olegau Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 I think to buy a AUDIO NOTE OTO LINE SE tube amplifier base on its review only. It is expensive one so I would like to audit it but I did not find any shop in Melbourne. Maybe someone can help me to find one for audition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 @guru might be able to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olegau Posted September 15, 2018 Author Share Posted September 15, 2018 It would be great! I am in St Kilda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olegau Posted September 15, 2018 Author Share Posted September 15, 2018 Here is review of AUDIO NOTE OTO SE : You would think this amp is value for money, but nothing could be further from the truth. A similar spec'ed Unison research or Audion Sterling happen to be far wiser choices to go for if you actually had to buy an amp, rather than win one at a raffle. You want grain? Get the OTO SE. Solo violin sounds astonishingly strident regardless of how sweet the actual recording was. I have rarely heard the Lara St John HDCD sound as bad as it did over an AN CD, oto SE, totem combo, oh, far too rarely. Solo violin is a torture test for the oto se. So are saxophones. Get an Audio NOT! oto SE int. amp today and be the laughing stock of the entire audio world. To be fair, it has a nice set of pots. And you can use it s chassis to play drums on! They really ring! So 4 stars for the chassis! ONE star for the rest! http://www.audioreview.com/product/amplification/amplifiers/audio-note/oto-phono-se.html It is scare me because I am after classical music:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 15, 2018 Share Posted September 15, 2018 Are you attending the hifi show next month? Audio Note Australia will have a room there where you can have a listen and ask questions of the exhibitor. I wouldn't let one dodgy user review on that site to define what a Audio Note amp can and can't do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olegau Posted September 15, 2018 Author Share Posted September 15, 2018 Great help. I will do research to get details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olegau Posted September 15, 2018 Author Share Posted September 15, 2018 32 minutes ago, Muon N' said: Are you attending the hifi show next month? Audio Note Australia will have a room there where you can have a listen and ask questions of the exhibitor. I did not find AUDIO NOTE on the list:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 15, 2018 Share Posted September 15, 2018 Just had a look and you are correct that Audio Note is not listed. My mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted September 15, 2018 Volunteer Share Posted September 15, 2018 On 15/09/2018 at 12:41 AM, olegau said: I think to buy a AUDIO NOTE OTO LINE SE tube amplifier base on its review only. It is expensive one so I would like to audit it but I did not find any shop in Melbourne. Maybe someone can help me to find one for audition. why would you buy an expensive amp based only on reviews? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guru Posted September 15, 2018 Share Posted September 15, 2018 5 hours ago, Muon N' said: Just had a look and you are correct that Audio Note is not listed. My mistake. Remember there are 2 shows in Melbourne this year, on consecutive weekends no less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony1 Posted September 15, 2018 Share Posted September 15, 2018 That’s the weirdest so called review/opinion I’ve ever read. And therefore impossible to take seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 38 minutes ago, Anthony1 said: That’s the weirdest so called review/opinion I’ve ever read. And therefore impossible to take seriously. Unless the review has been conducted COMPLETELY independently, with absolutely no possibility of corrupt practices and with a full suite of objectives tests, then it cannot be taken seriously. That goes for positive AND negative reviews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Zaphod Beeblebrox said: Unless the review has been conducted COMPLETELY independently, with absolutely no possibility of corrupt practices and with a full suite of objectives tests, then it cannot be taken seriously. That goes for positive AND negative reviews. That's when reasoning needs to be applied. If 9 out of 10 users say great amp and one not... It's reasonable to expect those 9 to be a more accurate appraisal. If 9 out of 10 say crap amp, then It's reasonable to expect the opposite. Or you can apply no reasoning, and look for those completely independent tests, but are they, or are subconscious biases at play and you are unaware of it just like the tester is unaware of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Muon N' said: That's when reasoning needs to be applied. Indeed. 1 minute ago, Muon N' said: If 9 out of 10 users say great amp and one not... It's reasonable to expect those 9 to be a more accurate appraisal. If 9 out of 10 say crap amp, then It's reasonable to expect the opposite. No, I don't accept that either. I invoke the Emperor's New Clothes rule. In fact, I have been in this biz a long time. I recall when a new and different technology amplifier was released. It looked a million Bucks, had a fantastic story and pretty glossy brochures accompanying it. I heard it and hated it, along with most critical, experienced listeners. EVERY single reviewer on the planet raved about. Owners raved about it. Funny thing is: Today, those same reviewers and listeners would only use that amplifier as a door-stop or a boat anchor. It was crap then, it is crap now. It's just that the manufacturer's marketing arm was VERY well funded. I can only imagine that a large chunk of money was shovelled discretely into the pockets of corrupt reviewers. Most of those reviewers still have their jobs. Funny about that. That is far from the only example. There are many, many more. Reviewers drive nice cars and live in nice homes. 