momaw Posted April 9, 2007 Posted April 9, 2007 Gino said: How about the right one? I agree with macca350, does it matter what format it is so long as it is lossless? Just give us 7 discrete channels! The right one, well that could change everything What macca says it true, but again, Fox only put DTS HD Master on their titles so unless you can decode it you don't have a lossless option on Fox titles
cwt Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 alebonau said: exactly momaw and unfortunately thats my point we've got the technology but cant enjoy it ! That S&V article is misleading Al.As you know the hd a1 had a dd truehd decoder that initially only did 2 channel core sound but was upgraded to 5.1 full hd. Similarly it has a dts hd decoder that currently does only 1.5 core. When you read dts.com it states a dts hd decoder can decode dts hd and hd ma as pcm. Hopefully the upgrade will include 7.1 not 5.1 I know you dont like LG but the dual player does have dtshd ma decoding[ 5.1 through the analogs]; If only it wasnt 2 channel through the hdmi.
betty boop Posted April 10, 2007 Author Posted April 10, 2007 cwt said: That S&V article is misleading Al.As you know the hd a1 had a dd truehd decoder that initially only did 2 channel core sound but was upgraded to 5.1 full hd. Similarly it has a dts hd decoder that currently does only 1.5 core. When you read dts.com it states a dts hd decoder can decode dts hd and hd ma as pcm. Hopefully the upgrade will include 7.1 not 5.1 I know you dont like LG but the dual player does have dtshd ma decoding[ 5.1 through the analogs]; If only it wasnt 2 channel through the hdmi. all very interesting cwt. I wonder why they stopped at 5.1 on truehd with the tosh hd-dvd plaeyrs. strange stuff with the LG it definetly must have been rushed though for CES with odities like that. wonder why they could only manage 2ch on DTS-HDma via hdmi
momaw Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 alebonau said: all very interesting cwt. I wonder why they stopped at 5.1 on truehd with the tosh hd-dvd plaeyrs.strange stuff with the LG it definetly must have been rushed though for CES with odities like that. wonder why they could only manage 2ch on DTS-HDma via hdmi Probaby because there are no 7.1 tracks. Even after more than 5 years of Dolby EX and DTS discreet ES, there are virtually no 6.1 tracks. They probably just don't see the point.
betty boop Posted April 10, 2007 Author Posted April 10, 2007 momaw said: Probaby because there are no 7.1 tracks. Even after more than 5 years of Dolby EX and DTS discreet ES, there are virtually no 6.1 tracks. They probably just don't see the point. I thought franin posted there was a blu-ray with 7.1 it could jsut be incorrectly flagged, but I thought he did. I wish we'd see more as even DTS-ES discrete can do wonderfull effects.
momaw Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 alebonau said: I thought franin posted there was a blu-ray with 7.1it could jsut be incorrectly flagged, but I thought he did. I wish we'd see more as even DTS-ES discrete can do wonderfull effects. it's actually a PCM discreet 6.1 track that for some reason comes out on his system as 7.1 (probably matrixing the rear channel into 2)
betty boop Posted April 10, 2007 Author Posted April 10, 2007 momaw said: it's actually a PCM discreet 6.1 track that for some reason comes out on his system as 7.1 (probably matrixing the rear channel into 2) I thought it would be somethign liek that but he was pretty adamant. it gives me the shits how they advertise enjoy 7.1 lossless soudn in the blu-ray Hd-DVD promos when in fact its not somethign you can do.
cwt Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 momaw said: it's actually a PCM discreet 6.1 track that for some reason comes out on his system as 7.1 (probably matrixing the rear channel into 2) That was the clincher mo; not only his denon but hi def digests ps3 said it was 7.1 pcm.The regular lossy was dd ex only.
momaw Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 cwt said: That was the clincher mo; not only his denon but hi def digests ps3 said it was 7.1 pcm.The regular lossy was dd ex only. Quote According to the back of the box, Lionsgate has cooked up two mixes for 'Crank' on Blu-ray -- a Dolby Digital Surround EX 5.1 and an uncompressed PCM 6.1 surround (although interestingly enough, the readout on my PlayStation 3 actually indicates PCM 7.1, not 6.1). Anyone who enjoys loud surrounds won't be disappointed here. Hmmmm so which is it? I tend to think it is probably 6.1 as the box says and the rear channel is being matrixed to 2 channels (as 7.1 receivers are supposed to do).
