Blu Ray Sales So Bad That Npd Won't Talk About It

[Caprica13]

Interesting coverage.

Not only has HD DVD end not helped Blu Ray Sales, but in the US they have tracked a 40% sale decline from Jan to Feb and then almost same bad sales in March month.

Interesting how everyone was raving around HD DVD this and HD DVD that in terms of stalling HD Growth. Could consumers finally be voting with their feet? Could consumers finally be realising the poor value monopoly situation we are faced with now? In fact sales are so bad, that research companies won't even release actual sales figures. Funny how they were throwing numbers around when it suited them eh?

Even if this is a short term thing, it's a much needed kick in the pants for the player manufacturs + Movie pricing...

http://gizmodo.com/385925/hd-dvds-death-ha...t-talk-about-em

and countless other like this have been posted...

[cooyarpjm]

I think it's the BD-Live thing that is holding back BD sales

[moebiouz]

I think it's the BD-Live thing that is holding back BD sales

I thinks that's clutching at the proverbial straws, don't you think?

If sales were so good and surpassed HD DVD previously, why would BD live be holding it back now?

[SDL]

The thing is I really preferred HD DVD. I thought it was great to have a region free system and the fact that it came to market with almost all the capability of a finished product was just brilliant. I have held off buying Blu-Ray for a variety of reasons, although I may get a PS3 sooner or later to fill the gap, (though still concerned about the region issue) before later getting a standalone machine.

I love HD movies, and sound most especially, this is something you won't be seeing (hearing) anytime soon on FTA or Foxtel, so the only format now is Blu-Ray where this is available. As I said, I haven't bought into Blu-Ray myself, and while I will argue why Blu-Ray might not take off, I do really want to see it happen as I don't want HD formats to die out and be replaced a couple of years later by an even more expensive system with more protection against people buying from other than the distribution channles dictated to them. While I am not questioning the figures in these recent reports I think that journalists being journalists tend to make up the reasons that will get the best publicity for their story and get it carried. Some seem to get some perverse pleasure then from the fact that the other format (the one they didn't choose) could be seen to be failing. I hope that isn't the case now HD DVD is gone as its pointless and juvenile.

btw this really should be in the Blu-Ray forum, or Blu-Ray/HD DVD forum, it isn't really a HD DVD issue or story.

[Hydrology]

I think it's the BD-Live thing that is holding back BD sales

Doubtful - companies like Sony et al rely on the average Joe to buy their products. Most people I speak to dont know what Profile 1.1, 2.0 or BD-Live are, and based on their body language dont care either, so long as they can plug their BluRay player into the new Laser TV they are buying!

[graham johnson]

The HD money is all being spent on HD DVD run out disks and players. There are so many Bluray people who jumped the fence at the last minute and now have a huge HD DVD library they havent even watched. There is no need for them to buy any disks.

I have been pro HD DVD from the start, and I have 30 disks unopened (from a library of 250) yet to watch. Havent bought a bluray for months !!

Edited May 4, 2008 by graham johnson

[achjimmy]

The thing is I really preferred HD DVD. I thought it was great to have a region free system and the fact that it came to market with almost all the capability of a finished product was just brilliant. I have held off buying Blu-Ray for a variety of reasons, although I may get a PS3 sooner or later to fill the gap, (though still concerned about the region issue) before later getting a standalone machine.

I love HD movies, and sound most especially, this is something you won't be seeing (hearing) anytime soon on FTA or Foxtel, so the only format now is Blu-Ray where this is available. As I said, I haven't bought into Blu-Ray myself, and while I will argue why Blu-Ray might not take off, I do really want to see it happen as I don't want HD formats to die out and be replaced a couple of years later by an even more expensive system with more protection against people buying from other than the distribution channles dictated to them. While I am not questioning the figures in these recent reports I think that journalists being journalists tend to make up the reasons that will get the best publicity for their story and get it carried. Some seem to get some perverse pleasure then from the fact that the other format (the one they didn't choose) could be seen to be failing. I hope that isn't the case now HD DVD is gone as its pointless and juvenile.

btw this really should be in the Blu-Ray forum, or Blu-Ray/HD DVD forum, it isn't really a HD DVD issue or story.

graham johnson Posted Today, 10:19 AM

The HD money is all being spent on HD DVD run out disks and players. There are so many Bluray people who jumped the fence at the last minute and now have a huge HD DVD library they havent even watched. There is no need for them to buy any disks.

