PWilson

I used to buy metal tapes in an attempt to eke out better sound...

I recommend these canalphones http://www.headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=321. They block a good amount of outside noise, and have excellent sound quality for the money. I'd almost always go for canalphones in favour of active noise cancelling, as canalphones block every sound instead of just some frequencies, and generally will produce higher quality music.

Don't get 701s unless you're going to amp them. You'll be disappointed. I've got the AD700s you linked in your first post. They're very easy to listen to, fairly detailed, nice and fast. They're like slightly smoother K701-lite. Not quite as detailed or fast, but not as dry either. If you go closed, for the same price point, you will lose some speed, gain some bass impact, but also some bass bloom.

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Needed to advertise pre-stimulation, so people had something to aim for. Otherwise they've likely spent it or banked it already .

Muddy? I won't argue that they overemphasise the bass (they do), but personally, I can't see the bass being called muddy. To my ears it's quite detailed. I haven't listened to a much classical (if any) through them, but for all metal/rock/jazz that I've had through them, I'm more likely to be able to follow the bass guitar lines than on say, the K701's (which I like, given I play bass (badly)), and can hear a lot more detail in the lower frequencies. When I first put them in, I noticed the recessed mids. As my ears have become accustomed, I am quite happy with the sound signature (though I still know they're not perfectly neutral), and can jump between the TripFi's, the K701's, and speakers, with no real sense of jarring from the different sound sigs.

Another bump for a great deal. I've forwarded this to multiple friends, but it's just bad timing for most $$ wise. Hell, I'd have bought it myself if the timing had been different.

While it was an issue initially, I've gotten used to the foot thumps to the point where I simply don't notice them, ever. I run with canalphones in and am quite happy with it (just have to pay more attention for traffic). I concur on buying Ety or UE in the states and getting them shipped here by a friend (if possible). The markup for the Australian market is ridiculous, and due to exclusivity agreements and whatnot, the US sites will often not ship here (or if they do, shipping is exorbitant). If you don't have someone there who can accept and forward a package for you, consider these guys: http://www.priceusa.com.au/ I have to disagree with RD a little in that if you're getting into the higher end, the Etys (which I've not heard) are meant to be closest to the AKG sound, but my experience with UE (I have TripleFi10s) is that they emphasise the bass a little, but it's very good bass (able to pick out details more easily). High end is nowhere near the K701s. A very different signature to K701s, but for me, a nice contrast between my portable and home rigs. Also, I feel in a noisy environment, a little bass bump is actually quite a good thing. I don't take my UE's to the gym though. There I use cheaper/smaller/more robust stuff like the Senns (I got lucky and got non-fakes for $30 on ebay), or the TDK cheapies. Sanda = sad panda player? Teehee.

Kye covered what I was going to say about active/passive cancellation. I have Senn CX300 (the base canalphones). Pretty decent sound for what they are (better than any other portable earphone/headphone I'd heard to that point, but beaten by good headphones and more expensive canalphones). I've also tried VSonic canalphones, and they're definitely better. They used to be cheaper than the Senns on Headphonic, but are now more expensive. Makes it a bit of a toss up. Both infinitely superior to the $15 TDK canalphones I picked up while I was waiting for cable for my good pair. But the TDK does its job for a $15 pair... For fit, Etymotic bi/tri flanges are by far the most intrusive/uncomfortable, and they're not really feasible for constant in/out. But once they're in, I can deal with them (have Ety earplugs). The single/biflange silicons that come with the Senn/UE/VSonic line are very comfortable and among the sizes, you should find a good fit. Foams are also an option, but the stock foams with UE's are terribad. I now use aftermarket foams (Shure black olives) on my UE's for better isolation (and because I kept losing the silicon tips if I put my player in my phones in my pocket/around my neck and went to the pub. The black olives are a HELL of a tight fit to put on, but they're on good). DRM is the devil, but you already know that.

My CD's are arranged roughly by genre rather than alphabetically, so my Sarah McLachlan and Missy Higgins (and even some Sophie B Hawkins!) sits far away from my Death, Iron Maiden and Sadus. The worst CD's I have are probably two I bought unheard on release, based on prior knowledge of the band. Shadows Fall's Fallout from the War, and In Flames' A Sense of Purpose. At least the Shadows Fall album turned out to be a contract breaker, and was followed by a very good release. In Flames actually wrote that garbage believing it was good. Oh, and I have a Diana Krall that I bought as an intro to jazz. I'd say I despise her, but she to bland for such emotion. I've since discovered real jazz and been far more impressed. Bumby, are you serious on the Iron Butterfly front? The rest of the album might be psychedelic fluff (which some people my like), but IAGDV is without peer. Oh, and Tracy Chapman is awesome.

