31 minutes ago, Javs said:

I'm not sure if you genuinely mean 24/7, but if so that's a waste of power.

You want some circulating air in there 24/7. Doesn't need to be some massive exhaust, just something. This is why I favour the ERV. Uses about the same as a light bulb. Worth it in my opinion.

 

Its not like a normal room that has a window or is built not so well and is leaky. The air will just sit there and get stale. Being on the coast that air could be (will be) humid. No air movement and humid air = mold.

 

Just putin it out there.

 

Have a read of what Dennis says here

 

Also if you want check out ventilation standards for passivehaus. The house wont be, but your room will basically be built to passive standards

 

Edited August 10, 20196 yr by Peter the Greek

31 minutes ago, Peter the Greek said:

You want some circulating air in there 24/7. Doesn't need to be some massive exhaust, just something. This is why I favour the ERV. Uses about the same as a light bulb. Worth it in my opinion.

 

Its not like a normal room that has a window or is built not so well and is leaky. The air will just sit there and get stale. Being on the coast that air could be (will be) humid. No air movement and humid air = mold.

 

Just putin it out there.

 

Have a read of what Dennis says here

 

Also if you want check out ventilation standards for passivehaus. The house wont be, but your room will basically be built to passive standards

 

Interesting read. Though as for when the theatre is not in use. I still dont see why I need something running in there 24x7, door ajar or open should be enough, plus when the AC in the house is on in that zone, it will also put air in there.

 

This is not really a discussion about weather I plan to exchange air or not, thats  given, I will be exchanging air. Reading your link looks like I should be aiming for 6 times an hour. That means it will take 10 minutes to have completely new air in there. Not bad at all.

 

Would you mind linking me to the air exhanger system you mentioned? - EDIT -  I see you posted the link earlier already, thanks.

Edited August 10, 20196 yr by Javs

I think I will be trying extra hard to have them put in a return AC line in the room.

On 10/08/2019 at 8:13 PM, Javs said:

I think I will be trying extra hard to have them put in a return AC line in the room.

It shouldn’t be that hard for them.  McDonald Jones do actron air systems?  Do you know what model you’re getting?

 

i found with our builder I needed to get exact model/part numbers etc. to make sure the thing had been spec’ed properly 

28 minutes ago, Zinzan said:

It shouldn’t be that hard for them.  McDonald Jones do actron air systems?  Do you know what model you’re getting?

 

i found with our builder I needed to get exact model/part numbers etc. to make sure the thing had been spec’ed properly 

I am going to be upgrading to pretty much the best one with 8 zones, ESP Platinum. I spent quite a bit of time on the Actron Air website and I want the full beans!

 

We will be installing solar too so the electricity wont be much of an issue.

 

The one is comes with by default with the package only has 2 zones Model SRA233 . But its a very big powerful unit still, ive seen it in person. But I need more zones, and want the more efficient unit.

Yep ok ... im doing the Actron Que for many the same reasons.  The efficiency on these new models with digital inverters etc seems great. 

 

The challenge for a return air duct on the two storey house is the limited space they’ve got to run it, and get it in a riser up to the second storey roof as well.  I had this challenge in our old house, there was not enough space in the riser to get another duct through.  

 

If they build it in the design of the house it should be solvable, but again with a volume builder they’re not going to want to do this. 

 

The solution in our old place was a passive air return duct .... ran through the bulkhead with a few bends (the dead vent concept) and then hopped it over to vent into the antechamber to the cinema room, and there was then a final vent from that room into the main area of the house.  The final vent I didn’t even bother boxing up, there was no impact to the sound proofing solution at that point.

Edited August 13, 20196 yr by Zinzan

Hi Javs,

 

Just wondering if you've decided on the clips and channel you're going to use. Did you settle on the Rondo 237 clip with 16mm 308 channel or something else?

 

How's it going otherwise? Any updates?