1 minute ago, Muon N' said: Or you can apply no reasoning, and look for those completely independent tests, but are they, or are subconscious biases at play and you are unaware of it just like the tester is unaware of it. A properly conducted, independent test should do away with any bias. That would, of course, be a very rare thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted September 16, 2018 Volunteer Share Posted September 16, 2018 23 minutes ago, Zaphod Beeblebrox said: Today, those same reviewers and listeners would only use that amplifier as a door-stop or a boat anchor. It was crap then, it is crap now What was the amp ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 22 minutes ago, Zaphod Beeblebrox said: No, I don't accept that either. I invoke the Emperor's New Clothes rule. In fact, I have been in this biz a long time. I recall when a new and different technology amplifier was released. It looked a million Bucks, had a fantastic story and pretty glossy brochures accompanying it. I heard it and hated it, along with most critical, experienced listeners. EVERY single reviewer on the planet raved about. Owners raved about it. Funny thing is: Today, those same reviewers and listeners would only use that amplifier as a door-stop or a boat anchor. It was crap then, it is crap now. It's just that the manufacturer's marketing arm was VERY well funded. I can only imagine that a large chunk of money was shovelled discretely into the pockets of corrupt reviewers. Most of those reviewers still have their jobs. Funny about that. That is far from the only example. There are many, many more. Reviewers drive nice cars and live in nice homes. Sure there are many variables, including where the user is coming from in respect to there system, room, other equipment and personal preferences and experience with comparable gear. It's far from black and white, ever. Also I'm talking about user reviews like the OP was looking at, and not professional ones. 25 minutes ago, Zaphod Beeblebrox said: A properly conducted, independent test should do away with any bias. That would, of course, be a very rare thing. How can someone do away with biases that are acting on an unconscious level? There is also the personal preferences, if someone prefers triode connections over UL, or visa versa, they are not going to favour the topology that they prefer less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 56 minutes ago, Sir Sanders Zingmore said: What was the amp ? Oh, I'm not going there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Muon N' said: Sure there are many variables, including where the user is coming from in respect to there system, room, other equipment and personal preferences and experience with comparable gear. It's far from black and white, ever. Also I'm talking about user reviews like the OP was looking at, and not professional ones. I get that. My original comments apply. Independence MUST be verified, along with proper objective tests. 2 hours ago, Muon N' said: How can someone do away with biases that are acting on an unconscious level? A proper DBT does so. 2 hours ago, Muon N' said: There is also the personal preferences, if someone prefers triode connections over UL, or visa versa, they are not going to favour the topology that they prefer less. Again, a properly conducted test does not invalidate such things. ALL reviewers allow their personal preference to dictate their subjective testing. Which is why objective testing MUST accompany all reviews. It's why we all should ignore subjective-only testing. It is unreliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 @Zaphod Beeblebrox Invoking the DBT angle gets threads shut down, so I'll leave you with your position regardless of my own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eggmeister Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 How do I become a reviewer? I want a nice home and to drive a nice car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 (edited) Deleted The line of the discussion has taken a path that is of little help to the OP. Edited September 16, 2018 by Muon N' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olegau Posted September 16, 2018 Author Share Posted September 16, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, Sir Sanders Zingmore said: why would you buy an expensive amp based only on reviews? People say this is a unique sound amp, very good for classical and jazz I am after. This amp has a Balance knob. I need it. Edited September 16, 2018 by olegau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olegau Posted September 16, 2018 Author Share Posted September 16, 2018 5 hours ago, Muon N' said: If 9 out of 10 users say great amp and one not... It's reasonable to expect those 9 to be a more accurate appraisal. Unfortunately 9 of 10 can be wrong for my taste. I have bad experience buying an amp without audition. Once I bought an amp Yamaha RS300 based on hundreds positive reviews. It was resold next day because clinical sound I do not like. Since that I am afraid to buy amps without audition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon N' Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 @olegau Bottom line is you will need to find an owner or distributor/retailer that has one of the amps you are interested in, and see of a demo is possible. The whole review discussion will not meet your needs. Hope it works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted September 16, 2018 Volunteer Share Posted September 16, 2018 28 minutes ago, olegau said: People say this is a unique sound amp, very good for classical and jazz I am after. This amp has a Balance knob. I need it. I owned one of these, many many years ago. My experience was that its performance depends very much on the speakers it is attached to. Anything requiring a lot of power or current will not be a good match What is the rest of your system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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