Htpc Build Questions

[MrBump]

XBMC will not output DTS-HD MA , or True-HD, it will down convert it to DTS or AC3 audio stream. Im not sure what the deal with is in windows, but, thats how it is in linux.

XBMC also wont play blu-ray iso's. never has....and it wont for a very long time. All blu-ray's have to be muxed with tsmuxer, and the revelent m2ts streams have to be ripped from it. XBMC plays m2ts streams perfectly, no need to re-encode to mkv.

Also, if planning on using linux...which is the best option out there, you will need to go for a nvidia video card, as they are the only cards supported in XBMC with gpu acceleration (vpdau), and this feature is a linux only feature. I think the 9xxx cards and the 2xx cards are supported under xbmc. The joy of having a GPU accelerated XBMC, is that all your 1080p content is flawless, and, the need for a high end cpu is pointless. you could run it on a single core if you wanted too.

you can also setup a mythtv backend, which can be navigated in a XBMC frontend, for all your pvr needs.

I would recommend though, instead of having a full HTPC box in your living room, using an in ion atom/nvidia solutions. they have either single, or dual core atoms out, but, 1080p content, on XBMC, can run on the single core atom, with gpu acceleration. And then you could just stream from another room, from your server/mythtv backend, all the content in the world to your ion based, XBMC front end. definately the best solution out there.

i would check out the Zotac MAG that has just come out, it looks amazing. its about 500 bucks.

if you have any other questions just ask, im always on the xbmc forums reading up about all the new stuff i can do to my XBMC box.

[myrantz]

you can also setup a mythtv backend, which can be navigated in a XBMC frontend, for all your pvr needs.

+1 on what you said (too bad about the HD audio part which is a requirement for me, oh well)...

Anyway, on an expansion on that. I just realised this gem call mythfs recently which exports MythTV recordings as file system. You can export that as a share to be used by XBMC (or any other media player really, I use WDTV!Live).

It seems unstable somewhat but works well 95% of the time...

Edited February 16, 2010 by treblid

[Guest]

XBMC will not output DTS-HD MA , or True-HD, it will down convert it to DTS or AC3 audio stream. Im not sure what the deal with is in windows, but, thats how it is in linux.

Really? that sucks monkeys. I think I may give up on the HD audio ide for now. My pos dvix 6600n it doesnt work on either. I really wanted to use XBMC, its nice for sorting music too, something else the tvix is crap at

Edited February 16, 2010 by Guest

[MLXXX]

It is now possible for ATI 5xxx series card to bitstream HD audio with your choice of player and the day of one hardware/ one software solution has already come to an end. Powerdvd 9 and Windvd 2010 can do that already and Arcsoft is the last to release a beta patch for that days ago. Intel Clarkdale mobos is another alternative you can buy. For that TMT3 is the last to join the game. I always think that they don't want to ruin their business with partner Asus so they have been tight lip all along and postpone the support for HD audio bitstream on other hardware till last.

Very interesting, and very good news.

If ffdshow can be used to bitstream HD audio then ZP should be a monty! That is excellent news.

...

I'd heard of the full monty but had to look up monty in a software sense; and found this at http://www.dictionary.net/monty :

monty

/mon'tee/ [uS Geological Survey] A program with a ludicrously complex user interface written to perform extremely trivial tasks. An example would be a menu-driven, button clicking, pulldown, pop-up windows program for listing directories. The original monty was an infamous weather-reporting program, Monty the Amazing Weather Man, written at the USGS. Monty had a widget-packed X-window interface with over 200 buttons; and all monty actually *did* was FTP files off the network.

Not sure though that this is what ajm meant.

[ajm1503559545]

Not sure though that this is what ajm meant.

Absolutely not! I guess the colloquialisms you learn in High School aren't always universal

[Guest]

i would check out the Zotac MAG that has just come out, it looks amazing. its about 500 bucks.

The Zotac box looks interesting. I could'nt make a pc for $500 if thats what they cost. The specs says dolby-ma and true-hd support for bitstreaming, but I've fallen for that one before with the *doesnt actually work fineprint

Do you know where they can be bought locally?

