F M Posted April 7 Share Posted April 7 Gday! I have a couple pairs of JBL 29AV speakers and am currently using one pair but have wondered about adding more of the same speakers to a hifi setup. I am having no problem hearing the speakers as the Fosi V3 is enough to get them loud, I am wondering if all adding more speakers will do is increase loudness. Part of my asking is because i'm considering buying a new amplifier that has 4 speaker capacity with an A+B option. Other part is because i don' t have the stand to carry two on either side unless i build some and am interesting in understanding what the difference in the sound can be when adding additional speakers. My question: Has anyone had experience adding multiple of the same speaker to their indoor/outdoor speaker systems and how did you like the results? Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surprisetech Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 12 hours ago, F M said: Gday! I have a couple pairs of JBL 29AV speakers and am currently using one pair but have wondered about adding more of the same speakers to a hifi setup. I am having no problem hearing the speakers as the Fosi V3 is enough to get them loud, I am wondering if all adding more speakers will do is increase loudness. Part of my asking is because i'm considering buying a new amplifier that has 4 speaker capacity with an A+B option. Other part is because i don' t have the stand to carry two on either side unless i build some and am interesting in understanding what the difference in the sound can be when adding additional speakers. My question: Has anyone had experience adding multiple of the same speaker to their indoor/outdoor speaker systems and how did you like the results? Cheers! It's hard to predict. Adding a 2nd pair of speakers in a 2-channel system in the same room can create all sorts of cancellation and summing effects at different frequencies, depending on the location of the 2nd set of speakers. This means you will have a range of peaks and nulls in the frequency response which will vary with the listening position. It's more likely to degrade the sound quality than improve it. This is why you rarely see it done unless the speakers are being used at low levels just for background music like in a restaurant, etc. There is something you can try which might improve the sound and will also make the system go a little louder. Place a 2nd 29AV speaker, upside-down, on top of each existing 29AV speaker. (see attached drawing) This will minimise any undesirable interactions between the drivers in each speaker and may give you some of the advantages ascribed to D'appolito designs. Feel free to experiment with other configurations and see what you think, but be aware that the effects I described above will likely be worse if the 2nd set of speakers are positioned on the sides or behind the listening position. It's different in multi-channel systems because the other speakers mostly output different signals and the system also compensates for the speaker position with delay and level adjustments. If you do give it a try, post an update and let us know how it goes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surprisetech Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 Sorry, I just realised that my suggestion is probably what you were already intending by the term "line array style" in the title. Definitely worth giving it a go. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F M Posted April 9 Author Share Posted April 9 (edited) Thankyou for your replies Surprisetech! Its unlikely i'll upgrade to an AB amp more likely i'll get a second class D and a mixer or something like this to connect the two if it comes down to it this is what i was thinking: Woofers on the outside, horn tweeters at the top and bottom to space them out. Cheers! Edited April 9 by F M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surprisetech Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 55 minutes ago, F M said: Thankyou for your replies Surprisetech! Its unlikely i'll upgrade to an AB amp more likely i'll get a second class D and a mixer or something like this to connect the two if it comes down to it this is what i was thinking: Woofers on the outside, horn tweeters at the top and bottom to space them out. Cheers! OK. You have the other version. That should work. Just a couple of pointers. - You want the sound from both horns arriving at your ears at the same time. The arrangement you've shown is OK if your normal listening position places your ears exactly halfway (vertically) between the top & bottom horn tweeters. I would be inclined to flip that arrangement and have the top & bottom tweeters as close as possible to each other. This will make the difference in distance from each tweeter to your ears minimal, regardless of what height your ears will be. It's actually good that you have that version of the 29AV because the version I used in my pic wouldn't allow you to get the tweeters close while keeping the horns horizontal as they are meant to be. - Choosing whether to have the woofers on the outside or inside should be determined by your normal listening position. Higher frequencies are more directional, so a general rule of thumb is for the position of the Left Tweeter, Right Tweeter and your listening position to form an equilateral triangle, then fine-tune the speaker positioning from that starting point. If the gap between the speakers is small, have the woofers on the inside to give you a wider soundstage. If the gap is really wide, then woofers on the outside might give a more realistic soundstage. Hope that all makes sense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F M Posted April 9 Author Share Posted April 9 I have them about 6.5 feet apart, that seems to be a good distance to keep the sound combined. Worth noting: the 29av cabinet is isosceles so when on its side there is a approximately 20 degree angle upwards so it is facing significantly higher than when vertical. I have not rotated the horns so they are placed vertically when the speaker is sideways. I have done a few listening tests to see how different speaker positions would effect sound: position 1 is standard vertical placement, position 2 is speakers on sides woofers facing out, position 3 is woofers facing in, for position 4 I have moved the speaker stands 2 feet closer (4.5 feet distance but its actually more like three feet because of speaker height) woofers facing in, position 5 is same as P4 except the horns are facing inwards. position 6 I put some towels under the speakers to get them sitting without as much of an upwards angle horns facing inwards. position 7 same as P6 except i moved the stands back to their original 6.5 feet. I found the highest fidelity/ most balanced sound came from position 1, standard listening position. The fidelity and balance between mid and high was most noticeable at P1. P2 I felt like the bass was lacking and the highs were too loud. P3 was the opposite, too much bass and the highs sounded separated at times. For P4 and P5 I moved the stands closer and found the sound stage to be lacking with the same problems mentioned in P2 and P3 to a lesser extent. P6 hardly noticeable difference in high but mid was more refined. P7 High is not blending or balanced mid sound louder maybe somewhat less refined. 2 hours ago, surprisetech said: You want the sound from both horns arriving at your ears at the same time. What you've said about the horn tweeters makes sense, shifting them around has helped me realize how much they effect the balance, despite the size compared to the woofers. Still more things to do but i am limited to what's possible without buying more things so i'll probably rotate the horns at some point Cheers! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmie Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 Not something I've ever done personally but have heard this kind of thing (taken to the extreme) in @Peter_F's system a while back. Sounded awesome. Would have been great if you could have taken a pic with each set-up and posted on here, would have enabled us to see just how the arrangements worked. Any pics are worth a thousand words. (So they say) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmie Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 Pete may also be able to advise on the best amp pairing and coupling too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F M Posted April 10 Author Share Posted April 10 1 hour ago, Grimmie said: Any pics are worth a thousand words This is essentially what i am talking about, ive attached an image with the positioning including when i rotated the horn tweeter. Cheers! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almikel Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 if a single speaker each side can meet your SPL requirements with some headroom - why complicate your life with the myriad of issues that come with multiple speakers playing the same information? (constructive/destructive interference/lobing etc) Mike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F M Posted April 11 Author Share Posted April 11 15 hours ago, almikel said: Mike Cheers Almikel! Combination of having a pair i dont use, wanting to set them up outdoors with greater effect and curiosity. I've been calculating how much work/money it would be to get this together and it feels like i'll probably end up just selling one of the pairs of speakers but their aesthetically in bad shape despite the internals being pristine i dont think i'd get what theyre worth in terms of cash vs sound quality. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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