desray Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 On 17/08/2015 at 3:34 AM, CASH said: Now i wonder.... So in a way, Onkyo's AccuEQ would hold some candles against Audessy.. Since AccuEQ does not touch the sub at all.. Hmmmm... Maybe Onkyo's R n D was spot on, on that fact.. N ditched Audessy.. Maybe?? I dont know.. But it is a interesting developement for me. Because i will still stick to buying another top range onkyo.(With AccuEQ, of course!!) I m sure the AccuEQ would have its merits. Sent from my Galaxy Note 5
desray Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 On 17/08/2015 at 5:37 AM, etnt said: U buy a license per AVR. So next AVR, just purchase the license again lor. How much is the license fee per device? Any idea? Quote At least we know there is a solution to it albeit not the best interest from a consumer perspective. The worse thing that could happen is no ready solution. Sent from my Galaxy Note 5 Sent from my Galaxy Note 5
etnt Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 On 17/08/2015 at 5:42 AM, desray said: How much is the license fee per device? Any idea? USD150
synthesis1624705793 Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 Maybe just do audyssey calibration and turn up the subwoofer gain couple of notches to your liking. That doesn't cost anything.
desray Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 On 17/08/2015 at 5:48 AM, etnt said: USD150 Thanks...how much the Audyssey Pro kit or does it bundled with the license?
Jag Posted August 17, 2015 Author Posted August 17, 2015 Bumping the LFE up several dB is what many are doing after running Audyssey. That underlines the fact that audyssey results in too flat LFE that folks are abandoning the configured that Audyssey computes. IMO, I would still prefer Audyssey in that it really is doing a good job to produce a nice flat curve. After which, I would add on a house curve on top of that and smile everytime I watch a movie.
Jag Posted August 17, 2015 Author Posted August 17, 2015 Quoted from AVS: Quoting from Sean Olive's article, linked below: "A flat in-room target response is clearly not the optimal target curve for room equalization. The preferred room corrections have a target response that has a smooth downward slope with increasing frequency. This tells us that listeners prefer a certain amount of natural room gain. Removing the rom (sic) gain, makes the reproduced music sound unnatural, and too thin, according to these listeners. " For info, this article by Sean Olive gives very useful background info. Quoting from Audioholics: Many people do not enjoy a perfectly flat bass response because as you said our thresholds for differing frequencies taper with lower the frequency. On the lower frequencies, below audible frequencies, house curves can be used to increase the chest pounding feeling. A useful link to read: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1346723-audyssey-pro-installer-kit-thread-faq-post-1-a-202.html
Jag Posted August 17, 2015 Author Posted August 17, 2015 Audyssey Pro kit seems to be selling for US$550. Add in another US$150 for the AVR license, brings the total to US$700. After reading some users review on this, it sounds that the Pro kit target curve editor is just not powerful enough to handle much customization.
tiktokape Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 My concern is whether the pro kit's mic is sufficient for Atmos and Auro 3D? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Jag Posted August 17, 2015 Author Posted August 17, 2015 I wonder how MCACC, YPAO and AccuEQ stacks up to Audyssey. It would be an interesting comparison since not many folks have the luxury of comparing such implementations side by side. If Audyssey allows for customization of house curve, I would dare say that would be ideal.
Jag Posted August 17, 2015 Author Posted August 17, 2015 Oh uh...... I spoke too soon. http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1580129-accueq-vs-audyssey.html
Guest CASH Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 Yup.. if it does house curve, it would be the best. Hehehehe!!!! Sorry i havent had the chance to go yuor place to listen to your superb setup bro.. Been busy buying n selling stuff plus work.. Will take up your offer for demo soon enough.. Ur the bass guru!! Respect Man!! ;D
desray Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 On 17/08/2015 at 1:09 PM, Jag said: Audyssey Pro kit seems to be selling for US$550. Add in another US$150 for the AVR license, brings the total to US$700. After reading some users review on this, it sounds that the Pro kit target curve editor is just not powerful enough to handle much customization. That's expensive man... Sent from my Galaxy Note 5
desray Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 On 17/08/2015 at 1:47 PM, Jag said: I wonder how MCACC, YPAO and AccuEQ stacks up to Audyssey. It would be an interesting comparison since not many folks have the luxury of comparing such implementations side by side. If Audyssey allows for customization of house curve, I would dare say that would be ideal. You can go to some member's place with pioneer, Yamaha and onkyo AVR and test on the spot? It would be great if we have a definitive answer to all. Sent from my Galaxy Note 5
Guest CASH Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 Sounds great.. me selling my onkyo 3030... So i can bring it over your place for the test man!! Hope AccuEq can make Onkyo users proud! Hehehehe!! If it doesnt... then at least i know it kicks the ass out of any avr out there in terms of raw power output in ht terms!! Not stereo side!! No D n M can touch it. ;)
synthesis1624705793 Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 Side track a bit..... So, Audiophile would forbid any EQ in the system but HT guys can't live without EQ. Then who is right? ;D ;D
Guest CASH Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 Valid point made bro.. Stereo side, i wouldnt alter with any processing.. But in ht.. with so many speakers.. must have the "Some sort of eq" Hehehehe!! ;)
desray Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 On 17/08/2015 at 2:54 PM, synthesis said: Side track a bit..... So, Audiophile would forbid any EQ in the system but HT guys can't live without EQ. Then who is right? ;D ;D For home theatre...its a tad different in the sense that EQ helps to keep all speakers working in tandem to deliver the best possible movie listening experience and not forgetting that it probably has multiple seating arrangement and that's where EQ can help to get "better" sound across the seats. When there is an array of speakers involved in a room - especially a cubicle or small room, EQ is a must-have. Of course, if your room mode is so good...then you probably won't need EQ at all. ;D
synthesis1624705793 Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 Ok, another thought..... There's not much point in stacking so many subwoofers if end up calibrating using Audyssey because the end result is flat anyway and you don't feel more power from additional subwoofer. Sure each subwoofer would work less hard but in typical local housing the expected SPL is within normal operation of a good subwoofer anyway. :D Thought?