I have been pro HD DVD from the start, and I have 30 disks unopened (from a library of 250) yet to watch. Havent bought a bluray for months !!

I concur with both, I havent jumped to BR yet but will for same reasons SDL stated but it will be slow ride I have a huge backlog of HD to get through and at $30+ a disc for BR i will go back to buying the odd movie here and there (5-6 a year!)

[Caprica13]

The thing is I really preferred HD DVD. I thought it was great to have a region free system and the fact that it came to market with almost all the capability of a finished product was just brilliant. I have held off buying Blu-Ray for a variety of reasons, although I may get a PS3 sooner or later to fill the gap, (though still concerned about the region issue) before later getting a standalone machine.

I love HD movies, and sound most especially, this is something you won't be seeing (hearing) anytime soon on FTA or Foxtel, so the only format now is Blu-Ray where this is available. As I said, I haven't bought into Blu-Ray myself, and while I will argue why Blu-Ray might not take off, I do really want to see it happen as I don't want HD formats to die out and be replaced a couple of years later by an even more expensive system with more protection against people buying from other than the distribution channles dictated to them. While I am not questioning the figures in these recent reports I think that journalists being journalists tend to make up the reasons that will get the best publicity for their story and get it carried. Some seem to get some perverse pleasure then from the fact that the other format (the one they didn't choose) could be seen to be failing. I hope that isn't the case now HD DVD is gone as its pointless and juvenile.

btw this really should be in the Blu-Ray forum, or Blu-Ray/HD DVD forum, it isn't really a HD DVD issue or story.

HI there.

I have posted this in the HD DVD forum as it's more topical to HD DVD devotees than Blu Ray readers. Posting something like this in the BD forum would serve to purely annoy people, which was not the intention here.

I'd say many of the users here are frustrated that HD DVD is gone since it was superior in some important ways like region free and that discs were repairable. Makes it an interesting read in this forum

[phase5]

I said ages ago I couldn't be bothered with the whole "Blu-ray vs HD-DVD" thing having survived all the other format wars.

And now that it appears to be over I have even less interest in getting the survivor.

While researching TV prices and appearances last week, (yes, I'm still saving up for a WS TV), I noticed that Blu-Ray disc's are about $40 each.

Same title on DVD is about $$30 depending on where you buy it.

So if I can get a copy of a favourite film or TV series for $30 why spend $40? And if I already have a DVD player?

The picture and sound may be better, but if it's a rubbish film why waste money?

(I'm quiet happy clooecting 50s SciFi films that you never see in australia anymore. (Ask me how via PM if interested).

If "they" want people to buy Blu-Ray disc's drop the price to the same as DVDs, (why are they $10 more anyway?), for a few years at any rate, drop the cost of Blu-Ray players to a phsyological level, eg $250.00->$350.00, something that people might go for, and maybe sales might pick up.

I still have friends who have no idea what digital tv is. They have a good analogue signal and see no reason to change. And a VCR.

Perhaps most users who have a dvd player and a good tv see no reason to change either.

[Submariner1503559614]

IMO slow sales in the USA has more to do with the R word, that they do not like saying out loud, recession. Not to mention high food prices worldwide, interest rates going up.

Anyway, Blu-ray discs will need to come down in price, if they want to grab a bigger slice of the SD DVD market.

[HTPCFreak]

It's worth noting that January to February will always have a sales drop due to seasonal variations, and that March is not a great month either. Normally you would compare the same period from last year, and I think Blu-ray sales are up compared to that, but last year was really the first major year and this year's sales figures can only go up, not down (if it had went down, then Blu-ray would be close to death).

