Warren M. Posted July 2, 2015 Posted July 2, 2015 (edited) We have an extraordinary and exciting lineup of hi fi for the meeting this Sunday, including: a revolutionary DIY power amplifier, China's most lauded moderate-priced valve preamplifier, phono and CD electronics from a high-end Canadian manufacturer, state of the art DIY speakers in their 6th (and most life-like) iteration, and the latest JLTi Oppo universal digital player (enhancements now being exported from Australia to numerous countries). And, since Saturday is American Independence Day, we are using a superb US turntable to showcase some absolutely stunning records. This turntable was Stereophile's 2009 Source Component of the Year! If that wasn't enough, we have David Moore, who previously showed us his impressive modifications and improvements to ME amplifiers, returning to show us his own newly designed amplifier. Here is the system we'll be using: Speakers: Joe Rasmussen's Elsinore Mk6 current-compatible speakers http://customanalogue.com/elsinore/elsinore_index.htm Power Amplifier: Joe Rasmussen-designed DIY chip-based 40 WRMS/channel transconductance amplifier http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/chip-amps/239321-joe-rasmussen-trans-amp-40-watt-transconductance-current-amplifier.html Preamplifier: Dogé 8 outstanding Chinese valve preamp including Chinese military grade bypass caps and GE NOS 12AT7WC tubes http://www.doge-audio.com/products/doge%208.htm SACD/digital player: JLTi Level4 Oppo 105 CD/SACD/DVD/BD/digital-datafile player http://customanalogue.com/jlti_multiplayer.htm CD Player: Bryston BCD-1 CD player http://www.bryston.com/products/digital_audio/BCD-1.html Phono Preamp: Bryston BP 1.5 Phono Preamplifier / MPS2 Outboard Power Supply http://www.bryston.com/products/pre_amps/BP15.html Turntable: VPI Super Scout Master turntable http://www.stereophile.com/content/istereophileis-products-2009-2009-analog-source-component-year Bring your own music (any format! - well, avoid the 8-track tape, DSD, cassette and reel-to-reel please, but vinyl or any current digital format is fine) Among the recordings we might be playing: Take 5 from Dave Brubeck Quartet Time Out - astounding 45RPM remaster, from the original 3-track stereo master tapes, by Analogue Productions. I have a few CD reissues (all terrible) as well as a Sony 180g reissue (very good), but nothing prepared me for the subtlety, depth and realism which comes across in this new remaster (pressing number not recorded). Famous Blue Raincoat from Jennifer Warnes Famous Blue Raincoat 20th Anniversary Edition - superb 45RPM remaster, Cisco Music (pressing number 1467) This Can't Be Love from Ella Fitzgerald sings the Rodgers and Hart Song Book - great 45RPM remaster from the original Verve tapes produced by ORG (pressing number 250) Jupiter from Gustav Holst's The Planets - David Robertson conducting the Sydney Symphony Orchestra on a new SSO hybrid SACD Final 8 minutes of Gustav Mahler's Symphony No 2 - David Zinman conducting the Tonhalle Orchestra and Schweizer Chamber Choir on an RCA hybrid SACD - in my opinion, the best performance/recording ever made of this incredible work (I have several, including famous performances by Solti, Klemperer, Bernstein...) See you this Sunday at 2 ! Guests are MOST welcome. Date: Sunday 5 July 2015 Time: Starts 2pm to 5pm Where: Epping Creative Centre (in the Epping Aquatic Centre Complex) 26 Stanley Road, EPPING NSW Cheers, Warren Edited July 2, 2015 by Warren M. 2
Tony ray Posted July 8, 2015 Posted July 8, 2015 How did the Elsinore Mk 6 sound with the SB drivers ?
Steever Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 I'm still looking for a nice, remoted, conventional cased, tube pre. That Doge looks interesting...
Andrew S. Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 I'm still looking for a nice, remoted, conventional cased, tube pre. That Doge looks interesting... I think @ has a Conrad Johnson for sale; I think it is one I used to own, and has an upgraded EAT tube. It used to be mine, and is very good.
WhoRu? Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 I sold the CJ pre a while ago... I do have a Manley Jumbo Shrimp for sale though
Andrew S. Posted July 13, 2015 Posted July 13, 2015 I sold the CJ pre a while ago... I do have a Manley Jumbo Shrimp for sale though Another great pre amp!
