Early in the morning push button hifi is acceptable too, +1 for the boom box, after lunch the playing field changes, Grind the coffee , clean the LP etc

So what is it that the manual ones do that is different (better?) than the fully automatics?

Thanks guys, for all the ideas and info.

I think I might go for auto ones until I know what I really want next. Any suggestion?

If going for an auto one I would suggest the Seaco with the twin boilers.

But find youself a shop which demonstrates the different machine and inform you about the pros and cons.

Imo you don't want a machine that stops you wanting to make a coffee.But then some people enjoy the ritualistic theatre involved just for that morning ristretto.

So what is it that the manual ones do that is different (better?) than the fully automatics?

Other than ritual, you can tweak the grind more easily to suit conditions (grind changes with beans, temperature and humidity) and you can tamp a manual much harder which according to most baristae gives better extraction. They also use a much heavier grouphead (the thing you put the coffee in) which helps maintain temperature.

Note that they aren't really manuals, they are semi-automatics because they have a pump to deliver the superheated water.

PS Australian Barista trophy back in Victoria! Go Dave!

So what is it that the manual ones do that is different (better?) than the fully automatics?

This is the same question as so what is so great about those manual turntables compared to the automatic ones.

Build quality, adjustability, longevity, flavour - apart from that not much, they both make coffee (music).

Starbucks used to use La Marzocco but has changed to super autos to reduce training costs for staff. A high level auto machine ($12,000) will approach what an average barrista can do but with a little knowledge, a bit of effort you will soon be staying in for your morning coffee.

Kevin

La Pavoni- a classic!!

Mine doesn't have the base & grinder.

(or the eagle)

You can even buy a set of seals & service it yourself!!

So what is it that the manual ones do that is different (better?) than the fully automatics?

Leon read Mr Gimlet's Answer in post #11 , Manual machines have the potential for great coffee ,However the operator needs to be prepared to learn how to get the best from it

Well, the Rocky tends to clump the grinds a fair bit, it's not such a big deal but I do prefer the no-clump grinders. I own the doser version of the Rocky, apparently the doser version has less/no clumping. Despite the clumping it is still very good and consistant.

The aesthetics and finish of the grinder is ok but could be better IMO, note that the build quality is very robust.

Overall the grinder is does the job and does it well and when I bought it there weren't any other ones in the price range that I came across. I heard they have gone up a fair bit in price now.

I use the Rocky doser version but have removed it and prefer to put the ground coffee into a container and spoon it into the basket.

At times it would be nice to have a finer adjustment as in 11.5 instead of 11 or 12 an compensate with tamp pressure

La Pavoni- a classic!!

Mine doesn't have the base & grinder.

(or the eagle)

You can even buy a set of seals & service it yourself!!

Waricle,

I am impressed with this La Pavoni, really tempted to get one. Is there a dealer in Sydney? Can it be serviced in Australia?

Yes and yes.

I will dig up details.

http://www.euroespresso.com.au/

Hi,

I googled and found the same website, many thanks!

I think you buggers may have set me back a couple grand!

arrghhhhh.....Will fight the urge and just bookmark this for future reference! Damn you lot!

I think you buggers may have set me back a couple grand!

arrghhhhh.....Will fight the urge and just bookmark this for future reference! Damn you lot!

Dang just how much was that cup of coffee

It'll be a heap of coffee to recover the costs of the machine that this thread is bound to lead to.

Then there is the grinder , Don't forget the grinder . Why has nobody mentioned the roaster . You gotta roast it b4 U grind it .

Topic to be discussed at morning tea , What does good coffee have in common with good HiFi?

What does good coffee have in common with good HiFi?

They can both keep you up late through the night when its all good .

What about copper boilers .

Cheers

Leon read Mr Gimlet's Answer in post #11 , Manual machines have the potential for great coffee ,However the operator needs to be prepared to learn how to get the best from it

Thanks, I feel better now, I thought I was missing something. We have one of these at home below and it does almost everything. I like the coffee better than almost any coffee shop I have been too but I'd like to taste "really good manual made coffee" one day!

Leon, next time you are in or around the city, grab a coffee at Mecca (King Street, under the Grace Hotel), Campos in Newtown (Missenden St) or Tobys (Wolloomooloo or City Road near the Uni)

If you really want an Automatic then I have heard that Jura make the most reliable ones.

Don't buy your coffee from the supermarket, they are all stale. Find a local roaster and buy from there.

There is a rule of 3's. Green beans last for 3 years, roasted lasts for 3 weeks and ground beens last 3 minutes.

La Pavoni- a classic!!

Mine doesn't have the base & grinder.

(or the eagle)

You can even buy a set of seals & service it yourself!!

Now thats sexy,chrome, boilers,handles and gauges.

Very nice feature on the bench.

Just been through this process having my Saeco finally die on me after 10 years.

If I was after an automatic and didn't froth much or not at all, I would buy the new bottom of the range Saeco. Especially if you only make a few cups a day. After that there is a world of options.

However, I have come full circle being a coffee lover and after auditioning a lot of machines I ended up with this for +$2K

You can froth, pour coffee and pour boiling water at the same time. Really, it becomes an excercise of how much effort you want to make to get a good cuppa.

Very nice machine anthonyc , Did You get a new grinder to go with it

Leon, next time you are in or around the city, grab a coffee at Mecca (King Street, under the Grace Hotel), Campos in Newtown (Missenden St) or Tobys (Wolloomooloo or City Road near the Uni)

I'll try those one day, but I really meant about a really good manual made coffee that can be made at home, not on professional gear by a barista! I mean how much better would it be compared to our machine for instance?

I'll try those one day, but I really meant about a really good manual made coffee that can be made at home, not on professional gear by a barista! I mean how much better would it be compared to our machine for instance?

Leon, the saeco's were proberly the first that came close to a coffee as good as a manual machine some 10 years ago. Ground fresh, adjustable grind, adjustable measured serve, adjustable measured pressure pour and it even wet the coffee before pouring. Unfortuanately the reliablility let it down. They have re-launch just this year but I'm over the automatic machines.

By coming full circle I mean really I havn't found anything that comes close to a barista quality coffee thats automatic. Alot of manual home machines lack mostly in the area of the boiler and the right pressure. You really do have to spend the money on a good single group machine for home to get satisfaction IMHO. However, unlike an automatic, you do have to spend some time in finding the beans you like and getting the grinder and machine to produce it consistently to taste which requires some skill. Its a lot easier to get it wrong with a manual machine. But when you get it right it the automatic doesn't compare.

Very nice machine anthonyc , Did You get a new grinder to go with it

I bought the isomac granmacinino with a toggle which grinds fresh when you push the group head against it. You can't get one that automatically pre-grinds a set amount as it goes stale before you use it.