ufo Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 So if that's the case, with the system in my sig, where to you would I be compromised? Can an 8801 processor not be a good two channel pre? Are ALL two channel only pre's regardless of cost, better at doing 2 channel than it? And in regards to the rest of the system, speakers amps cables etc, it's two channel qualified. I'm not trying to make an argument for my system, just using it as an example that's it's not so black and white as you put it. Can an 8801 processor not be a good two channel pre? Are ALL two channel only pre's regardless of cost, better at doing 2 channel than it? No not really. After realizing how good was CX-A5100 in two channel too, I got rid off my 2CH pre. Very happy with the result both in 2Ch & Multi CH.
powerav Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 Can an 8801 processor not be a good two channel pre? Are ALL two channel only pre's regardless of cost, better at doing 2 channel than it? No not really. After realizing how good was CX-A5100 in two channel too, I got rid off my 2CH pre. Very happy with the result both in 2Ch & Multi CH. My train of thought is just if you wish to go down the atmos or dts x path you would need a 11 channel amp or something, where with an AVR you can power the main channels 2,3 or 5 and let the receiver power the effects channels. Then have your 2 channel processor for your stereo music. Thoughts?
Satanica Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 (edited) I am quite happy with the sound I get now. What causes me annoyance is that when it comes to a multichannel preprocessor, manufacturers of "no compromise" Stereo equipment are happy to compromise to a high degree with gapped playback and throttled playback via AirPlay. Odd that. What's odd about it? It does give them the opportunity to sell you another device (streamer) with the features you need being a "picky" audiophile. To be fair how many people buy a processor assuming it's capable of the highest quality streaming playback? I honestly don't know but I'm assuming it's a minority. Edited May 24, 2016 by Satanica 1
Guest Sime Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 A good processor will do what it's supposed to do, and do it well, and that's multichannel processing and video processing. I don't even want to buy a pre/pro that has streaming services, there's way better individual products that will always to a better job. I'm actually annoyed my pre/pro has a tuner.
powerav Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 .I'm actually annoyed my pre/pro has a tuner. That's funny, that is one thing all HT avr's/processors could get rid off. Absolutely useless.
ufo Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 My train of thought is just if you wish to go down the atmos or dts x path you would need a 11 channel amp or something, where with an AVR you can power the main channels 2,3 or 5 and let the receiver power the effects channels. Then have your 2 channel processor for your stereo music. Thoughts? That's what I was doing. I had a CX-A3020 and later bought 2 monoblocks to power my fronts thru 3020's pre outs and let 3020 to power other speakers. I was expecting considerable improvement in 2CH listening with this setup but it didn't eventuate (at least to my ears) Started considering 2CH preamps with Ht bypass but wasn't too sure which way to go. Then I managed to borrow CA 851D and difference in 2CH was very obvious. But it didn't have HT bypass. After some lengthy search, I ended up buying a very high end Preamp which had HT bypass. Now the 2CH listening was thrilling but in multichannel listening I was bypassing the preamp thus multichannel listening was dull. So I started looking into Pre/Pro setup. After auditioning a few I decided to go with CX-A5100 because the difference in 2CH between dedicated 2 CH preamp and 5100 wasn't that much. So sold my 2Ch preamp to finance my external amps. Now runing 5100 as pre for both 2CH & multi channel and very happy/satisfied with it. 1
Peta Posted May 24, 2016 Author Posted May 24, 2016 (edited) What's odd about it? It does give them the opportunity to sell you another device (streamer) with the features you need being a "picky" audiophile. To be fair how many people buy a processor assuming it's capable of the highest quality streaming playback? I honestly don't know but I'm assuming it's a minority. and yet, if it can be done in a separate it can be done in an integrated too. Interestingly, Marantz replicated the mistakes they made with the AV7005 with the separate streamers. Gapped playback. For the reasons I suggest in the original post. I see gradual change for the better, however. I think that we are a bit too accepting of poor "audiophile" functionality (not that I think that insertion of gaps that were not in the source is a high end only issue) and that allows the manufacturers to think that they need not build the functionality in as standard. Also look at the choice Auralic made to not include Roon Ready in the Aires Mini for "commercial reasons" - ie to direct you to the higher priced equipment with the same software and hardware base. Another argument I have not started is that at $10k, for a preprocessor, one might expect to be picky. An intellectually honest marketing vendor would either have the premium quality throughout the product or leave the function out. Once again, I think it is the assumption that such features as playing music from a NAS/Computer are gimmicks and that guides the decision making for the product designers. Edited May 24, 2016 by Peta
powerav Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 How many amps are you using? I'm just thinking of the extra storage space for all the amps. 5.1 will be easy to handle but when you have a dedicated large HT room with 7.1 now and wish to go down the atmos path, that's a lot of amps and boxes.
