re-boot Posted July 3, 2008 Posted July 3, 2008 He means real football.... To get the IQ2 (and get all FTA SD and HD channels like the tivo allows you to do) you only need to pay an extra $10 a month on top of the rest of your subscription (which is for foxtel channels, not offered by tivo) - so you should be comparing $700 to a $200 installation fee + $240 for a 24 month subscription. You can't take the rest of the subscription price into the equation because that is for completely different features, not offered by Tivo. I was going to say exactly the same thing. Plus, the TIVO isn't fully operational. They will be charging you extra for the features (that they have disabled) if you want them after the product is launched.
Hannibal Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 I believe since the Tivo operates on FTA it should be being compared to other FTA PVRs/DVR's rather than IQ2. How much does a Toppy 7000 or a Beyonwiz cost? Aren't they the competition for Tivo?
pgdownload Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 yes, I know - I still strongly disagree that Australian FTA is "most", "some", or other qualification of the best content available. There are obviously great shows that Australian's miss out on (More lately due to Foxtel gaining exclusive rights to them or because the content type is unsuitable for FTA TV, rather than because FTA can't be bothered showing them)However when you look at the general array of shows (eg. Lost, CSI, Dr Who, Murder City, Dexter, Hollow Men/Frontline, Heroes, SBS for the great foreign shows, etc. ) you find there's very few 'big' shows that Oz FTA miss out on. Note this list is just an indicative rundown, others might hate every show mentioned but my point is that like them or not these are the higher quality shows cherry picked from here and overseas and shown for free. There's always going to be great documentaries, sports shows etc. that there's just not space to put them all in (and even if the networks could they wouldn't because they'd never get enough people to watch any given show to cover the cost of airing it). And this is where Foxtel comes in beautifully where people pay $$ to watch a few special shows on each channel that they like. They also get the privilege of seeing some shows that we do miss out on that I'd love to see but probably never will. All I'm saying is that while there are many bad things about the Oz FTA 'experience' it does manage to provide us with a pretty damn good list of options IMO. To simply say there's nothing worth watching on FTA TV is an absurd generalisation IMO. Regards Peter Gillespie
suparockin Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 Yeah. 5 out of 8 AFL games a weekend on FTA where I live.. Thats close to almost zero. :wacko: The problem with the 'best content' discussion is obviously content involves personal preferences. I'm talking about Football, the game played in every country in the world. Aussie Rules isn't a sport, you get points for missing FFS!
Yerolo Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 Exactly... When the day comes when EPL, UCL, A-League and La Liga are shown on FTA then we'll talk In the meantime Foxtel cannot be beaten for Football fans
ozdoc Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 Exactly...When the day comes when EPL, UCL, A-League and La Liga are shown on FTA then we'll talk In the meantime Foxtel cannot be beaten for Football fans Agree. But what has that do with whether TiVo can make a success of itself? A vast percentage of Australians don't give a rip about 'football'. Can we agree to look beyond our own personal preferences and see the bigger picture.
Hosko Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 I'm talking about Football, the game played in every country in the world.Aussie Rules isn't a sport, you get points for missing FFS! If you look at most target sports you get additional points for being more accurate. Target shooting and archery come to mine. So your not actually getting a point for missing your getting extra points for being more accurate. But hey Australian Rules is the only real football code. Its the only form of football where you can only use your feet to kick a goal/score maximum points.