 

Thanks

@Javs Keen to hear of any updates to your build

On 22/09/2020 at 9:46 AM, minireza said:

@Javs Keen to hear of any updates to your build

Not there yet...

 

Land is about to register then all systems go, still a ways off from being able to make sawdust in the theatre...

On 17/09/2020 at 5:37 PM, br0d0 said:

Hi Javs,

 

Just wondering if you've decided on the clips and channel you're going to use. Did you settle on the Rondo 237 clip with 16mm 308 channel or something else?

 

How's it going otherwise? Any updates?

 

Thanks

Will be using the bigger rondo channel, not sure 16mm is enough to really work properly so dont want to lose performance based on 10mm. Will probably use 129.

 

Also might look at price on Rondo STWC clips. Also want to make sure I am getting all the performance I can.

 

Just scrolling back in this thread and realised I hadn't shared anything for ages in regards to plans etc.

 

We have full house plans now and the cinema has been thought out a fair bit more...

 

Here is what it all looks like at the moment.

 

So the builder didn't want the angle of the entry to be exactly 45degrees due to not encroaching on the entry way to our house, and I am OK with this, was annoyed at first as I lost a little bit of precious internal space to theatre, but after thinking on it, its totally fine. This means the entry to the cinema is a little on the tight side, I wish the door was on the side, but then we didnt want the theatre door to be all the way at the front door of the house, this way it will still look welcoming from afar as you walk up to the entrance from the family room.

 

The little bar section we have is about 2m wide, its actually going to house 4x 18" subs in there to act as near field subs so they serve a dual purpose. This was done because we went all the way around the world in therms of how can we maybe fit like a platform at the back like a lot of traditional theatres have etc, but we just ended up stripping it back and I am really happy with this.

 

What we did manage to do though is widen the whole cinema, we realised having a 1.8m wide entry to our house with huge double doors was a bit overkill, so I saw a chance to add 30cm to the width of the theatre, which also widens the children's activity room upstairs, and go to a single 1200 door which is still huge. Win win there.

 

The projector will live in the study completely outside the room. This will give me throw for a huge 165inch screen and complete noise control in the room. There is a big rack there in the study too, you can see both of those place-holders below.

 

Plan is to clip and channel the entire room, double drywall and green glue, window plugs and possibly even drywall over the windows completely, and then all cabling, lighting and air conditioning etc will travel through the soffit we will build inside the room shell. This way hopefully we can minimise any issues with compromising sound proofing to the exterior of the house. I am aware that some sound will escape within the house especially through the planned port window for the projector, but that was never really the brief here.

 

 

 

 

Some renders I have done...

 

Definitely tight in there, but looks like we will have no trouble making it work. I have actually been IN this room in VR and walked all the way around it and sat in the sofa too. Its AMAZING what you can do with VR these days. I was able to get true 1:1 scale views on things, how tight it is, or isn't, by walking around this room in VR. I'm quite excited and happy to say that it all seems like its going to work. The other thing I might think on is how to install the Atmos speakers, weather we make the soffit a fair bit wider and have them in there to not compromise any sound treatment, or build them into backer boxes into the joists and then clip and channel around the openings... Both are possible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks to Silva on AVS for getting the theatre to this point in 3D before I took over and started adding colours and bits and pieces...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 26, 20205 yr by Javs

how close are you sitting to the 165" screen.. seated eye to screen?

Hi Javs, I have had my theatre room up and running now for about 15 years and have been a drywall plasterer and renderer for 42 years. I did not build my house but I did do all the work inside my theatre with constant changes to the room through the years off course. Our  theatre is a separate building to the house so I made sure I used 2 layers of 13mm boral sound stop on the walls and ceilings. My walls are 190mm Besser block(as it was called then but now called Hanson block) Filled with concrete. I battened the walls inside and then lined the walls.I did not use insulation on the walls as they are filled with concrete.I just insulated the ceiling with rock wool bats. My room is 8.5m x 5.5m with a ceiling height of 2.4 painted all black. If your theatre is inside your house I would def go with sound proof board either from boral or csr and use a double door on the one frame as that will help with the noise big time.I can not express enough on this as it works. Put it this way, I can go into my theatre room at 2 in the morning and play my content weather it be music or a movie and my neighbours hear nothing at all. I also filled all cavities above the ceiling height near my eaves with rock wool. The rest of your work in sound control can be done with sound panels and bass traps inside.I did not use green glue or anything like that but I do know that what I have done works perfectly. Good luck mate  and hope it works out for you.