MACCA350 Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 This is what FRANIN wrote about it: Quote How this, crank show it's 6.1 pcm on the menu system.When playing it comes out 7.1. I pressed the select button and on the osd it shows 7.1.Like most amps it shows the left being what signal is coming out of the dvd player and the right shows show what your putting it out as.On my amp is showed the left as 7.1 and the right as 7.1 also.But my question is I thought there was no titles avaialble in 7.1.Does anyone else have crank on blu-ray? Great film, great audio, but I still cannot believe it.Going on that its 7.1 going into the receiver, but the question is whether or not the player is matrixing a second rear channel before it's output, or is it actually 7.1 on the disc and a misprint on the cover(and we all know this is not a stretch)cheers
momaw Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 MACCA350 said: This is what FRANIN wrote about it:Going on that its 7.1 going into the receiver, but the question is whether or not the player is matrixing a second rear channel before it's output, or is it actually 7.1 on the disc and a misprint on the cover(and we all know this is not a stretch) cheers Well in both cases it was a PS3 as the source player......
betty boop Posted April 10, 2007 Author Posted April 10, 2007 MACCA350 said: This is what FRANIN wrote about it:Going on that its 7.1 going into the receiver, but the question is whether or not the player is matrixing a second rear channel before it's output, or is it actually 7.1 on the disc and a misprint on the cover(and we all know this is not a stretch) cheers comes a across liek a cock up to me personally. if it was 7.1 theyd be crowing all about it on the cover. now in 7.1. 1st movie in 7.1 etc. the main point though is was it really in 7.1 ? was there discrete rear channel audio. probably only franin or anyone else experiencing on a 7.1 could answer.
cwt Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 momaw said: Hmmmm so which is it? I tend to think it is probably 6.1 as the box says and the rear channel is being matrixed to 2 channels (as 7.1 receivers are supposed to do). Well If FRANIN'S denon is anything like my dtr 10.5 ;you feed it a 5.1 ex track [as an example] and the readout will be 5.1 + NEO6/ +PROLOGIC 11X/ + THX ULTRA 2 etc or straight 5.1 ex. If it recieves a signal that says pcm then the amp is not decoding it and as the ps3 I assume doesnt have a dd ex decoder it must be 7.1 pcm .I concede I do not know if the dolby decoder in the ps3 is an expensive one - so I can see where your coming from ;)Of course FRANIN probably had his ps3 set to pcm and not bitstream so that also takes the amp decoders out of the loop.
momaw Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 Well the Yamaha 2700 only comes up with MPCM on the display and then lights up the icons for all speakers being played.
cwt Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 momaw said: Well the Yamaha 2700 only comes up with MPCM on the display and then lights up the icons for all speakers being played. Thats the crux of it mo; the ps3 decodes it as pcm so no need for the amp to apply thx ultra2 [which as you say gives 7.1 speaker output from a 6.1 dts es or 5.1 ex source] You know the more I think about this the more I realise thx ultra 2 mode is the only lossy mode that can currently give 7.1 output[ maybe lexicon's logic7 -Al would know] and I know the ps3 doesnt have these ; doh
Cody Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 yep, still too much up in the air - very annoying hurry-up already and give us players with 7.1 TrueHD & DTS HD-MA capability, AVR's with the same (and a reason why we need them) and let us all get on with focussing on the content and the experience
betty boop Posted April 10, 2007 Author Posted April 10, 2007 cwt said: Thats the crux of it mo; the ps3 decodes it as pcm so no need for the amp to apply thx ultra2 [which as you say gives 7.1 speaker output from a 6.1 dts es or 5.1 ex source] You know the more I think about this the more I realise thx ultra 2 mode is the only lossy mode that can currently give 7.1 output[ maybe lexicon's logic7 -Al would know] and I know the ps3 doesnt have these ; doh lexicon logic7 is certianly about 7.1 cwt. I use it all th time for dtv. gives a nice 7.1 decode off pcm stereo.
betty boop Posted April 10, 2007 Author Posted April 10, 2007 Disgruntled Goat said: yep, still too much up in the air - very annoying hurry-up already and give us players with 7.1 TrueHD & DTS HD-MA capability, AVR's with the same (and a reason why we need them) and let us all get on with focussing on the content and the experience I know wish we could just fast forward to when all this is common place
cwt Posted April 10, 2007 Posted April 10, 2007 alebonau said: lexicon logic7 is certianly about 7.1 cwt. I use it all th time for dtv. gives a nice 7.1 decode off pcm stereo. The one codec onkyo was too cheap to license Al
momaw Posted April 11, 2007 Posted April 11, 2007 Did someone want advanced audio codecs in a receiver? Queue Heavenly Music Your prayers have been answered You can bet your bottom dollar the corresponding HD DVD players will be released around the same time.
betty boop Posted April 11, 2007 Author Posted April 11, 2007 momaw said: Did someone want advanced audio codecs in a receiver?Queue Heavenly Music Your prayers have been answered You can bet your bottom dollar the corresponding HD DVD players will be released around the same time. that is great news and such an affordable price at $399US. onkyo is goign to sell a bundle of these. guys DO NOT buy an avr just now. especially with gear like this coming. great to see the likes of onkyo supporting hi-def and ALL the hi-def surround formats. and great to know onkyo have already said they are keen on hd-dvd ! so hopefully a player from them indeed follows.