Shame about XBMC downsamplig the HD audio streams, is that a permanent feature or something thats likely to get addressed now there is hardware that supports it

[MrBump]

The Zotac box looks interesting. I could'nt make a pc for $500 if thats what they cost. The specs says dolby-ma and true-hd support for bitstreaming, but I've fallen for that one before with the *doesnt actually work fineprint

Do you know where they can be bought locally?

Shame about XBMC downsamplig the HD audio streams, is that a permanent feature or something thats likely to get addressed now there is hardware that supports it

i think the zotac mag does support it, but it would be support via windows, and whatever the software that decodes it is.

i dont think that its a permanent feature in xbmc, it just takes a while for all the latest and greatest hardware/audio to be supported.

all my m2ts blu-ray rips all have there dts-hd streams intact, cause as soon as they are supported in xbmc, they will play like they should. so, its just a waiting game.

and Aus PC Market has them online for $510 i think. When you think about it, thats a fantastic price for a HTPC that can do it all. sure, you will have to wait for dts-hd, and truehd to be supported via xbmc, but, thats no big deal.

[Guest]

SO, have done some pricing on builds, cheapest is the Zotac Mag up to dearest - Intel i5 core based box

The Ghetto build comes in at only a few dollars more and has the advantage of a proper case that I can fit a bluray drive or tv tuner card etc to.

Is there any real need to spend more on the parts or will the ghetto build do. I dont know much about the ION based boards, not sure of the grunt available, but I want something that can play a 1080p bluray rip and record from TV at the same time

All the builds *should* be capable of bistreaming HD audio streams provided software support is availabe.

The Zotac Mag is losing points because of the limited internal HDD space, as I only have a wireless connection available at this time so I prefer to keep HD media files local. I assume it only takes 2.5" hdd. (dont want to spend more $$ on a NAS device now either)

ZOTAC MAG HD ION330 MINI-ITX BLACK PC $510.4

Ghetto

Antec Fusion Remote - Black/Silver microATX HTPC Case with VFD + IR Receiver (No PSU) 215

Zalman 460W Noiseless ATX Power Supply (ZM460B-APS) 84.7

"Gigabyte GA-G41MT-ES2L Intel Mainboard -

2x DDR3 / 4x Sata / 1x IDE / Gigabit Lan / Onboard VGA / LGA 775" 62

Corsair DDR2 2GB PC-5300/667 (2x1GB) Value Select 59.4

Gigabyte ATI R545OC-512I RADEON HD5450, 512MB, GDDR3, PCIE2.0, DVI, HDCP, HDMI, DX11 64.9

Intel Dual Core E6500 / 2.93GHz / 2MB Cache / 1066FSB / LGA775 88

$574

Home made Zotac based

ZOTAC ION N330 DUAL-CORE MINI-ITX WIFI M/B 330

Corsair DDR2 2GB PC-5300/667 (2x1GB) Value Select 59.4

Antec Fusion Remote - Black/Silver microATX HTPC Case with VFD + IR Receiver (No PSU) 215

Zalman 460W Noiseless ATX Power Supply (ZM460B-APS) 84.7

$689.1

I5 Core based

Antec Fusion Remote - Black/Silver microATX HTPC Case with VFD + IR Receiver (No PSU) 215

Zalman 460W Noiseless ATX Power Supply (ZM460B-APS) 84.7

Intel Core i5-650 / 3.20GHz / 4MB Cache / Integrated Graphics / LGA 1156 238

GIGABYTE GA-H55M-S2H MICROATX BOARD - aus pc 136.4

Corsair DDR2 2GB PC-5300/667 (2x1GB) Value Select 59.4

$733.5

[glennb]

SO, have done some pricing on builds, cheapest is the Zotac Mag up to dearest - Intel i5 core based box

"Gigabyte GA-G41MT-ES2L Intel Mainboard -

2x DDR3 / 4x Sata / 1x IDE / Gigabit Lan / Onboard VGA / LGA 775" 62

Corsair DDR2 2GB PC-5300/667 (2x1GB) Value Select 59.4

I5 Core based

Antec Fusion Remote - Black/Silver microATX HTPC Case with VFD + IR Receiver (No PSU) 215