But there hasn't been the "expected" surge in sales that many analysts were predicting, and any sales growth is still heavily relied on the PS3. It's not the most healthy situation in the world.

The problem is that the format war has cost the BDA quite a lot of money, and so there is less of it for further promotions. If defeating HD DVD was considered "easy", then defeating DVD will be much much harder, and will require even more cash, this time not aimed at studios and CE firms, but at potential customers. Unfortunately, the trend seems to be less promotions - the best consumer based promotion around was the free movie redemption deal, but that ended in January and I'm sure it affected player sales slightly. And Sony has said they don't want Chinese manufacturers to get involved to lower prices, so that's another consumer incentive out of the question for now. And with falling profits for studios, they are even less likely to offer permanent priced based incentives for movies, although I believe getting the hardware out to people's homes will be more effective in winning the war against DVDs.

But then again, the BDA thinks there's probably time to wait it out now that they don't have a real HD competitor. They won't mind if it takes beyond 2010 for Blu-ray to achieve mass accceptance.

[tvbert]

for me comes down to region coding and pricing of discs.

If prices were as competitive as USA i wouldnt mind the region coding but cause USA is better value for money my next purchase will most likely be a Jap Ps3..which again is cheaper than Aus Ps3 and lets me play the cheaper USA titles.

[Caprica13]

I for one was motivated to jump into HD DVD purely as it became a case of "too good an offer to resist". Around late last year as I was looking at purchasing some new DVDs (not HD) titles out of US, I came across the Best Buy clearances for HD DVD machines at USD$99. A quick browse of the web confirmed that I could ship a brand new unit to Australia for around $200 all up. I couldn't believe it - a quality HD player for this kind of money was just too good to pass up.

That and the price of HD DVDs being basically same as DVD made me think - we'll if I'm buying these movies anyway, may as well get them on HD. Now I am a pretty hard core Home cinema buff, but an upconverted image on my top of the line $2K DVD player running into a 50" HD plasma via HDMI was more than good enough. The decision to go HD was purely a "too good to pass up". I've said this in another posting. A good upscaling DVD player at 4m away (even on a 50" plasma) looks damn good and nearly indistiguishable from HD at a sitting distance (I have both a good uppscaling machine and an XE1, so believe i speak from experience here).

In the time runnig up to the fire sales, I bought maybe 8 titles (a very select few movies that I REALLY wanted). Never planned to own more than like 10 discs at normal pricing.

With the sales, I managed to get over 80 titles (all at $5 - $10 brand new - again, a no brainer as they were cheaper than standard def pricing), and an XE1 that I would have never imagined buying had it not been < $400 for Reon based DVD player. So we have now gone HD purely as opportunists.

The point is this - if as a home cinema enthusiast I am basically very satisfied with a DVD option and opportunistically fell into HD (the opportunity being basically over now for new buyers), why would 95% to 99% of the population (most of whom are prob using $99 LG or $50 Strathfield players) give a toss about True HD, 1080p, or whatever. Most people come home, put on the box, watch their foxtel and get their DVD rentals from their local video ezy. How many people run their HDMI plasmas via composive or S-video?

VHS to DVD was a QUANTUM leap in quality, extras, sound (5.1 vs. mono for most people). DVD to HD DVD/Blu Ray is a tiny incremental upgrade vs. DVD for most people. Even 1080p vs. 720p in most cases is indistiguishable on all but the largest and best LCDs. And most people didn't get into DVD until they were everywhere and you could buy machines for < $100. AND this is all in moving from archaic VHS.

So here's my humble view. Until HD basically replaces DVD at same price and that's the only thing on offer, which is some years away, I don't see Blu Ray or anything else setting the world on fire. People need something really dramatic to push them to move. I mean, most are still on analogue TV (what happened to cutting off analogue this year?)

