Qwertyqaz Posted May 22, 2016 Posted May 22, 2016 Home theatre requirements are quite different from stereo system requirements, it's at that. Rest all is some sort of compromise.
HKLM Posted May 22, 2016 Posted May 22, 2016 You can amalgamate a high end 2ch and HT system without compromise. I can't see any point in removing the 2ch aspect from the HT equation.
Guest Sime Posted May 22, 2016 Posted May 22, 2016 Home theatre requirements are quite different from stereo system requirements, it's at that. Rest all is some sort of compromise. So if that's the case, with the system in my sig, where to you would I be compromised? Can an 8801 processor not be a good two channel pre? Are ALL two channel only pre's regardless of cost, better at doing 2 channel than it? And in regards to the rest of the system, speakers amps cables etc, it's two channel qualified. I'm not trying to make an argument for my system, just using it as an example that's it's not so black and white as you put it.
betty boop Posted May 22, 2016 Posted May 22, 2016 Home theatre requirements are quite different from stereo system requirements, it's at that. Rest all is some sort of compromise. however a 2ch system can be at the heart of a ht system. i.e. used by it...being 2ch of the much equation. everything in life involves some aspect of compromise or the other. however wiht one system incorporating pure 2ch gear and av gear ... i.e. still involving a pure 2ch path and much path for signal I do believe best of both worlds is possible. and I strongly believe its not something that has to be limited by budget or space as there are components at all budget points to achieve this...and there are options if box count needs to be kept down. so many different ways to achieve. just depends what trying to achieve.
powerav Posted May 22, 2016 Posted May 22, 2016 To me a 2 channel system is a compromise for not being able to listen to multichannel DVD audio, SACD or just great music concert DVD or Bluray or don't forget Bluray Pure Audio. We should be calling it Multichannel systems and not "HT". 2
powerav Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 (edited) Nailed it @@powerav I know feel like I belong Edited May 23, 2016 by powerav
waricle Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 Great rant PETA I feel you pain I agree with Betty Boop that you can build a good system that will do both in the constraints and compromises of a single room however digital media is so changeable and confusing that when I finally got something to actually work( iTunes/audivana) I left it the hell alone and watch my mates struggle with all the latest and greatest. As for ht processors the same applies, in my effort to simplify I decided to stay stuck in 5.2 courtesy of my oppos processor and separate amps in a dedicated cinema and a separate oppo for CDs in a dedicated listening room. That way I can fiddle and fart with the two channel stuff and not compromise the ht and vice versa Which is a compromise on its own I guess. Apart from the pj and oppos and computer & dac everything else, amps, TT, speakers, are over twenty years old so Im also obviously (fortunately) constrained financially. We are selling and moving house so what I'll end up with God only knows.... Maybe an atmos system?????just kidding
HKLM Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 My spin on it is build the desired 2ch system, and then bolt the HT on to that by adding a pre-pro, surround amps and speakers. Not all that difficult. 2
Qwertyqaz Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 My spin on it is build the desired 2ch system, and then bolt the HT on to that by adding a pre-pro, surround amps and speakers. Not all that difficult. but you need a pre with home theatre by-pass 2
powerav Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 but you need a pre with home theatre by-pass That is going to be my solution. 2 channel preamp by passing an AVR and into 2 channel amp. When watching surround stuff AVR with 2 channel amp still powering fronts. AVR can easily be updated as tech progress. I see this as a perfect solution.
Al.M Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 (edited) I run separate 2 ch & a HT system in 2 rooms and recently had major success in lifting the performance of the HT sound to within heat seeking missile range of the 2 ch sound. I started using electrostatic speakers in the HT setup in 2.1 speaker mode and the jump in ethereal imaging, detail, voicing is extremely realistic and much better than any high end conventional cone speaker I have had. I don't play very very loud so perhaps for others the ESL speaker may not be able to handle extreme loudness for some people. The HT amp is an oldish Panasonic SR57 digital chip amp circuit that provides close to upper mid hifi amp quality, on Xbox One console that is basically the DVD, internet TV and gaming console all in one. The ESL speakers are really lifting the performance of the whole system and making up the difference in less quality from the HT amp. Many ESL speakers are too large but I am recently trying some smaller ERAudio DIY ESL speakers (60x20cm) that are giving similar effect to a larger ESL. If I didn't have my 2 ch I could be happy with the ESL HT setup as I spend about 80-90% of my time on that vs the 2 ch, which if you think about it in functionality and listening material availability is only about 1/4 (CD and network player music and radio) of what the HT + Xbox which can provide all of that plus DVD and online movies, Youtube movies, music & general material, gaming & free to air TV Although not perfect solution but see some of the advantages of Xbox one as a HT console http://www.cnet.com/products/microsoft-xbox-one/ Edited May 23, 2016 by Al.M
betty boop Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 but you need a pre with home theatre by-pass Or a 2ch integrated wiht HT bypass...and so? ..there are models from 100s of dollars to 10,000s so plenty to pick from many makers... should not be a restriction in any way