powerav Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 Also look at the choice Auralic made to not include Roon Ready in the Aires Mini for "commercial reasons" - ie to direct you to the higher priced equipment with the same software and hardware base. Yes that sort of stuff really turns me off and against these companies.....arrogance to me. 1
ufo Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 How many amps are you using? I'm just thinking of the extra storage space for all the amps. 5.1 will be easy to handle but when you have a dedicated large HT room with 7.1 now and wish to go down the atmos path, that's a lot of amps and boxes. Yeah, lots of amps but who is complaining, except the missus If you already have 7.1 setup, all you need is a smallish 4 - 5 channel amp to power the atmos speakers, they don't require too much power. Also having separate amp for the Atmos speakers gives you the option to turn them off during multi channel listening. If you had a 11 channel A/V receiver or pre/pro setup with a single power amp, there is no way to turn off Atmos speakers.
Satanica Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 and yet, if it can be done in a separate it can be done in an integrated too. Interestingly, Marantz replicated the mistakes they made with the AV7005 with the separate streamers. Gapped playback. For the reasons I suggest in the original post. I see gradual change for the better, however. I think that we are a bit too accepting of poor "audiophile" functionality (not that I think that insertion of gaps that were not in the source is a high end only issue) and that allows the manufacturers to think that they need not build the functionality in as standard. Also look at the choice Auralic made to not include Roon Ready in the Aires Mini for "commercial reasons" - ie to direct you to the higher priced equipment with the same software and hardware base. Another argument I have not started is that at $10k, for a preprocessor, one might expect to be picky. An intellectually honest marketing vendor would either have the premium quality throughout the product or leave the function out. Once again, I think it is the assumption that such features as playing music from a NAS/Computer are gimmicks and that guides the decision making for the product designers. I gave up on audiophile and videophile companies long ago. Plug a half decent PC into your stereo and the world's your oyster.
Peta Posted May 24, 2016 Author Posted May 24, 2016 (edited) How many amps are you using? I'm just thinking of the extra storage space for all the amps. 5.1 will be easy to handle but when you have a dedicated large HT room with 7.1 now and wish to go down the atmos path, that's a lot of amps and boxes. Two stereo amps for the main channels, bi-amp configuration. A dedicated power amp for the Subwoofer. A separate 5 channel amp for centre and surround with old fashioned power switch that I use to turn it on when needed. XLR outputs for the Front Left and Right RCA for the other channels. The room is about 8m long, 4.5 wide and up to 4.2m high. I tried additional speakers in several configurations and found the benefits marginal because most source material is limited to 5.1. I sit the BelCanto power amps (R150 for high end and R500 for the mid-bass) side by side on top of the preprocessor. A two channel 250W a channel Rotel class D on the 15" sub. A 5 channel Rotel Class D with 100W a channel for the centre and surround. Edited May 24, 2016 by Peta
Peta Posted May 24, 2016 Author Posted May 24, 2016 I gave up on audiophile and videophile companies long ago. Plug a half decent PC into your stereo and the world's your oyster. I understand that perspective. I just do not want the clutter and annoyances of a PC sitting around an otherwise relaxing room. Besides having to deal with PC updates and incompatibilities, crashing etc. 1
ufo Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 I understand that perspective. I just do not want the clutter and annoyances of a PC sitting around an otherwise relaxing room. Besides having to deal with PC updates and incompatibilities, crashing etc. Use a laptop.
Satanica Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 (edited) I understand that perspective. I just do not want the clutter and annoyances of a PC sitting around an otherwise relaxing room. Besides having to deal with PC updates and incompatibilities, crashing etc. Understandable. But gapless playback has been available on a PC since about 1997, just sayin Edited May 24, 2016 by Satanica
Guest Sime Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 The only way, in my honest opinion is multiple amplifiers. One per channel preferably.
ufo Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 The only way, in my honest opinion is multiple amplifiers. One per channel preferably. Yeah, who wouldn't want that but what about the cost
Satanica Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 The only way, in my honest opinion is multiple amplifiers. One per channel preferably. Ha, completely active here. Try one per driver and I've got 10 of them
Satanica Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 Use a laptop. Some impressive HTPC cases these days that look like appliances and not computers. 1
Guest Sime Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 Ha, completely active here. Try one per driver and I've got 10 of them Pics or your bull schiiting
ufo Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 (edited) Ha, completely active here. Try one per driver and I've got 10 of them Any place left to sit down & enjoy the sound? Edited May 24, 2016 by ufo 1
rocky500 Posted May 24, 2016 Posted May 24, 2016 (edited) You could always look into reducing the amount of Amplifiers. Free up space for a PC. I am curious to see how the new Emotiva XPA Gen3 amps will go. Class A/B but with the benefit of being efficient with a switching power supply. Edited May 24, 2016 by rocky500
Recommended Posts