57 minutes ago, hopefullguy said:

how close are you sitting to the 165" screen.. seated eye to screen?

3.3 m

 

Yes its close, and my eyeballs are ready for it.

 

On 26/09/2020 at 1:21 PM, Javs said:

Just scrolling back in this thread and realised I hadn't shared anything for ages in regards to plans etc.

 

We have full house plans now and the cinema has been thought out a fair bit more...

 

Here is what it all looks like at the moment.

 

So the builder didn't want the angle of the entry to be exactly 45degrees due to not encroaching on the entry way to our house, and I am OK with this, was annoyed at first as I lost a little bit of precious internal space to theatre, but after thinking on it, its totally fine. This means the entry to the cinema is a little on the tight side, I wish the door was on the side, but then we didnt want the theatre door to be all the way at the front door of the house, this way it will still look welcoming from afar as you walk up to the entrance from the family room.

 

The little bar section we have is about 2m wide, its actually going to house 4x 18" subs in there to act as near field subs so they serve a dual purpose. This was done because we went all the way around the world in therms of how can we maybe fit like a platform at the back like a lot of traditional theatres have etc, but we just ended up stripping it back and I am really happy with this.

 

What we did manage to do though is widen the whole cinema, we realised having a 1.8m wide entry to our house with huge double doors was a bit overkill, so I saw a chance to add 30cm to the width of the theatre, which also widens the children's activity room upstairs, and go to a single 1200 door which is still huge. Win win there.

 

The projector will live in the study completely outside the room. This will give me throw for a huge 165inch screen and complete noise control in the room. There is a big rack there in the study too, you can see both of those place-holders below.

 

Plan is to clip and channel the entire room, double drywall and green glue, window plugs and possibly even drywall over the windows completely, and then all cabling, lighting and air conditioning etc will travel through the soffit we will build inside the room shell. This way hopefully we can minimise any issues with compromising sound proofing to the exterior of the house. I am aware that some sound will escape within the house especially through the planned port window for the projector, but that was never really the brief here.

 

 

 

 

Some renders I have done...

 

Definitely tight in there, but looks like we will have no trouble making it work. I have actually been IN this room in VR and walked all the way around it and sat in the sofa too. Its AMAZING what you can do with VR these days. I was able to get true 1:1 scale views on things, how tight it is, or isn't, by walking around this room in VR. I'm quite excited and happy to say that it all seems like its going to work. The other thing I might think on is how to install the Atmos speakers, weather we make the soffit a fair bit wider and have them in there to not compromise any sound treatment, or build them into backer boxes into the joists and then clip and channel around the openings... Both are possible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks to Silva on AVS for getting the theatre to this point in 3D before I took over and started adding colours and bits and pieces...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What program was used for the 3D render? Very nice!

 

43 minutes ago, Hydrology said:

What program was used for the 3D render? Very nice!

 

Original design was done in Sketchup I believe, and then I took it into Cinema 4D and carried on with the colours and render.

 

Do you mind editing your post to take out all the images, no need to include the images in your quote.

 

Thanks.

Appreciate the update @Javs , it's this sort of content that intrigues me the most. Showing the behind the scenes thought process on design etc. is thoroughly helpful (as I'm mentally compiling my dream room, of which is many years away).

 

In terms of the Visual side of things, have you narrowed down what projector you will be using? Or will cross that bridge closer to completion (in case something newer has been released)?

 

Also, have you much though on the Receiver you intend to use?

