pwstereo Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, audiofeline said: It's quite a stretch to make that assumption. The lacquer board would have properties that make it suitable for the manufacturing step it's designed for. That's totally unrelated to the use of final (record) product, that doesn't emerge until many steps after the lacquer board is used in the manufacturing sequence. It sounds a bit like, 'by serving the matured cheese on a board made from curds and whey, the cheese tastes better'. Edited May 5, 2020 by pwstereo Spelling 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martykt Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 21 minutes ago, audiofeline said: Thanks for the reply. Can you take it one more step for me? How does this affect the speaker. Does the speaker's impedance change with diff freq's? And how does flattening this affect the speaker? There are probably much better qualified members to answer your questions as I can't claim to be an expert here. Yes as the frequency changes so does the impedance. My understanding is that the impedance will spike at the resonant frequency and will rise as the frequency rises. As for the effect on the speaker this is where things start to get complicated... These couple of links are probably a good place to start understanding impedance curves and Zobel Circuits. http://audiojudgement.com/speaker-impedance-curve-explained/ https://speakermakersjourney.blogspot.com/2016/12/crossover-basics-zobel_8.html?m=1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Dog RJ Posted May 4, 2020 Author Share Posted May 4, 2020 16 hours ago, PKay said: @Big Dog RJwhere did you get the mat from? Yeah sorry about that, seems like I was too engaged in the music! I meant to provide the info and was too caught up trying to hide the thing away from the wifey since she wanted to use it as a cake tray... Audio Heaven is the name of the importer. Contact Craig Johnston, his details are on the website. Great drive up countryside, horses grazing, sheep running around and suddenly Audio Heaven! Must be heaven... Cheers mate, and if you get one let me know what you think. Best, RJ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Dog RJ Posted May 4, 2020 Author Share Posted May 4, 2020 (edited) Ok, I'm beginning to understand this thing now, as I was not aware such an issue existed, let alone resonances. Well I knew about resonances in the form of air-borne vibrations but to think so far ahead in regards to perfecting a TT's performance is quite fascinating. There's no doubt about TT / analog accessories that fit well into any given system to further enhance its performance. Such items as cartridges, arms, levelling, isolation platforms, springs, bearing footers and the list goes on, plus the expense is limitless... but to come across a product like this, scratch my head into thinking why they made it so big (diameter being larger than standard mats plus LPs) was for certain reasons. Re. Andy: Their response was that they can make a disc/mat to suit smaller sizes, great!... but it would be very expensive, in fact more costly than this one! Bummer... I'm also thinking about the fact where we spend quite large sums to acquire the best cartridges, arms etc., if only we first tried this thing out, then perhaps we could learn more about the TT's we're using, plus save an awful lot of $$$ on those expensive carts! Obviously the cart is necessary but one that costs close to the total of a system itself...is that really necessary? I also noticed the intriguing build quality and finish of their products, just beautiful! A true work of art! I'm impressed! I wonder how their gear sounds like. Once again, reminds me of Kondo Audio Note, a highly specialized brand in SOTA SET amplification, which I absolutely love but will not spend that kind of money on. The Spec brand seems to be the SS version of K-Audio Note. Even their TT, what a beauty! That's the one I would think of, if I was ever to replace the mighty fine RP8. I do know for a fact that when they make something, they engage in the total surroundings, not just the components... they take into consideration their culture, their reasons, their presence and the universe, and then create something truly special. Whether we like it or not is up to us but most of the time it does engage the senses in total awe... I used to work for a Japanese company reporting to a Japanese boss, they were very connected to their heart and their surroundings, and so the business and product offerings flourished. Still to this day it remains as one of the top tier companies in its industry. I may get a chance to experience their amplifiers since our local importer carries the brand. I need to check whether he's got any on hand for a demo. Then I'll get an idea of what exactly these masters in their craft are up to. Till then, cheers and keep those fine tunes spinning! RJ Edited May 5, 2020 by Big Dog RJ Suggestion to edit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gnnett Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 @andyr the original post identifies that someone is using this mat on an LP12 already. Have you been able to find out how they are using it, I assume without machining the mat or the platter. Report says it is working fine for them, so might be worth trying how they are using it. Cheers Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyr Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 27 minutes ago, gnnett said: @andyr the original post identifies that someone is using this mat on an LP12 already. Have you been able to find out how they are using it, I assume without machining the mat or the platter. Report says it is working fine for them, so might be worth trying how they are using it. Cheers Grant Grant - they are using it on an LP12, as is. iow, the mat is supported only by the outside lip of the platter. Sure, that 'works' ... but, to me it is not acceptable. Andy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gnnett Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Hi Andy Ah ha, so the same is probably true for the guy who wrote the review of this and a selection of other mats on dagogo, using an LP12. I understand your concern, although I wonder if the relative stiffness of the matt doesn't happily span the 295mm, under