C130 Posted March 9, 2010 Posted March 9, 2010 Hi all, I would greatly appreciate if you could help in sharing your opinion on both Plinius 9200 and Krell 400xi integrated amplifiers in terms eg. overall sound, value for money, heat generation, ease of use (cannot turn-off power supply, need to warm up 'hours' before play?) etc.... look forward to your generous views..... many thanks in advance.... :) :) :)
Quest88 Posted March 9, 2010 Posted March 9, 2010 Never did a head-to-head comparison but my impression is that the Krell 400xi is more raw and dry sounding than Plinius, and supposedly better bass handling with the Krell badge (though I am not sure). This is the previous model and I believe is supposed to be more warm than the existing 300i. Believe it should run cooler than the Plinius (temperature-wise). Value-for-money is tough to dictate as both amps have comparable sound (albeit different character) and value.. the new 300i has other stuff like ipod connectivity and a nicer display but I don't think very much different in features. The Plinius 9200 however, is the current model and its best if you just head down to the showroom for a listen yourself. IMO more refined and warmer than Krell though it retains the dynamics. It sounds fine to me on cold-start, but I know many reviews say it sounds better after letting it run for 24hrs. I guess only owners can say if there is a big difference on that. Maybe it will help if you mention your equipment so others can tell you input if they feel it's a match.
RabPaul Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Maybe it will help if you mention your equipment so others can tell you input if they feel it's a match. You can never compare amplifiers without knowing the speaker they will drive.
vinilink Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 I can't say much about Plinius amps as I haven't audition them, but did hear good comments on them. But for Krell, it is not my cup of tea. I have auditioned from integrated to top of the line monoblock, their sounds just didn't move me. This is just my opinion as some may disagree. If you have a bright sounding speakers, it is not a good idea to use Krell.
C130 Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 many thanks to the views given so far.... :D currently i'm using a pair of ProAc Studio 100 speakers and seriously thinking of getting a new integrated amplifier which i hope can last me a 'long' time; considerations taken into account are the possibility of future upgrading of speakers to floorstanders, hooking on a power amplifier, bypass for HT usage etc.... Is Plinius or Krell good with ProAc speakers? should i purchase any of them, i would be using it to drive the ProAc studio speakers for now till i save enough $$$ for the upgrade to floorstanders... probably sticking to ProAc or Dynaudio. I was told that Plinius and Krell work very well with Dynaudio... not sure it's true though. greatly appreciate your views.....
vinilink Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 many thanks to the views given so far.... :D currently i'm using a pair of ProAc Studio 100 speakers and seriously thinking of getting a new integrated amplifier which i hope can last me a 'long' time; considerations taken into account are the possibility of future upgrading of speakers to floorstanders, hooking on a power amplifier, bypass for HT usage etc.... Is Plinius or Krell good with ProAc speakers? should i purchase any of them, i would be using it to drive the ProAc studio speakers for now till i save enough $$$ for the upgrade to floorstanders... probably sticking to ProAc or Dynaudio. I was told that Plinius and Krell work very well with Dynaudio... not sure it's true though. greatly appreciate your views..... ProAc makes wonderful speakers. From my memory, small bookshelf ones tends to be on a brighter side (eg. older Tablette series) and don't know much about your speaker. Whatever others tell you just take as a guide. Take your time and ultimately trust your ears. :D Good luck with your hunting. 8)
HardGainer Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 many thanks to the views given so far.... :D currently i'm using a pair of ProAc Studio 100 speakers and seriously thinking of getting a new integrated amplifier which i hope can last me a 'long' time; considerations taken into account are the possibility of future upgrading of speakers to floorstanders, hooking on a power amplifier, bypass for HT usage etc.... Is Plinius or Krell good with ProAc speakers? should i purchase any of them, i would be using it to drive the ProAc studio speakers for now till i save enough $$$ for the upgrade to floorstanders... probably sticking to ProAc or Dynaudio. I was told that Plinius and Krell work very well with Dynaudio... not sure it's true though. greatly appreciate your views..... Would a Ayre AX-7e be a candidate?