Cheers

4 minutes ago, minireza said:

Appreciate the update @Javs , it's this sort of content that intrigues me the most. Showing the behind the scenes thought process on design etc. is thoroughly helpful (as I'm mentally compiling my dream room, of which is many years away).

 

In terms of the Visual side of things, have you narrowed down what projector you will be using? Or will cross that bridge closer to completion (in case something newer has been released)?

 

Also, have you much though on the Receiver you intend to use?

Cheers

 

Those things are really not important to me.

 

I have a JVC X9500 right now that I love, with a new lamp and good tone mapping the screen-size and gain I want, I would still get decent brightness on it with a fresh lamp probably 22-25fl, which is honestly what I am already using in low lamp for HDR with MadVR, so will just go to high lamp.

 

I also have a Panasonic RZ660 6000lm laser projector for a 'B' machine, so that will do things like tv shows and such. I will look at a high end projector in another year or so.

 

Receiver, I will want a 16ch one, so right now probably looking at the Monoprice HTP1, else, my Marantz 7702mkii will do until I get around to that upgrade.

 

I am in the unique position where I dont really have to spend a dollar on AV Gear for this room if I dont want to. Thats at least how I will get over the outlay way up front.

On 26/09/2020 at 1:21 PM, Javs said:

Definitely tight in there, but looks like we will have no trouble making it work. I have actually been IN this room in VR and walked all the way around it and sat in the sofa too. Its AMAZING what you can do with VR these days. I was able to get true 1:1 scale views on things, how tight it is, or isn't, by walking around this room in VR. I'm quite excited and happy to say that it all seems like its going to work. The other thing I might think on is how to install the Atmos speakers, weather we make the soffit a fair bit wider and have them in there to not compromise any sound treatment, or build them into backer boxes into the joists and then clip and channel around the openings... Both are possible.

 

 

@Javs Going to be an awesome room once its done. 

 

What application did you use to view this room in VR?

 

I'm in the early stages of planning a new house build, and am undecided about room dimensions for a theatre. Getting a feel in VR would really help.

@Javs plans have come together really nicely. Have you given any thought to acoustic treatments yet? I can probably send you some stuff that'd help if you're going down the DIY path

On 10/08/2019 at 1:09 PM, Javs said:

 

 

Hey Mike.

Not really keen on a minisplit hey, the AC we are installing into the house is pretty hectic, really don't want to double dip on that.

There is no problem getting a supply there, I will just have to figure out the return, or a way to get old air out, the AC will always be on when we are in there. I'll have a think about it.

 

I'd probably go multiple mini ducted. Eg lower running costs as the mini system has a lower minimum load than a single big system. At night we only run the bedrooms on low which uses a maximum of 500W when thermostat triggers it on. Eg our power bill dropped when we installed AC as we can heat the bedrooms now for less than one bedroom with an electric heater. Went Mitsubishi as great WiFi control. Can control house remotely from anywhere in world. Eg out for dinner, warm bedrooms up before getting home. 

 

Most of our evening cooling is done by a Ventis system rather than AC which also exchanges house with all fresh filtered air regularly when temperature differences don't conflict with AC. Indoor air quality is now as good as or better than outdoors. It also runs positive pressure and kept the smoke out last summer, we went from having smoke alarms going off inside from bush fires to fresh air after install. We have the option that takes fresh air in from outside. 

 

Haven't read all posts. But you may not be able to modify the room during the build and block the windows as you may not get your OC certificate from the certifier if it is non compliant. 

Edited October 20, 20205 yr by DrSK

33 minutes ago, DrSK said:

I'd probably go multiple mini ducted. Eg lower running costs as the mini system has a lower minimum load than a single big system. At night we only run the bedrooms on low which uses a maximum of 500W when thermostat triggers it on. Eg our power bill dropped when we installed AC as we can heat the bedrooms now for less than one bedroom with an electric heater. Went Mitsubishi as great WiFi control. Can control house remotely from anywhere in world. Eg out for dinner, warm bedrooms up before getting home. 