the max 180g uniform distributed load of the lp, with negligible deflection. It would definitely impart a relatively uniform response to the tracking of the stylus compared to the matt sitting on a platter with varying thickness. Yes a larger response, but still likely to be negligible. I have never been able to bring myself to try the ring mat, for exactly the same reason this option does not feel right to you. So, I do agree with you it does not appear sensible. I would however be very keen, post COVID, to offer RJ a cheeky red, or ale, to bring his mat around to try it out on my LP12 platter, just in the interests of science of course. Cheers Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyr Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, gnnett said: I understand your concern, although I wonder if the relative stiffness of the mat doesn't happily span the 295mm, under the max 180g uniform distributed load of the lp, with negligible deflection. I'm sure it does have negligible deflection, with the 180/200gms of an LP, Grant. My issue is that the mat just resting on the outer rim of the platter is a completely different situation to when the whole underside of the mat rests on the platter. And this latter scenario was what the mat was designed for. I'm sure the SPEC mat sounds good on an LP12 - I just think you are not getting the full advantages of the mat, if you put it onto an LP12 platter. 3 minutes ago, gnnett said: It would definitely impart a relatively uniform response to the tracking of the stylus compared to the mat sitting on a platter with varying thickness. I don't understand why you mention a "platter with varying thickness "? Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t_mike Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 I think he means mat with varying thickness. But that means little, as records have an equal amount of varying thickness. Take the mat off your platter and check it with a dial indicator and you will probably find up to 2/10ths of a millimetre warp. It won't be visible to the naked eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gnnett Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 1 minute ago, andyr said: I don't understand why you mention a "platter with varying thickness "? Hi Andy Just that the LP12 platter thickness does vary in thickness, but the SPEC platter appears to be the same thickness, based on its weight. Not suggesting it is right to support the mat on the perimeter and happy for you to choose not to try it that way. Cheers Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyr Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, gnnett said: Hi Andy Just that the LP12 platter thickness does vary in thickness, but the SPEC platter appears to be the same thickness, based on its weight. Not suggesting it is right to support the mat on the perimeter and happy for you to choose not to try it that way. Cheers Grant I think you meant "Just that the LP12 platter mat does vary in thickness "? I'm sure it does! (I don't use one. ) Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gnnett Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 On 04/05/2020 at 7:32 AM, Ittaku said: Their entire range was looking interesting, and then I came across this... "thing": https://spec-corp.co.jp/e/audio/RSP-AZ9EX/index.html I am guessing that you would not be interested in this upgraded model then? https://spec-corp.co.jp/audio/RSP-URUSHI/index.html Cheers Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ittaku Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 10 minutes ago, gnnett said: I am guessing that you would not be interested in this upgraded model then? https://spec-corp.co.jp/audio/RSP-URUSHI/index.html The special anniversary limited edition run of just 30 units with the bush warbler in the blossoming ume tree print on walnut timber veneer is clearly going to make this "sound processor" sound far better. Worth every cent of its $3000 USD pretax recommended price. Sometimes I'm embarrassed to be a Japanese translator... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gnnett Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, Ittaku said: Sometimes I'm embarrassed to be a Japanese translator... Don't be embarrassed, you have brightened my day. I will have smile on my face for a few hours yet. As disappointing as you may find the economic values of this, it has nothing on the lunacy of the stamp world where, if you own the last two examples of the rarest stamp in the world, the best way to increase your nett worth, is to burn one of them. Cheers Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwstereo Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 12 minutes ago, Ittaku said: ...with the bush warbler in the blossoming ume tree print on walnut timber veneer is clearly going to make this "sound processor" sound far better. You forgot "harvested at night during autumn when the sap is at its lowest flow". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grant Slack Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 On 03/05/2020 at 10:06 PM, Martykt said: No voodoo here @Big Dog RJ. A turntable mat like this works by changing the resonant frequency between the platter and the record. Very interesting, I wonder if it would be similar to using a copper mat. Hello Martykt, can you (or anyone) provide numbers for the "resonant frequency between the platter and the record", please? Showing the difference, in Hz, with two different mats? cheers Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martykt Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 3 hours ago, Grant Slack said: Hello Martykt, can you (or anyone) provide numbers for the "resonant frequency between the platter and the record", please? Showing the difference, in Hz, with two different mats? cheers Grant No sorry, I don't have those figures as they will vary depending on what material is used and I don't happen to be the designer of any particular turntable or mat. I have been told the reason some turntables use acrylic platters is apparently because the resonant frequency of acrylic is very close to that of the actual vinyl. I'm not sure exactly what frequency that is though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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