Zalman 460W Noiseless ATX Power Supply (ZM460B-APS) 84.7

Intel Core i5-650 / 3.20GHz / 4MB Cache / Integrated Graphics / LGA 1156 238

GIGABYTE GA-H55M-S2H MICROATX BOARD - aus pc 136.4

Corsair DDR2 2GB PC-5300/667 (2x1GB) Value Select 59.4

You've spec'd DDR2 RAM with DDR3 mobo's so that won't work too well. In both Ghetto and I5 builds.

Edited February 27, 2010 by Wacko02

[Guest]

You've spec'd DDR2 RAM with DDR3 mobo's so that won't work too well. In both Ghetto and I5 builds.

Good pickup thanks.

[Mediatek]

Also, the Imon VFD and IR receiver on the Antec Fusions has proven to be a pain in the ass for alot of users our there. Although it's neat, the Imon system is barely supported by Soundgraph if you have issues. their forums are a baron wasteland. Not to mention the next to useless volume controller on the front that if you're using a receiver, will be practically null and void for you.

I would suggest you save some money by using the Antec NSK2480 http://www.antec.com/Believe_it/product.php?id=MTE0Nw==

It has an identical configuration inside even down to the silent 120mm tricools. Buy a black one and match it with a 5.25" DVD-RW or BD-ROM Combo (Samsungs are REALLY good for the moneys) and a remote control will set you back about $30 (AIMs is a neat little package)

On top of that, I STILL reckon I'd be able to fit an RF keyboard with touch pad pointer for lest money.

Try the Shintaro, I think it's pretty good for a cheaper option and best of all, it's BIOS compatible so no running to the home PC to tear out your PS2 or USB keyboard to get settings changed or to install windows etc.

[Guest]

I would suggest you save some money by using the Antec NSK2480 http://www.antec.com/Believe_it/product.php?id=MTE0Nw==

Good advice with the case. I looked at this one, but thought I'd have better WAF with the one with knob and little screen. But if the VFD isnt really useful I wont bother. The 2480 is less than 1/2 the price too.

Any suggestions on the cpu/mobo combos? as I said earlier it needs to be able to play a 1080p m2ts and record live tv at once. I dont want to spend extra on a I5 system if its not needed

[Mr_Gimlet]

Good advice with the case. I looked at this one, but thought I'd have better WAF with the one with knob and little screen. But if the VFD isnt really useful I wont bother. The 2480 is less than 1/2 the price too.

Any suggestions on the cpu/mobo combos? as I said earlier it needs to be able to play a 1080p m2ts and record live tv at once. I dont want to spend extra on a I5 system if its not needed

The VFD is pretty useless. I have one on my HTPC and don't use it. In fact, one of the wires came off a few months ago and I didn't bother replacing it - I just use a Win compatible IR and chucked the remote.

On the i5 issue, the multicore is the benefit but this is also on other earlier chips. Fast discs help a lot as well.

[Guest]

Sonething else I'm not clear on is with cases that come with an IR receiver, not all come with remotes so how do you sync a IR remote to the case?

I already have a MCE remote that came with my Xbox360, could I use that? I would only need to learn the commands as I have a HarmonyOne

[techo]

Sonething else I'm not clear on is with cases that come with an IR receiver, not all come with remotes so how do you sync a IR remote to the case?

I already have a MCE remote that came with my Xbox360, could I use that? I would only need to learn the commands as I have a HarmonyOne

Much has to do with your chosen OS. Most (if not all) cases with VFD/LCD displays have drivers written for windows, likewise with their inbuilt IR receivers. Linux have V4L that will (usually with some persuasion) work with most hardware. Even though the MCE remotes came in different flavors most functions are supported under V4L, of course the IR receiver and remote have to be electrically compatible.

I have an old TT Mozart case with an imon VFD display, I don't use its remote though, preferring bluetooth.