momaw Posted April 11, 2007 Posted April 11, 2007 alebonau said: that is great news and such an affordable price at $399US. onkyo is goign to sell a bundle of these.guys DO NOT buy an avr just now. especially with gear like this coming. great to see the likes of onkyo supporting hi-def and ALL the hi-def surround formats. and great to know onkyo have already said they are keen on hd-dvd ! so hopefully a player from them indeed follows. Keep in mind the 605 is actually $499 not $399. That is the price of the 604 which apparently does have HDMI 1.3a, but not the decoders. You notice that 1.3a spec too? looks like HDMI 1.3 has already been superseded. Way to build consumer confidence. For those link allergic TX-SR605 MSRP $499 Shipping mid May *Full A/V Processing via HDMI 1.3a with Upconversion (2 in 1 out) *HDMI Deep Color Capable (36bit) *Component Video Upconversion and HDTV-Capable (50 MHZ) Video Switching (3 in 1 out) *WRAT/ Optimum Gain Volume Circuitry/ Non-Scaling Configuration/ A-Form Listening Mode Memory/ RI *Faroudja DCDi *Audyssey 2EQ Room Acoustics Correction *7.1 Multichannel Inputs for PCM Delivery of Hi-Def Audio Sources *DOLBY Decoder - PLIIx, DD, DD-EX, TrueHD *DTS Decoder - DTS, ES, NEO6, 96/24, HD Master Audio *S-Video (5 in 2 out) *Digital Audio IN (OPT/COAX) 3/3 *Composite Video (5 in/2 out) *Power 90W/Ch *Powered Zone 2 and Zone 2 Line-Out *Bi-Amp Capable *XM and Sirius ports *XM HD Surround Sound through Neural Surround The only real disappointment is only having 2 HDMI in. Seriously, after years of struggling to get AVR's with enough component inputs, we have to go through it all again with insufficient HDMI inputs.
betty boop Posted April 11, 2007 Author Posted April 11, 2007 momaw said: Keep in mind the 605 is actually $499 not $399. That is the price of the 604 which apparently does have HDMI 1.3a, but not the decoders.You notice that 1.3a spec too? looks like HDMI 1.3 has already been superseded. Way to build consumer confidence. oh boy 1.3a hey ? wonder whats the diff ? price wise that should still bring it in here under $1k. can jsut imagine what tasty things the integra pre-pros are going to turn out to be. seriously hot property ! and the beauty is their fully upgradeable architecture
momaw Posted April 11, 2007 Posted April 11, 2007 alebonau said: oh boy 1.3a hey ? wonder whats the diff ?price wise that should still bring it in here under $1k. can jsut imagine what tasty things the integra pre-pros are going to turn out to be. seriously hot property ! and the beauty is their fully upgradeable architecture Here's one for you Al TX-NR905 MSRP $1999 Est Shipping date mid to late August *Full A/V Processing via HDMI 1.3a with Upconversion (4 in 2 out) *HDMI Deep Color Capable (36bit) *Component Video Upconversion and HDTV-Capable (100 MHZ) Video Switching (? in 1 out) *WRAT/ Optimum Gain Volume Circuitry/ Non-Scaling Configuration/ A-Form Listening Mode Memory/ RI *HQV Reon-VX Video Processing and NSV Precision Video *Audyssey MultEQ XT Room Acoustics Correction *7.1 Multichannel Inputs for PCM Delivery of Hi-Def Audio Sources *DOLBY Decoder - PLIIx, DD, DD-EX, TrueHD *DTS Decoder - DTS, ES, NEO6, 96/24, HD Master Audio *THX Ultra2 Certified *S-Video (? in 1 out) *Digital Audio IN (OPT/COAX) ?/? *Composite (? in 1 out) *Burr-Brown 192/24-bit DAC on all Channels (TI Architecture (PCM1796)) *Power ??0W/Ch *Powered Zone 2 with Video Balance Volume and tone control *Powered Zone 3 *Bi-Amp & BTL Capable *Dual Push-Pull Amp with 3 stage inverted *Toroidal Transformer and Seperate Transformers for processing. *Networking Capabilities via Onkyo's e-Control System for Internet Radio and WMA Couple of callout points. 4 HDMI 1.3a in with 2 out (1 to the Plasma/LCD and 1 to the PJ). Reon-VX video processor for upscaling of non HD sources. THX ultra 2. Burr Brown Dacs. Dolby True HD and DTS HD Master. Now to find the cash Apparently the TX-SR875 has these same features I pulled out at $1599US.
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