doodlefeatures Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 Exactly...When the day comes when EPL, UCL, A-League and La Liga are shown on FTA then we'll talk In the meantime Foxtel cannot be beaten for Football fans I reckon this is more accurate "In the meantime Foxtel cannot be beaten for sports fans"
pgdownload Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 (edited) No ones really suggesting that if your a sports fan Foxtel isn't great. If like many Aussies you really only care about NRL or AFL then FTA TV does a credible job but otherwise Foxtel rules supreme here. Foxtel has lots of additional content to FTA TV. A lot of it is pure dross but there's definitely something in there for everyone. But Tivo is not marketed to stop people getting Foxtel. Its marketed to appeal to FTA watchers who want a better FTA viewing experience. One could theorise that the networks, facing declining ad revenue, actively sort to make FTA TV less and less enjoyable until they could finally offer a device that would compensate for all there horrible decisions. FTA$ TV by stealth really Regards Peter Gillespie Edited July 4, 2008 by pgdownload
Hosko Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 No ones really suggesting that if your a sports fan Foxtel isn't great. If like many Aussies you really only care about NRL or AFL then FTA TV does a credible job but otherwise Foxtel rules supreme here. Foxtel has lots of additional content to FTA TV. A lot of it is pure dross but there's definitely something in there for everyone. How many games have Souths been on FTA this year?? I don't go for Souths but I doubt it would be very many. More then half the games every week aren't on FTA. I don't want to watch my teams matches every two or three weeks. I want to see them every game.
pgdownload Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 How many games have Souths been on FTA this year??I don't go for Souths but I doubt it would be very many. More then half the games every week aren't on FTA. I don't want to watch my teams matches every two or three weeks. I want to see them every game.Not knowing who the 'souths' are I'd be hard pressed to say Regardless I'm in full agreement with you. If you like the odd footy game then FTA is perfectly fine. But otherwise get Foxtel (and if you get Foxtel you won't be getting a Tivo to record it).Regards Peter Gillespie
Julian L Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 As quoted above, $3200 for two year contract with foxtel vs $700 tivo. Why are you comparing the top of the line 100 channel FOXTEL service with a basic free to air service DVR? Unless you're saying that TiVo offers exactly the same content as FOXTEL, this rationale is specious at best.
GregA1503560021 Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 (edited) How long does it take to skim through the TV guide for the FTA channels to see if there's something you might want to watch? 25 seconds? Sure the TIVO might be able to find all movies with, say, Arnie in them, but are these really going to slip by you if the TIVO didn't find them seeing as there may be one every 2 months on FTA? Kind of true - but I miss shows all the time. I don't read through the whole guide, and sometimes (usually for older content) there'll be a TV show or movie at an unusual hour that I want to see. If TiVo can pick that then it's great... though I'm not sure how it would pick that. I'd kind of like a TV guide that only showed "programs different to last week". Then I could select whether I was interested or not in them. I'm sure the tivo will be a great product, and if I was in America I'd love to have one - but the average American has over 100 channels to watch and record, which is where the tivo comes into it's own. What city does this "average american" live in?!? I lived in Boston - and had the 4 networks & 3 independents (2 became UPN & WB), plus 3 PBSes. They were considered my FTA channels. They had similar content to our 5 networks... but yeah a few more channels. IMO, what could give tivo a real push would be some terrestrial pay tv channels (preferrably only exclusive to terrestrial) The new broadcast "channels A & B" - one is for mobile TV, the other might be subscription TV(?). That could be interesting ... IF Foxtel doesn't buy it, of course. Or once Channel 7 has 3 channels, it could switch down to 1 channel overnight and send subscription content to the TiVos. Edited July 4, 2008 by GregA
ozdoc Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 Why are you comparing the top of the line 100 channel FOXTEL service with a basic free to air service DVR? Unless you're saying that TiVo offers exactly the same content as FOXTEL, this rationale is specious at best. For goodness sake, read the context of the quote. It's regarding someone making a budgeting decision on whether they can afford $3200 or $700, not about the content of foxtel or FTA. A poster assumed that if you can't afford to pay for foxtel, then TiVo is also out of contention. I was disputing this claim. For the record. I have Foxtel IQ, and three FTA PVRs, so I am well aware of the content differences.