The Mozart is one of my Mythtv frontends. I have it set to get its data from the myth server (backend), a useful display since it tells me what the backend is doing, what and when its recording and playing with a timeline etc (without having to fireup that fontend). Easy to do really in myth and infact the xbox version of XBMC, don't know about the windows version though.

I hope that helps you a little.

Edited February 28, 2010 by techo

[Mediatek]

I think the quick answer would probably be, depends of the brand but most will use media centre RC6 commands as a starting point.

Even if you purchase a little cheap AIM MCE remote online for $30, it's still worth it for the USB IR receiver that comes with it. You can connect it to a USB extention cable and place it outside you cabinet or up next to your TV with a bit of velcro or double sided tape.

The MCE RC6 remote control commands are available via the Harmony software and work beautifully. Having a Harmony also means you can create multiple devices (all technically media centre), one for "Live TV", and one for "Watch Videos" and so on, and then customize the harmonys' touch screen to suit the individual functions of the media centre.

This of course applies to ANY third party media centre app these days because they all support the original MS remotes.

[Mediatek]

Sorry for double post:

I think your specs are looking good.

With the case switch you'll save on case AND PSU cost. The Antec supplies a 380W entry level PSU but surprisingly, it is VERY quiet. I recommend giving it a chance, and if it annoys you, then make the PSU purchase. It WILL power without an issue everything you want in this system so don't stress about that.

Does that particular Gigabyte GPU have a fan? If so, back to the drawing board cus it will drive you to insanity.

The cooling on the Antec is fantastic at moving air, so a heatsink card would be a good choice. I think Sapphire do one in a low profile heatsink design so you can still fit a good quality tuner into the PCI-e slot usually located right next door to the PCI-e GPU slot. And if all is correct regarding the HD Bitstreaming via 5xxx cards, then you should be sitting pretty.

[Guest]

Good advice PHT, Ive now scrapped all the ION based builds, reading too many posts about driver issues.

Changed the case to the mid range Antec with small screen as a compromise (lower profile, dont have much cabinet space) still saves about $80

Also dropped the I5 chip down to I3 so the H55 box now is about the same as the ghetto build (swapped gpu for fanless per advice)

Both builds are now in the ~$500 sweet spot. Its just a matter of whos got better driver support really out of the Icore or ATI5xx based setup

Ive also been looking at the DUNE3.0, I love XBMC but at this time it doesnt support HD audio bitstreaming or bluray iso playback. The dune does both and has full menu support in bd iso so two points there

I'd also like the box to multitask as a PVR so -1 dune there

decisions... The Mrs will not be happy if I stuff this up again

Edited March 3, 2010 by Guest

[ajm1503559545]

decisions... The Mrs will not be happy if I stuff this up again

Whatever you build, it will not be as "user-friendly" as a standalone box like the Dune or a PVR like the Beyonwiz. I've been using a HTPC for several years now and after stuffing around with numerous OS and applications I've found the wireless keyboard with inbuilt mouse (Shintaro) to be the only reliable way to use it. Suffice to say, the Mrs probably isn't going to be thrilled at that idea.

A HTPC can give you a lot of bang for your buck but that also means complication. If simple is a prerequisite then you might be better off looking elsewhere. (IMO and experience anyway)

[myrantz]

Whatever you build, it will not be as "user-friendly" as a standalone box like the Dune or a PVR like the Beyonwiz. I've been using a HTPC for several years now and after stuffing around with numerous OS and applications I've found the wireless keyboard with inbuilt mouse (Shintaro) to be the only reliable way to use it. Suffice to say, the Mrs probably isn't going to be thrilled at that idea.

Not using iMon? Me trained my Harmony with iMon codes and have been using that to navigate the HTPC... Alot of these multimedia apps have keyboard shortcuts, and thus the iMon app can be set as such, e.g. for my case I have set it up to work with both win32 MythTV and TMT3....

iMon works well (although I can't seem to power it on from the remote), but I assume any IR receiver should do too.

Quite user friendly, as long as the software don't crash...