Warren M. Posted July 16, 2015 Author Posted July 16, 2015 (edited) Sorry for the delay in reviewing the meeting. This review should be seen in the light of the fact that I was one of the presenters. It was a FABULOUS presentation - probably the best ever seen in recent memory. OK. Maybe not quite that spectacular. But I enjoyed it a lot, and got the impression that most attendees did too. We set up a half-width auditorium, by creating a pseudo-wall using upturned tables (we did something similar in February). Joe's beautiful DIY speakers were placed near the rear wall, based on calculations he had done regarding large-volume listening environments. More on the results of this later. During the first half of the meeting, we used Joe's transconductance amp, changing over to David Moore's prototype power amp in the second half. Joe stressed that he built the transconductance amp primarily to provide a current-driven test environment for his various current-compatible speakers. He also stressed that there are only a select few types of speaker systems which can be driven by this amp, and that it would pretty quickly destroy speakers which were incompatible with it. The Dogé 8 preamp was connected to the power amp using Anticables level 4 silver interconnects. I would have preferred to use these from one of the sources to the preamp, but we needed their length to cover the distance between the power amplifiers and the preamp. These normally sit between my valve phono preamp and the Dogé 8. The VIP turntable, Bryston solid state phono preamp/power supply, and Bryston CD player were provided by Joseph A, along with (very short) interconnects to connect them. In the end, the rather messy configuration of the table was mainly dictated by the physical difficulty positioning components close enough to each other to connect. So... How did it sound? In a word, surprising! Firstly, the transconductance amplifier acquitted itself remarkably well. It sounded somewhat valve-like in its presentation, with a sweet, perhaps even seductive sound. I found the bass fairly sloppy, and suspect there were many reasons for this, not the least of which was the very modest 45W output. It was worst with the JLTi Oppo, which probably had the most bass extension of any of the sources, and thus put most strain on the amp. We were probably hearing some near-clipping distortion. Even order distortion predominates in this amp - otherwise it might have sounded much worse again. We were also getting some sympathetic resonance of both the floor (definitely) and the rear wall (maybe) ! That was one thing Joe did not take into account with his speaker positioning. The Bryston CD player sounded better than the Oppo on the same material. Having heard both in very different environments, I found the Bryston sounded similar to how I remembered it, while the JLTi Oppo really did not sound anything like its best. To give an idea how substantial this was, we played Jupiter from the recent release Sydney Symphony SACD of Holst's the planets, and most listeners preferred the redbook track on the Bryston, to the SACD track on the Oppo. At home, on my JLTi Oppo 95, the same SACD track is absolutely riveting. With a retail price for the Bryston CD player significantly above the price of fully JLTi-enhanced Oppo, it would not be unreasonable to expect it to blow the JLTi Oppo away, but I know from experience that the JLTi Oppo has a very different but at least equally competent presentation on redbook CD (and has really outstanding SACD and 192K performance). Initially we had major problems with the turntable, with even light footfalls causing it to mistrack. I had provided magnetic levitation feet, specifically to decouple the turntable from this type of transferred vibration, but I had not taken the independent belt motor into account. It was resting up against the turntable plinth and acting as a perfect conduit for transmission of those huge footfall vibrations to the platter and stylus. A single 1.5mm thin x 1cm circular Herbie's Grunge Buster, sandwiched between plinth and motor, did an amazing job of removing any audible coupling of the two components ! Hats off to Steve Herbelin at herbiesaudiolab.net for his fantastic vibration damping products. Once this was ironed out, the turntable/phono combination was the undeniable star of the day. We played predominantly 45RPM pressings, starting with Take Five on the spectacularly wonderful Analogue Productions' 45RPM remaster of Dave Brubeck Quartet's Time Out LP. The modest Denon 103 sounded very good indeed on the VIP turntable/arm combo into the Bryston phono, and those who had never heard these records before were universally appreciative of the great sound they were hearing. To my ears, having heard all these records on my more expensive turntable system, there was a only a slight lack of finesse and emotion displayed by the combination - my guess is that a major upgrade to the cartridge would be needed in order to really extract substantially more using this lovely turntable and phono preamp. There is very good reason why this turntable received such accolades from the American press when it was released a few years ago. After the break, we were given a technical tour of David Moore's work-in-progress DC-coupled solid state power amp, followed by more music from each source, now with this much gutsier but more conventional (not completely conventional by any means) amplifier driving the speakers. I heard an immediate improvement in bass control, but many of us felt that there was a very likeable sweetness in the transconductance amp, which was missing here. Those of us who are addicted to valve amplification generally preferred the sound of the speakers with the transconductance amp, over the voltage-driven amp. This is not surprising as the THD profile of the transconductance amp is predominantly even order like in valve amps. On the other hand there was a certain ease which I sensed, in the way the speakers responded to David Moore's amp. It can only get better from this already impressive prototype. Very impressive! I have not spoken about the Dogé 8 preamp. There are two reasons. One is that it simply disappeared into the music. It was, for all intents and purposes, not there. Which is great! On the other hand, I didn't feel that it was really put to the test. I'd like a chance to compare it with a REALLY expensive preamp and state of the art ancillary equipment to see if my gut sense is right: that this sub-$2000 Chinese preamp is one of the best preamps you will ever hear at any price. Back to the Elsinores. I know these speakers well, having heard them several times (in vastly better, as well as similar, environments). They sounded pretty impressive, but they were nothing like their best. This was not, I believe, because of their position. The lousy carpeted wooden floor couples almost perfectly with speakers of this size, making a mockery of the effort that the designer has gone to, to tailor the characteristics of the speaker. To get the best of big speakers in this room, we need to effectively decouple the speakers from the floor. Normal coupling approaches simply don't work here. More active work on this in the next couple of meetings ! For all that, I think everyone had a great time, and were all blown away by the final musical item of the day: the last 10 minutes of Gustav Mahler's 2nd Symphony, in a phenomenal performance conducted by David Zinman, on a stupendous recording on RCA Hybrid SACD. Breathtaking is an understatement. The system, from the JLTi Oppo 105, through the Dogé 8 preamp, David Moore's power amp and the Elsinore Mk 6 speakers, seemed to combine beautifully to thrill everyone with this stunning work. Cheers Warren M. Edited July 16, 2015 by Warren M. 1
Steever Posted July 17, 2015 Posted July 17, 2015 Great write up. Certainly keen to hear more about your experience with the Doge pre. I've emailed Marc @ Doge and he's replied with a $ figure that seems quite good especially considering it will have the better caps on board.
WhoRu? Posted July 17, 2015 Posted July 17, 2015 Looks like you used half a VPI Super Scoutmaster from the photos
Warren M. Posted July 18, 2015 Author Posted July 18, 2015 (edited) Looks like you used half a VPI Super Scoutmaster from the photos You can see what was set up. Next stage apparently is a 2nd motor/belt Edited July 18, 2015 by Warren M.
MVPjack Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 (edited) Is there an event scheduled for August? Edited July 23, 2015 by MVPjack
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