betty boop Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 That is going to be my solution. 2 channel preamp by passing an AVR and into 2 channel amp. When watching surround stuff AVR with 2 channel amp still powering fronts. AVR can easily be updated as tech progress. I see this as a perfect solution. The beauty with that approach is the 2ch gear can stay with you literally forever. My first two generations took me through 10+ years each and no reason what am running now won't do same. HT gear goes through lot more tech churn and will likely come and go at higher freq....that said my last AV processor in the Denon flag ship took me 8 years and still going now donated to family member who is still very much enjoying. Ps I want to say as well that some processors are good 2ch wise. My old Denon was good. My marantz is good as well. However quite likely will achieve better for less 2ch wise with dedicated 2ch gear 2
Guest Sime Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 (edited) As @@betty boop has mentioned, there's no reason why a pre/pro can't be a good 2 channel pre. Both his and mine are 6k machines (8801,8802) I love the sound of it with 2 channel. Within my HT/2channel system, if you look at the 2 channel side of things, your looking at 10k per channel of gear, and that's nothing to sneeze at. Sure, if you want to get 2 channel to be great within a HT system, you have spend a lot more than a simple dedicated 2 channel, but the point is, both HT and 2 channel can and do co-exists happily, I don't feel like my 2 channel is compromised at all because it's in a hybrid system. But all systems are compromised at every level anyway. Edited May 23, 2016 by Sime
warweary Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 Pink Floyd and classical music don't need gapped playback, true enough, but random and shuffle play can reinvigorate pop albums and work great for parties. 1
Peta Posted May 23, 2016 Author Posted May 23, 2016 Another title I thought of using was Why don't makers of high priced music equipment manage to get it right when they make a Home Theatre product? I am quite happy with the sound I get now. What causes me annoyance is that when it comes to a multichannel preprocessor, manufacturers of "no compromise" Stereo equipment are happy to compromise to a high degree with gapped playback and throttled playback via AirPlay. Odd that.
Peta Posted May 23, 2016 Author Posted May 23, 2016 Pink Floyd and classical music don't need gapped playback, true enough, but random and shuffle play can reinvigorate pop albums and work great for parties. firstly I apologies for my snobishness in advance. I blame the nuns. There is nothing that can save most pop music even a good party. 4
aasza Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 What causes me annoyance is that when it comes to a multichannel preprocessor, manufacturers of "no compromise" Stereo equipment are happy to compromise to a high degree with gapped playback and throttled playback via AirPlay. Odd that. It's called giving the masses what they want. If these technologies were left out of high end manufacturers components they would essentially be limiting their target demographic to solely audiophiles that have all their music on LP or in FLAC/ALAC/DSD/DXD/SACD/Redbook Even at High End Munich a lot of manufacturers demo their equipment with wireless streaming via ipod/ipad/air play, these technologies are here to stay so why would a manufacturer ignore them when designing components.
Peta Posted May 23, 2016 Author Posted May 23, 2016 If these technologies were left out of high end manufacturers components they would essentially be limiting their target demographic to solely audiophiles that have all their music on LP or in FLAC/ALAC/DSD/DXD/SACD/Redbook If these technologies were left out of high end manufacturers components they would essentially be limiting their target demographic to solely audiophiles that have all their music on LP or in FLAC/ALAC/DSD/DXD/SACD/Redbook AKA - Me.
powerav Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 Why don't makers of high priced music equipment manage to get it right when they make a Home Theatre product? For the price of a Hi End Home Theatre product you can get a Pre Amp with Ht Bypass, a modern HT receiver with all the bells and whistles and a 2 channel power amp. You can have your cake, cream, icing and eat it as well.
warweary Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 Would a dual boot linux pc with a home theatre specific set on one boot and a hifi on the other be hitech enough? These boots are made for walking.
betty boop Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 For the price of a Hi End Home Theatre product you can get a Pre Amp with Ht Bypass, a modern HT receiver with all the bells and whistles and a 2 channel power amp. You can have your cake, cream, icing and eat it as well. If wanting to cut down on budget and box count, instead of a 2ch pre with HT bypass and a 2ch power. Can also go a 2h integrated with HT bypass. Otherwise if going pre Instead of using multiple power amps...can also go one good quality 7ch power amps. Just so many ways of going about things. If on a budget and looking for a 2ch pre with htbypass the parasound 2100 classic is only usually 100s dollars even brand new....if can spend a tad more ? A primare pre 30 can often be grabbed cheap ! looking for a 2ch integrated of quality with HT by,pass.... Have a look for a musical fidelity a3.5 integrated...should pick up for under a G bit more of a budget try grab a krell kav 400i awesome integrated for the money
davewantsmoore Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 Home theatre requirements are quite different from stereo system requirements ?
Guest Sime Posted May 23, 2016 Posted May 23, 2016 ? Exactly, my whole system is based on 2ch requirements except my pre is also a pro.
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