[ajm1503559545]

No, not using the iMon, for the two reasons you mentioned - it won't power on the system and it won't help if something glitches. At one stage I spent weeks setting up Girder to get the PC and remote to work with all the different apps I used for DVD, media, DTV etc. When it worked it worked well but when it didn't it was useless - out came the mouse and keyboard.

I got tired of rummaging around for the keyboard when something froze, or an update box appeared or any of the endless other PC-ish things happened. In the end I just found it easier to keep the keyboard on my lap and ditched the remotes.

I'm considering buying a new standalone player for BD now. Maybe a Dune so I can play the .ISO files as well.

[myrantz]

No, not using the iMon, for the two reasons you mentioned - it won't power on the system and it won't help if something glitches.

is that a common iMon problem? I thought it's only the case with my PC (I am at a loss how to fix it, it just don't work )....

At one stage I spent weeks setting up Girder to get the PC and remote to work with all the different apps I used for DVD, media, DTV etc. When it worked it worked well but when it didn't it was useless - out came the mouse and keyboard.

I got tired of rummaging around for the keyboard when something froze, or an update box appeared or any of the endless other PC-ish things happened. In the end I just found it easier to keep the keyboard on my lap and ditched the remotes.

The iMon software worked out quite well for me fortunately... Just like lirc in Linux but it's easier to setup... It's solely my fault that my MythTV hangs so frequently now , the Myth devs have changed something recently that broke something...

I'm considering buying a new standalone player for BD now. Maybe a Dune so I can play the .ISO files as well.

Say it aint' so... Say no to standalone BD player.. They are evil!!! Stop feeding evil... I rather stick with a RFI noise than go a standalone player... At least for now with those DRM crap. BD loading is actually not that slow, but they slowed it down deliberately (those pls wait messages are skippable!)... See this pict to see exactly how screwed you'd be if you get a commercial player.

That said, the Dune is one sexy machine...

[ajm1503559545]

Say it aint' so... Say no to standalone BD player.. They are evil!!! Stop feeding evil... I rather stick with a RFI noise than go a standalone player... At least for now with those DRM crap. BD loading is actually not that slow, but they slowed it down deliberately (those pls wait messages are skippable!)... See this pict to see exactly how screwed you'd be if you get a commercial player.

That said, the Dune is one sexy machine...

Yeah I feel like a filthy dirty traitor.

Not 100% which way to go, Oppo or Dune. But this is waaaaay OT.

Hopefully food for thought though.

[myrantz]

Yeah I feel like a filthy dirty traitor.

Yeah, you're back to the darkside now, supporting those greedy DRM folks...

Not 100% which way to go, Oppo or Dune. But this is waaaaay OT.

Hopefully food for thought though.

Not exactly as when speccing your HTPC one also needs to consider future upgrade paths... To be honest the advantages of HTPC have waned again somewhat.. But some people (esp me) still prefer a custom media player that can be tweaked to my hearts' contents. And the upgrade path to 3D (or QuadHD) should one choose to go ahead with 'em will be hell lot easier with a HTPC... . HTPC is always on the bleeding edge, but I guess sometimes one can bled out too quickly..

[glennb]

No, not using the iMon, for the two reasons you mentioned - it won't power on the system and it won't help if something glitches. At one stage I spent weeks setting up Girder to get the PC and remote to work with all the different apps I used for DVD, media, DTV etc. When it worked it worked well but when it didn't it was useless - out came the mouse and keyboard.

I got tired of rummaging around for the keyboard when something froze, or an update box appeared or any of the endless other PC-ish things happened. In the end I just found it easier to keep the keyboard on my lap and ditched the remotes.

I'm considering buying a new standalone player for BD now. Maybe a Dune so I can play the .ISO files as well.

This is where i'm headed also. Having to upgrade the HTPC to get BD and .ISO playback is giving me nightmares just on having to go through the process of sorting all the bugs out and drivers etc. I'd rather just have a BD ROM drive in another PC and stream to a Dune or something. Just need to sort out the PVR options to make it integrated.

The whole reason for HTPC in the first place was because there was nothing like a DUNE on the market that was able to have anywhere near the functionality of a HTPC. There still isn't (no PVR), but it's getting closer.