Oh, and the comment someone made about recession in US driving low sales. Mate, you prob don't have a mortage. Checked our interest rates recently? With much of the country (at least in major citites) mortaged to the hilt, HD is like the luxury within luxury spending that will quickly get pushed back. Don't worry,the receission will hit us soon enough.

With all the money Sony burned trying to win this war, the only way they will recoup is by pushing high profits in the short term (which means not much lowering of prices). I hope people are smart enough to see this and demand value before they spend. At least in US, this seems to be happening.

Edited May 4, 2008 by Caprica13

[cowabungadude]

why is this in the HD-DVD section, this is obvious trolling

[davep]

why is this in the HD-DVD section, this is obvious trolling

Your question has already been answered by the OP - read the thread.

[phase5]

IMO slow sales in the USA has more to do with the R word, that they do not like saying out loud, recession. Not to mention high food prices worldwide, interest rates going up.

Anyway, Blu-ray discs will need to come down in price, if they want to grab a bigger slice of the SD DVD market.

"Just don't mention the recession. I think I mentioned it once, but I got away with it".

Good point.

I've already started to receive emails from the states encouraging me to spend my "IRS Stimulation Refund Cheque" on some toy.

That's right folks, when you're flushing your economy down the toilet by throwing trillions of BORROWED dollars at a unending and unwinnable "war against evil" in the middle east; and your economy starts to collapse under the weight of it all; print some more money and tell your people to go shopping. Once you're out of office you can blame it all on someone else.

Anyone else more concerned over the future, then the price of Blu-ray disc's?

[cooyarpjm]

The future is already F##### so we might as well enjoy our life time. The next generation will never afford a house, won't be able to drive a car, and will have to live on home brand food. all because of a greedy bunch of oil barrons and landlords.

Hence the reason i never had children!

So lets loose ourselves in some good quality HD Movies

Edited May 4, 2008 by cooyarpjm

[SteveT]

I stopped buying Blu Rays for a few months while I snapped up all the HD-DVD's I wanted. Now in the last month I'm back to getting Blu Rays again since I've got every HD-dvd I wanted. Probably catching up the couple months I missed.

I may slow down a bit though as I haven't watched half of what I've purchased yet.

[Caprica13]

Wow, the topic is getting rather philosophical

On the topic of blu ray, had a look around on the weekend. There may be 5 titles at most worth getting. The rest looks like crud. Should start seeing a lot more titles from mid year, but am I the only one who thinks that BD titles are rather lacking right now? I wonder what all these fire sales on HD DVD will do to HD demand though this year and whether people that went both simply won't buy the same titles again in Blu?

Interesting also how all the newest titles appear to be "B" coded where older movies have ABC coding.

[SDL]

Wow, the topic is getting rather philosophical

On the topic of blu ray, had a look around on the weekend. There may be 5 titles at most worth getting. The rest looks like crud. Should start seeing a lot more titles from mid year, but am I the only one who thinks that BD titles are rather lacking right now? I wonder what all these fire sales on HD DVD will do to HD demand though this year and whether people that went both simply won't buy the same titles again in Blu?

Interesting also how all the newest titles appear to be "B" coded where older movies have ABC coding.

This is the other problem I have had, looked at the titles locally and seen them at the prices of new release DVD's and thought maybe one or two I would have bought as DVD's on new release but that's all. So not enough around to make me jump into buying a machine, at least not locally.

[Guest Magic Rat]

This is the other problem I have had, looked at the titles locally and seen them at the prices of new release DVD's and thought maybe one or two I would have bought as DVD's on new release but that's all. So not enough around to make me jump into buying a machine, at least not locally.

The region coding and subsequent price differential combined with the unfinished specification has put me off BD so far, I am hoping a decent profile 2.0 region hacked stand alone will be avilable by October ( ish ), until then I'll stick with the upscaling prowess of my EP35.