I bought a pair of Audio Technicas off them about... a year and a half ago? I remember they took a while coming, but they got here in the end.

Do so. Your only regret will be that the original will never be the same You're right - sabbath means rest, and the sabbath day represents a day of rest. I was referring to the band, and the image they're often given. Woo... got to check out the vid seeing I'm at home. I don't think I care for the lyrical structure that much, but man, Geezer and Bill Ward are still pumping it out (yes, Iommi was no slouch either). I like the sound.

Aye, they formed up for the tour under the Heaven and Hell name, and this is the first album of new material. Kinda apt name given Dio means God in Latin, and Sabbath represent hell Should be some good stuff. I generally preferred when Dio had the mic. The version of Iron Man with Dio on Live Evil takes the original and smashes it into a thousand little pieces.

I endorse this post Of course there are many things that cloud the situation, foremost among them the fact that artists need to be reimbursed for their work. However, there are many things that it pains me to see commodified, as you say. Principal among these is music, the artform that touches me most profoundly.

I apologise for the (admittedly deliberate) offensive tone. But truth be told, I was offended. The repetitive posts, I felt, were not serving any purpose in what had become quite a reasonable discussion topic. Furthermore, we're all adults here. We should be able to speak as we would face to face, without hiding behind innuendo. Anyway, discussion continues, so I'll quiet down.

I don't think I've been backward about my reason for downloading. My musical tastes lie outside the norm, and it's the only way to find new music. Once I know whether I like something, I buy, or I don't buy, so I'm quite comfortable with where I am, and while I end up buying more CD's this way than I would if I didn't download, I don't feel the need to justify it one way or another to you. I put it out there so open minded people can see the (imo, positive) net result. Sticking it to the man (the industry) would realistically be a great outcome, but in my case, it's not what happens (because, as I said earlier in the thread, I spend lots of money on CDs). Still, I'm interested by the discussions sparked here, and am keeping tabs. An artist doesn't own thier work when the record companies get hold of it. I think that's horrible. But again... this hasn't stopped me buying their CD's. When I had less earning power, I used to get tapes off friends. I know it was theft and you know it was theft, but I would repeat the process if put in the situation again (actually, I also spent a good portion of my pocket money on CD's of my own, but that's of no consequence). Now? I don't have to. But I still have no real negative feelings about teenagers downloading (yes, stealing) music. For what music is, I think it's horrible that people should be denied it due to their financial situation. Call me Robin Hood. Call me Sadam Hussein. I don't really care. Just stop the 'they', 'we', 'people' nonsense. Or if I'm not included in your little hate group, call rippingdragon out alone. He's a big boy and can handle it. He's put his balls on the table. If you're going to take a shot at them, be man enough to do the same, please. Now if you'd be so kind to step down from that horse? The sun's getting in my eyes from all the way down here.

I believe that the pre-out on the sub will just be a passthrough to allow daisy chain, as the vendor has told Janus. Everyone's speaking like the pre-power jumper on the back of the amp is a common thing. I had no idea such a thing was even done >_<.

Sorry to speak for you, mate. While I agree with a lot of what you're saying, I don't think you have to justify yourself to me anyway. BTW, the vigilante bit was meant to be a positive >_<. While I agree it's silly, I have no illusions that the record labels wouldn't convict me if they stumbled across me. They wouldn't see my purchases beforehand (I've only purchased the aforementioned single online - not including Amazon orders), and as far as they're concerned, I've downloaded illegally (and shared - to rip and not re-seed would be selfish), and need to be punished. Record labels are not rational people who care about intent or about art. They care about the fat and dirty dollar.

Bear, Janus, I'm really impressed the NAD amp has that functionality. That's very cool, and it'd be nice if every integrated did that. My Cambridge certainly doesn't, though, and I don't believe most integrateds on the market do. I'm under the impression that most of the time that connection is hardwired internally. Janus, I believe your options are generally going to be thus: 1) Buy a new integrated. Hook pre-out of integrated to sub line level in. Integrated controls volume, but the speakers will run full range. 2) Buy a new integrated and a passive high pass filter. Now you limit the frequency going to the speakers, but I believe you don't get full benefit because the integrated is still told to produce the lower frequencies, and then the filter takes them out after the fact. The speakers will be happier though. 3) Buy a pre-power combo (or integrated that allows you to separate pre and power) and an active x-over. Pre into x-over into sub and power amp. This is what Nigel is talking about, and is the ultimate solution (performance wise), as your power amp is free of low signals, and your sub amp is free of high signals. It's also the most $$ solution, though.