RabPaul Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Given your ProAc and that you are also considering Dynaudio, Plinius would be IMO a better choice. Listen to the Plinius with a Dynaudio of your choice. I always tell people to buy amps and speakers together because its an important match. If you buy the amp first then you can at least take it with you to audition speakers.
C130 Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 Would a Ayre AX-7e be a candidate? hi shsoh.... pardon me for i do not know their sound/performance. Did a quick check on the net and discovered little literature on them. What can or should i expect? appreciate your reply.... :)
HardGainer Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 hi shsoh.... pardon me for i do not know their sound/performance. Did a quick check on the net and discovered little literature on them. What can or should i expect? appreciate your reply.... :) I'm quite a fan of Ayre. Very musical and IMO Ayre products are excellent soundstage constructors. You can hardly make Ayre sound bad. One thing to note that Ayre benefits the most using balanced connections. If RCA, look elsewhere. Btw I'm not impressed by their cdp, so far only their amps and qb9. I should think the ax-7e will sound nice. Why not have a home trial with Norman?
Quest88 Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Best thing is to borrow an Ayre from Norman Audio since they allow home trials. I personally did not like their house sound, though in terms of 'hifi characteristics' like soundstage and detail i did find them to be quite decent.
Luv4nature Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Among Krell range of amplifiers, the previous KAV and FPB range tend to sound too forward, lean and "forcefully" fast. They emphasize more on dynamics and slam at the expense of musicality. KAV400xi included. Now the newer Krell Evolution range is quite a twist from their previous sonic signature. Musicality, refinement, richness are now in the equation in place of previous raw and untammed power. The current S300i integrated amp takes this sonic platform too. The S300i also has good feature of ipod connectivity, and good provision for set up customization (such as theatre bypass on any inputs, remote DC trigger, etc). You may want to give it a try. Bear in mind the S300i in particular is made in China, however it is engineered by Krell and also supposed to conform to Krell's spec and QC. It is also backed by the same 5 year warranty policy by Krell. As for Plinius 9200, heard it a few times at the show room driving Dynaudio speakers. It is a fine sounding amp with polished and smooth presentation, but somehow it is lacking in the pace and dynamics department. Have heard Dynaudio spks with much more liveliness driven by other amps. Note that 9200 has good built in phono input feature with selection of high and low gain can be a plus if you're looking for all-in-one box amplifier solution. So Krell or Plinius integrated amp? It really comes down to your preference and the speakers you plan to listen with. If Krell, suggest to exclude previous ranges and go with just the current models.
vinilink Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 C130, Maybe you should check out Jeff Rowland Continum integrated amps. http://www.jeffrowland.com/Continuum.htm
Guest OmegaRed Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 None of the above. ;D Proac goes well with tubes. Look at EL34 int tube amps.
jimi1624705950 Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 None of the above. ;D Proac goes well with tubes. Look at EL34 int tube amps. Agree. Go to Aural Designs in Adelphi. They love pairing proac with tubes- prepare to be poisoned though! http://aural-designs.com/ I think Adrian is your guy there, although I might be wrong as I'm bad at names.. EDIT: Look for Victor, he's a helpful guy and i got my proac response d1 from him. Yes proac sounds beautiful with tube amps. Ah yes, Victor is the name.
Horchai Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Look for Victor, he's a helpful guy and i got my proac response d1 from him. Yes proac sounds beautiful with tube amps. Some say even better with audio research amps. http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1264575099&read&keyw&zzproac
vinilink Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 Look for Victor, he's a helpful guy and i got my proac response d1 from him. Yes proac sounds beautiful with tube amps. Some say even better with audio research amps. http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1264575099&read&keyw&zzproac AR is a great sounding amps but has bit of reliability issues though.