[ivor biggin]

The thing is I really preferred HD DVD. I thought it was great to have a region free system and the fact that it came to market with almost all the capability of a finished product was just brilliant. I have held off buying Blu-Ray for a variety of reasons, although I may get a PS3 sooner or later to fill the gap, (though still concerned about the region issue) before later getting a standalone machine.

I love HD movies, and sound most especially, this is something you won't be seeing (hearing) anytime soon on FTA or Foxtel, so the only format now is Blu-Ray where this is available. As I said, I haven't bought into Blu-Ray myself, and while I will argue why Blu-Ray might not take off, I do really want to see it happen as I don't want HD formats to die out and be replaced a couple of years later by an even more expensive system with more protection against people buying from other than the distribution channles dictated to them. While I am not questioning the figures in these recent reports I think that journalists being journalists tend to make up the reasons that will get the best publicity for their story and get it carried. Some seem to get some perverse pleasure then from the fact that the other format (the one they didn't choose) could be seen to be failing. I hope that isn't the case now HD DVD is gone as its pointless and juvenile.

btw this really should be in the Blu-Ray forum, or Blu-Ray/HD DVD forum, it isn't really a HD DVD issue or story.

i really like my xe1 [thus hd dvd].........as apposed from using blu on ps3 which i begrudgenly do

[ivor biggin]

The region coding and subsequent price differential combined with the unfinished specification has put me off BD so far, I am hoping a decent profile 2.0 region hacked stand alone will be avilable by October ( ish ), until then I'll stick with the upscaling prowess of my EP35.

speaking of magic rats.......the other day i hit one over the head with a hammer and made him disappear

[Caprica13]

Actually on the subject of XE1 I have yet to see any HD player (HD DVD or Blu) that beats or even matches the picture quality. The sharpness, color, everything just jumps off the screen. Everytime I look at playback in the stores from either Pana units, or Pioneer or whatever the image just looks ordinary, even on good plasmas like Pioneer or Pana.

Are there any players BD players on the market that actually give you a beter picture than the XE1?

[The_Preacher1973]

It's worth noting that January to February will always have a sales drop due to seasonal variations, and that March is not a great month either. Normally you would compare the same period from last year...

Yes. Normally you would. And journalists more familar with the Home Entertainment market not looking to score cheap shots against Blu-ray have:

"Blu-Ray Disc Buoys overall market, lifting sales in the first quarter over last year.

The home video industry received a rosy report card for the first quarter with a suprising lift in consumer spending after two down years.

Consumer spending on DVD’s and Blu-Ray Discs in the first three months of this year was up about 1% from the first three months of 2007, coming in at $5.51 billion, up from $5.46 billion in the first quarter of last year according to Home Media Magazine market research estimates based on studio retail data.

Sales were up 2.3% to $3.47 billion from $3.39 billion while rental spending slipped 1.6% to $2.04 billion from $2.07 billion.

The cheery sales picture also saw unit sales to consumers rise 2.6% to 231,928 units from 225,999 units in the first quarter of 2007.

And according to Nielsen Videoscan sales data, the nascent Blu-ray Disc saved the day for the sellthrough business with DVD unit sales in the first quarter down 1.2% from the first quarter of 2007 but Blu-Ray Disc Sales up a whopping 351%.

Steve Beeks, president and co-COO of Lionsgate, said the mini-major had the best calendar quarter for home entertainment in its history with a market share of 9%, up from 6.8% in the first quarter of 2007.

He noted that DVD was holding its own with new-release DVD sales only slightly below new-release DVD sales in the first quarter of 2007 even though their collective box office value was 9% less than in the year-ago quarter.

Catalog sales, meanwhile, were up 2% while Blu-ray’s phenomenal unit sales gains were magnified by the format’s higher margins.

“Blu-ray had its second-best week ever in the week ended March 23 and we anticipate Blu-ray sales of $800 million to $1 billion-plus for all of 2008, up dramatically from approximately $300 million last year,” Beeks said."

Home Media Magazine

Still, full marks to the OP for managing to start another "BD's Failing" thread.