Brad.. Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 For goodness sake, read the context of the quote. It's regarding someone making a budgeting decision on whether they can afford $3200 or $700, not about the content of foxtel or FTA. A poster assumed that if you can't afford to pay for foxtel, then TiVo is also out of contention. I was disputing this claim. For the record. I have Foxtel IQ, and three FTA PVRs, so I am well aware of the content differences. why 3 pvrs?
pgdownload Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 The new broadcast "channels A & B" - one is for mobile TV, the other might be subscription TV(?). That could be interesting ... IF Foxtel doesn't buy it, of course.I got the impression that the new minister for communication has basically trashed this? Basically I haven't heard boo about it since the government changed hands.Regards Peter Gillespie
hobotivo Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 I'm not posting here. This thread is just silly. Cheers Ron
ozdoc Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 why 3 pvrs? I'm a polygamist with three wives and just can't seem to get Oprah, Dr Phil, and Ellen sorted out at the same time.
wapping Posted July 4, 2008 Author Posted July 4, 2008 I think a lot of people seem to be missing my point. We all know that channel 7 hates Foxtel so if they can do anything to get up their nose they will. So they bring out tivo that does basicly nothing for $700 as there are not the choice of stations. Would it have not been better if they had joined Channel 9 and made freeview exclusive to Tivo. Also nobody has answered my question where are all these free movie sites on the net that Tivo can pick up?
st3v3 Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 ...where are all these free movie sites on the net that Tivo can pick up? From what I have read, it sounds more like Seven are trying to set up movie streaming over the internet, making some kind of deals with ISPs to not meter the traffic. The US Tivo website talks about renting or buying from Amazon directly onto the Tivo. Both models are nothing to do with free movie sites on the net...
ShaneB Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 TiVo will fail. It's just an overpriced PVR. When it comes to eventually being able to download web-based content, it won't work either. Broadband in Australia is still incredibly slow, and expensive. Downloading movies will quickly chew-up any 4GB or so download allocation. And while Tel$tra continues to have monopolies on sections of the phone network, and an interest in Foxtel, they will use their market power to choke any sort of competition.
djOS Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 (edited) TiVo will fail.It's just an overpriced PVR. When it comes to eventually being able to download web-based content, it won't work either. Broadband in Australia is still incredibly slow, and expensive. Downloading movies will quickly chew-up any 4GB or so download allocation. And while Tel$tra continues to have monopolies on sections of the phone network, and an interest in Foxtel, they will use their market power to choke any sort of competition. This sort of tripe is typical of the uninformed - check your facts and you will find that 7 is in the process of negotiating all internet tv & movie data as not counting towards the caps of major ISP's! Tivo will do very well with joe public, both my brother and father have told me Tivo will be replacing their Toppy 5000's + IceBoxes in the next month or so and both are typical CE users not gadget lovers. Edited July 4, 2008 by djOS
pgdownload Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 I think a lot of people seem to be missing my point.We all know that channel 7 hates Foxtel so if they can do anything to get up their nose they will. So they bring out tivo that does basicly nothing for $700 as there are not the choice of stations. Would it have not been better if they had joined Channel 9 and made freeview exclusive to Tivo. Also nobody has answered my question where are all these free movie sites on the net that Tivo can pick up? "Would it have not been better if they had joined Channel 9 and made freeview exclusive to Tivo." <= Is this your point? I'm not sure how this scenario changes anything about the Tivo? Its currently the only box that has freeview. Making it exclusive just means people who want this functionality buy Tivo, if its not exclusive they might be able to choose from a bunch of PVRs down the track. Either way The networks also need to be careful in how they use/abuse the EPG data they have. Whilst they (may) have copyrights, if they set up an arbitary set of rules that gives the EPG to some players and not others then they risk been sued for anti-competitive behavior and the like (IMO). So they've chosen a few choice (and rather sensible rules IMO) and made the data available to all and sundry (after all, a lot of people keep pointing out that an EPG only helps the networks to increase ratings) As for movies and Tivo, we finally seem on the cusp of downloadable legal movies as a viable alternative. Tivo is presumably placing itself to be able to be a gateway for other company's that have the content and delivery mechanisims but need to find an audience/device that can receive it. No idea if it will be successful but if they've timed it right they could be the right PVR in the right place at the right time. Regards Peter Gillespie
djOS Posted July 4, 2008 Posted July 4, 2008 (edited) TiVo will fail.It's just an overpriced PVR. Oh and while im at it, show me a genuine full featured dual HD tuner PVR for less than $700???? They dont exist!!! the Toppy and Beyonwiz are both around $800. Edited July 4, 2008 by djOS
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