 

Most of our evening cooling is done by a Ventis system rather than AC which also exchanges house with all fresh filtered air regularly when temperature differences don't conflict with AC. Indoor air quality is now as good as or better than outdoors. It also runs positive pressure and kept the smoke out last summer, we went from having smoke alarms going off inside from bush fires to fresh air after install. We have the option that takes fresh air in from outside. 

 

Haven't read all posts. But you may not be able to modify the room during the build and block the windows as you may not get your OC certificate from the certifier if it is non compliant. 

 

Hi, thanks.

 

The AC system is a pretty good one in that it can drop to 10% output and also service one room only, we will also have solar and battery, I am not concerned about power bills because there probably wont be any, its certainly much cleaner to just use the big expensive AC system in the house we are paying for, so definitely wont be doing mini split.

 

As much as I would love to permanently drywall the windows, its much more likely they will be very large window plugs, also we are doing this room after handover, which means after the OC is issues. Otherwise I agree there will likely be elements the certifier would frown at. We would have never been allowed to do the room during the build which is why it will be handed over as a standard room first, then I will get to work on it after we move in.

 

We will also be installing a dead-vent to circulate fresh air into the room which will vent to the study behind the cinema.

17 hours ago, Peter the Greek said:

@Javs plans have come together really nicely. Have you given any thought to acoustic treatments yet? I can probably send you some stuff that'd help if you're going down the DIY path

 

Mate if you can send some ideas through would always appreciate it.

 

Yes I have definitely given it some thought, everything must be hidden though behind the panels on the walls. So anywhere in the room, I have 5cm depth to play with. The columns are deeper, about 15cm.

 

 

35 minutes ago, Javs said:

 

Hi, thanks.

 

The AC system is a pretty good one in that it can drop to 10% output and also service one room only, we will also have solar and battery, I am not concerned about power bills because there probably wont be any, its certainly much cleaner to just use the big expensive AC system in the house we are paying for, so definitely wont be doing mini split.

 

As much as I would love to permanently drywall the windows, its much more likely they will be very large window plugs, also we are doing this room after handover, which means after the OC is issues. Otherwise I agree there will likely be elements the certifier would frown at. We would have never been allowed to do the room during the build which is why it will be handed over as a standard room first, then I will get to work on it after we move in.

 

We will also be installing a dead-vent to circulate fresh air into the room which will vent to the study behind the cinema.

Regarding AC. I note you used the term multi/mini split again. A split system is a completely different type of system to mini ducted that I discussed.

 

Daikin didn't have a mini ducted option when we installed or WiFi control. And had much higher running costs and losses compared to mini ducted when at night only a handful of rooms need to be conditioned. 

 

Daikin installed costs were also 50% more expensive for the same total capacity with their single larger system. 

 

And again, most of our heating and cooling is by Ventis ducted system now we have that installed which uses even less energy and provides clean fresh air. 

Edited October 20, 20205 yr by DrSK

51 minutes ago, DrSK said:

Regarding AC. I note you used the term multi/mini split again. A split system is a completely different type of system to mini ducted that I discussed.

 

Daikin didn't have a mini ducted option when we installed or WiFi control. And had much higher running costs and losses compared to mini ducted when at night only a handful of rooms need to be conditioned. 

 

Daikin installed costs were also 50% more expensive for the same total capacity with their single larger system. 

 

And again, most of our heating and cooling is by Ventis ducted system now we have that installed which uses even less energy and provides clean fresh air. 

 

Thanks, but its really of no consequence, as I said, the system we are installing is variable speed both in fan speed and compressor, it can drop to as low as 10% output if the room is at temp, it can cool one room only if I want and shut off all other zones,  up to 8 zones, its not the cheapest system out there, we upgraded it.

 

Actron Air ESP Platinum.

 

I am not going to install/waste money on a whole separate system for just that room when the house system will more than suffice.

Edited October 20, 20205 yr by Javs