etnt Posted August 17, 2015 Posted August 17, 2015 The pro kit is $820 from Sound Decisions when I got it from them 4yrs ago. Not sure of the price now. Per device license is still USD150 from Audyssey's website. You can refer to the user guide here https://installer.audyssey.com/files/Audyssey%20MultEQ%20Pro%20User%20Guide%204.0.pdf It allows some adjustments to the target curve (limited to 3db) to bump up the lower freq if desired. Atmos is supported, Auro3D no idea.
ralfale Posted August 18, 2015 Posted August 18, 2015 Can the pro kit be shared across multiple devices? Or it needs to be plugged in all the time when used ?
etnt Posted August 18, 2015 Posted August 18, 2015 only plug in during calibration. can be shared across multiple devices, just buy license for each device. 1 of the reasons used to justify the purchase (for FC's approval) was that this can be used on future devices (D&M and Onkyo back then). With Onkyo leaving the audyssey bandwagon, choices are limited to the D&M family now.
Jag Posted August 18, 2015 Author Posted August 18, 2015 If Audyssey has a target curve that it tries to obtain, then the end result is all HTs will have approximately the same bass qty; regardless of subwoofer capability. The only difference between HTs after Audyssey : 1) severe room mode suckouts that Audyssey stops corrrecting if the suckout is too deep 2) infrasonic bass since that depends if the subs can inherently extend that low or not. Case Study A fellow XP forumer emailed me his measurements of his audyssey system. (I will allow him to identify himself if he wishes so) His subs are indicated in the diagram. I compared his freq curve to mine. Overlaying the 2 measurements, the flatness of the 2 different HT's were very close. Except for 20Hz and 30Hz room modes that resulted in suckouts (and the deeper bass extension of my ported subs), LFE flatness on both HT's very well matched. That shows Audyssey will try to flatten out LFE; thus making bass sound the same regardless of subwoofers. This is because the built in target curve in audyssey (or in AccuEQ or YPAO or MCACC) is pre-programmed to whatever some engineer in the AVR company liked his bass to be. That may not be what I like.... and based on past experience, I prefer my infrasonic bass to be felt... Thus, my conclusion (mirror by many others too) is that Audyssey will get you started on the right path. However, LFE experience is highly personal; and the audyssey or any other autoEQ result can be further spiced up with an user adjustable EQ to achieve a better sounding (bass with authority) house curve.
ronildoq Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 Oh, its always nice to refer to old post, to learn as well. Now then i know, something....hehe
ronildoq Posted November 24, 2016 Posted November 24, 2016 On 16/08/2015 at 10:25 AM, Jag said: So how? Audyssey or not? In my opinion, Audyssey is instrumental in getting the speakers to match in SPL and in timbre. It is somewhat limited for LFE because there is no way to program a house curve into Audyssey. This is perhaps the single most detracting point about Audyssey. It is well known in HT circles that "Flat frequency response" really does not impress.Its human nature to have preference to hotter LFE channel. Heck, Dolby & DTS knew that; and thats why LFE channels max signal level is 10dB higher than the other mains channels. Since Audyssey in the D&M models do not allow for custom house curve, a way to introduce a house curve is needed. A simple "up the bass bby 6dB" is not ideal, but better than nothing. Therefore, my recommendation is to incorporate an outboard PEQ to introduce a house curve to regain that bass oomph Audyssey sliced away. I used the Antimode Dual Core 2.0 in my case. The bass correction feature in Antimode is not the best; but the PEQs it offers is purely to insert the house curve. It's nice to re-read again as it all makes sense when u actually sit down and do the measurement. But one part about the mixing of lfe to be 10db higher, wasn't it done that way by audyssey because we have the mains and the rest of the speakers Low freq crossover signal Sent to the subs? What I understand is that the lfe content is mixed 10db lower because the rest of the speakers will be sending bass to the sub below the crossover point and the more speakers u have , 11 channels etc, the higher the levels of the subs, since all speakers are now sending bass info to the sub plus the subs have a seperate lfe channel, isn't that the case ? Also audyssey is not as efficient when it comes to getting the combined subwoofer and main speaker response together, I believe it measures it individually. That doesn't give us the optimal result, which is why I see some resorting to distance tweak.we have to manually tweak for the best bass response with the mains, perfectly spot on! But I still like the dialog enhancer on with the Denon, so much clearer somehow with that turned on. U could hear music at the background with clear vocals when the actors speak, this is highly audible especially with drama series. Do u guys have the dialog enhancer on?
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