Yes, I suppose my definition of 'the music industry' is a bit narrow. In terms of music as a whole, I have no doubt that if the profits got turned right down to zero and musicians lived relying on each day's paycheque... the lion's share would still be doing what they're doing. We're talking about artists creating art, not corporate fatcats making a new brand of toothpaste (this is also why I like the idea of teenagers and people with low funds still having access to music). Of course I don't want musicians to become poor, but I don't really think that's a realistic outcome. I read from RD's post that he listens to a hell of a lot of music, and tries to put money back to the musicians in a way that bypasses the record labels. That's partly vigilante, and partly selfish, but the decisions he makes are his own. I still stand by my view that illegal downloading hasn't hurt the industry as much as they make out, because there are a good portion of people who use it to discover new music, and then go out and buy. As a result of illegal downloading, I've spent more money on CDs than I otherwise would have, because I would have had less to buy. The people that really stand to lose the most $$ are the people who will still make the most $$ anyway. I realise full well that it's illegal for people to copy their music, but I sleep with a clean conscience anyway. The industry may try to convince you that every album downloaded is a lost sale, but really people wouldn't have bought all that they've downloaded. Oh, I have no doubt he'd be tried and convicted in a court of law. So would I. So would anyone who's copied a CD to use in their car . I have justified what I do to myself and am quite comfortable with it (especially given that as stated, the industry has made more money off me this way), and I just have to hope that the law doesn't come after me.

Firstly, the 'music industry' can bite me. I've read about plenty of bands either pushed into releasing an album that wasn't ready, pushed into making an album that didn't sound like they wanted, pushed into an image that didn't represent them, but gave mass appeal. The industry for the most part cares about number one, and they can do plenty of that on the street where they belong. I care about artists, not labels. I love that the internet and the digital age is actually starting to free artists up to release independantly. Secondly, read RD's post. Reznor was happy with the profit they turned on The Slip as an experiment, even though they offered the downloads (right up to the 24/96, as RD pointed out) for free. He admitted it wasn't a huge profit (but it was definitely profit), but was positive that it puts them in a position where some tuning of the business model can increase revenue. In the webcast linked, someone asked what he thought of attaching advertising to his free distribution to add to profits. He said the image of the band was worth more than the advertising dollars. The man is an artist, who wants people to appreciate his art, and has my utmost respect. I put it to you that a good deal of people who downloaded The Slip and didn't pay for it did so because they're lazy, not because they're cheap. Even making the downloads easier to access via a paid portal would increase revenue, imo. Personally, I didn't pay because I don't really listen to NIN and was just curious to hear some 24/96. I don't have the files on my HDD anymore. I have paid for some Iron Maiden singles that I wanted that weren't released in Australia, to go with a CD that I already owned.

Reznor has some very cool things going on with moving NIN independant and trying out net based methods of distribution. I'd love to see something along these lines become the norm, so the record industry can go down in flames and artists can get not only greater control of their work, but a greater percentage of the profits as well. Oh... not sure I'd be keen on the 'fund the new album' approach. While I definitely get attached to bands who write music I like, inevitably almost all of them wander out of the genres they started with, and end up writing stuff I have no interest in or is outright bad. I prefer to know I like the music, and then reimburse the band for the enjoyment that music's giving me. I'd feel dirty if I'd funded some of the rubbish that bands I like have put out lately.

Oh... that would probably work. I'm not familiar with using the crossovers within the sub for splitting high and low. I'm not entirely sure sub plate amps are set up capable of doing that, though (sending on just the high pass). You also need to consider volume control, then. I assume you're now speaking of sending the signal from the CDP to the sub first, then to the amp (but in this case, why does the amp need pre-outs - should be able to try this with his existing setup). You'd need to use the sub volume control as master control and have the integrated on a fixed volume. Unless you're talking about CDP to amp, to sub, to amp... but then you can't really do that because you're talking about 2 inputs into the amp, where really you can only have 1. I don't really know of any integrated amps that have a seperate in for the pre and power sections. This would work with seperates though. CDP -> pre -> sub -> power.

Sending the pre-outs to the sub will still leave the amp sending a full signal to the speakers, so no real gain on that part. However, it will relieve the amp of actually powering the sub (which it is currently doing - the sub's own plate amp is being bypassed), so the speakers should get a better signal overall. Crackling wise... that amp's 40w. Driving a sub as well as main speakers, it might be struggling and clipping? I'm not really sure what a clipping amp sounds like, though.

You have read what you wished to read, and only what you wished to read . The collection of CD's I own far outweighs the downloaded music I have but do not own, and I'm always on the lookout for those CD's at the shops.