it out from the wall further, ditch the freestanding acoustic panel behind it as it may be reflecting bass, clear the Tannoy from it etc. Note whether the port is plugged or not before reviewing it. Also, lift the speaker up another 100-200mm to reduce bass if possible. Yamaha NS1000 product info in the 1970s seemed to suggest 200mm high stand which was no good so maybe the same again for Japanese living rooms to bring tweeter to ear level sitting position?

 

Their room is big enough 8m wide, 6m deep, 3-4m ceilings, yet the bass is thunderous without port plugs.

[Steve M]

1 hour ago, Al.M said:

Give them a heads up before u go to switch the amp on to warm up, speak to Glen from the old Morely Hifi store who is now setup at this location.

 

Suggest them to pull it out from the wall further, ditch the freestanding acoustic panel behind it as it may be reflecting bass, clear the Tannoy from it etc. Note whether the port is plugged or not before reviewing it. Also, lift the speaker up another 100-200mm to reduce bass if possible. Yamaha NS1000 product info in the 1970s seemed to suggest 200mm high stand which was no good so maybe the same again for Japanese living rooms to bring tweeter to ear level sitting position?

 

Their room is big enough 8m wide, 6m deep, 3-4m ceilings, yet the bass is thunderous without port plugs.

 

 

Geez, you would think they would know to do all of that, especially Glen who is an old 1980's stalwart ...basics of hi-fi set up and deserving of a $15K speaker, where's the world going to, iPods and cheap headphones I guess??

[Al.M]

Not that, it's just that they may have something else connected and you turn up outa the blue.

[Al.M]

Here are some interesting net pictures on what's inside the NS5000. 

 

Not that it has any meaning but the midrange physical construction such as the magnet system is much more compact than the old NS1000 and dunno what the strange looking black knuckle duster structure behind the dome is on both tweeter and midrange. 

 

Small manget structure behind the midrange may just be use of high strength magnets instead of ceramics.

Edited February 10, 2017 by Al.M

[THOMO]

Albert,

Nice report.

It would be great to hear a pair.

It would also be interesting to know if they are valve amp friendly.

[kramered]

The Yamaha NS-5000 is beautifully engineered and executed. One of the best speakers I've heard in my system. I had them in for review for about 3.5 intensive weeks of listening and sonic pleasure.

 

The NS-5000s are mainly demoed with Yamaha's own integrated amplification, usually the range-topping A-S3000, and as good as that amplifier is (and they make a good pairing), the NS-5000s elevate even higher with more upmarket amplification (as you'd expect from a quality speaker). In my case, the Gryphon Antileon EVO (no need to go this high but that's what I use) provided a matching that revealed these speakers to be truly phenomenal. Quality solid state and high-power valve amps will work.

 

The NS-5000's drivers are superb and, in my opinion, provide a more refined, dynamic, sweeter yet detailed sound than the superb-even-to-this-day beryllium drivers of the NS-1000 -- a stunning speaker itself. Imaging is far better than the NS-1000 and it's a wider, higher and deeper soundstage. The build quality and the piano finish are stunning.

 

I hope Marc won't mind this non-conflicting plug but the NS-5000s appear on the cover of the current Audio Esoterica magazine with my full review inside (other excellent speakers are reviewed from Magico, B&W, Dynaudio, JL Audio and a great selection of high-end electronics). 

 

Cheers,

EK

 

[Steve M]

Thanks Edgar, high praise coming from you ...can't wait to read your review.

 

It sounds like the zylon driver material hits the mark, I'd say the sweeter sound of the NS5000 is also attributable to the deeper bass balance.

 

Cheers,

 

Steve.

Edited February 11, 2017 by Steve M

[kramered]

Thanks Steve. Indeed I think you hit it on the head re the NS-5000's tonal balance.

Cheers,

EK

[KeithL]

I really liked these when I heard them at the recent HiFi show in Melbourne and was quite surprised that not many people on Stereonet rated them very highly. Just goes to show everyone's ears are different.

[Steve M]

Would love to see a $40K stacked cost-no-object WMTMW tower version of the NS5000, for those with big rooms and deep pockets!

[The Fez]

I assume the retailers are selling these with the cone grills? I'm tempted but at $20k by gee I have problems spending that on speakers. I would really love to hook a pair of these up with my Yamaha B-2 amp to see what happens.Perhaps better still use 2 B-3's in BTL mode to drive in monoblock. 

 

You know back in the day Yamaha made a big deal (aka marketing spin!) out of matching beryllium with their wonderful vfet power transistors. Now its Zylon + vfet..ha!

 

Of course the two materials are very different. My understanding that Zylon is a synthetic polymer invented in the 80's , other examples are nylon, polyester, Berylium a natural chemical element found in a number of minerals. 

 

 

[Al.M]

Coincidentally the cabinet dimensions and internal volume of my ported NS1000 is about the same as the NS5000 specs. Other than that no general similarities or claims being made. 

 

The substantially increased bass helps to balance the leaner sound of the sealed cabinet NS1000 and I can also plug the port as well, which brings it back generally to the sealed version.

 

My cabinets are not fancy or finished as yet but below are sample pics

 

 

Edited February 11, 2017 by Al.M

[georgehifi]

On 25/07/2016 at 3:35 PM, MusicOne said:

 

Yes......Quad 57 ESLs. They are legendary and I'm sure that they would simply refuse to work with anything Yamaha

 

On 25/07/2016 at 3:42 PM, MusicOne said:

 

Arguably, the greatest speaker ever made.

 

If you want the greatest amp for them these are it, full stop, no arguments.

 

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/topic/118769-fs-mark-levinson-ml-2s-and-ml-6s/

 

Cheers George

Edited February 17, 2017 by georgehifi

[Al.M]

Great history write up of the Yamaha NS1000 and its variants in the NS5000 literature....

 

http://au.yamaha.com/en/products/audio-visual/speaker-systems/speaker-packages/ns-5000-main/history/

 

Quote 

 

"The world’s first pure beryllium diaphragms in a Yamaha masterpiece, acclaimed by audiophiles and sound professionals

The NS-1000M was the world’s first speaker system to have diaphragms made of beryllium of 99.99% purity - previously considered unobtainable - in its mid-range and tweeter. The speaker offered the accuracy and clarity of audio reproduction made possible only by beryllium diaphragms that have an excellent transient response and earned critical acclaim both at home and overseas immediately after it hit the market in 1974.

The NS-1000M was adopted as a studio monitor speaker by the Swedish national broadcasting corporation in 1976 and by the Finland National Broadcaster in 1978. Even after its successors, the NS-1000X and NS-2000 were introduced, the NS-1000M remained popular and had sold more than 200,000 units over a period of 23 years - before the production of beryllium diaphragms ended and the marketing of the legendary speaker was discontinued in 1997."

[jeromelang]

i can't remember if anyone has shared this:

 

http://my-hiend.com/wp/?????????-yamaha-ns-5000????/

[The Fez]

@jeromelang Noticing your signature. Any chance we could see a pic of your system? Specifically the Sony components!!! Wow..

[Pops110]

Had a quick listen to these today.

Very impressive. Same setup as in the pics Albert posted.

I didn't take any of my own music in but was semi familiar with what was played.

The bass and channel separation and imaging was what really stood out for me. Finish of the cabinets was amazing, but should be expected for 20k speakers.

 

I did then go and listen to Pats new speakers at War audio with Bakoon. 

 

Cheers Dave 

[Al.M]

Perth audiophiles who havnt listened to these already shouldn't drag knuckles any longer as you may miss the opportunity to hear these. They may leave the shop and not return for a few years. 

 

Although when you purchase them they come direct from Yamaha not via the shop.

 

 

 

[Hergest]

Another review.

 

http://www.livingsound.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Yamaha-NS-5000-Audio-Esoterica-Magazine-2017.pdf