aquarius Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 Hi C130 For the past 8 years, I have using the Ayre AX7 with a Dynaudio Audience 50, then the upgraded to the AX7e and a ProAc Studio 110, and for the past 2 years, a ProAc Studio 140, all using its balanced mode. As I listen to pretty loud music like rock and large orchestral pieces, and even though the 140 has a sensitivity of 90dB, the Ayre seems to struggle at times. I have been looking at other amps including the 9200 and s300i but have only listened to them briefly in the showrooms. I am very, very hesitant to replace the Ayre because it is really a very good amp. My ideal will be the same amp with more power. With the Studio 110 (quite similar to your Studio 100), sound can be a little bright if toed in. Fire them straight solves the problem. Overall sound is neutral, revealing, decent soundstage (room too small to get great soundstage), dynamic, fast with good timing. The ProAc is just slightly warm while the Ayre is neutral, so overall not too warm. I don't think you can go wrong with the Ayre based on my experience especially if it is for vocals, jazz and pop. You should add this to your shortlist.
vinilink Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 Hi C130 "As I listen to pretty loud music like rock and large orchestral pieces, and even though the 140 has a sensitivity of 90dB, the Ayre seems to struggle at times. I have been looking at other amps including the 9200 and s300i but have only listened to them briefly in the showrooms." You need an amp with high current (at least 40amps) output amp to drive difficult load speakers with ease. ;D
C130 Posted March 11, 2010 Author Posted March 11, 2010 I'm quite a fan of Ayre. Very musical and IMO Ayre products are excellent soundstage constructors. You can hardly make Ayre sound bad. One thing to note that Ayre benefits the most using balanced connections. If RCA, look elsewhere. Btw I'm not impressed by their cdp, so far only their amps and qb9. I should think the ax-7e will sound nice. Why not have a home trial with Norman? hi shsoh, wow... they allow home trial?!? that would be nice.... would you happen to know whether they require a deposit? ???
C130 Posted March 11, 2010 Author Posted March 11, 2010 C130, Maybe you should check out Jeff Rowland Continum integrated amps. http://www.jeffrowland.com/Continuum.htm hi nbs, it's quite an impressive integrated amp after reading their specification in the net. do you know the price and where can i go for an audition?
C130 Posted March 11, 2010 Author Posted March 11, 2010 Agree. Go to Aural Designs in Adelphi. They love pairing proac with tubes- prepare to be poisoned though! http://aural-designs.com/ I think Adrian is your guy there, although I might be wrong as I'm bad at names.. EDIT: Ah yes, Victor is the name. hi jimi, i was told that tubes amp couldn't fit in the role of HT thus made me look for a solid state integrated amp with a 'bypass' feature for HT purpose. is my understanding correct, i.e. tubes amp cannot be used for HT, or i was told the wrong thing?
Quest88 Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 wow... they allow home trial?!? that would be nice.... would you happen to know whether they require a deposit? ??? no deposit required. they just need to take down ur details and copy of IC may be required.
C130 Posted March 11, 2010 Author Posted March 11, 2010 Hi C130 For the past 8 years, I have using the Ayre AX7 with a Dynaudio Audience 50, then the upgraded to the AX7e and a ProAc Studio 110, and for the past 2 years, a ProAc Studio 140, all using its balanced mode. As I listen to pretty loud music like rock and large orchestral pieces, and even though the 140 has a sensitivity of 90dB, the Ayre seems to struggle at times. I have been looking at other amps including the 9200 and s300i but have only listened to them briefly in the showrooms. I am very, very hesitant to replace the Ayre because it is really a very good amp. My ideal will be the same amp with more power. With the Studio 110 (quite similar to your Studio 100), sound can be a little bright if toed in. Fire them straight solves the problem. Overall sound is neutral, revealing, decent soundstage (room too small to get great soundstage), dynamic, fast with good timing. The ProAc is just slightly warm while the Ayre is neutral, so overall not too warm. I don't think you can go wrong with the Ayre based on my experience especially if it is for vocals, jazz and pop. You should add this to your shortlist. hi aquarius, thank you for the advice.... seems like ProAc works well with Ayre. would Ayre suitable/has a 'bypass' feature for HT purpose?
RabPaul Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 You need an amp with high current (at least 40amps) output amp to drive difficult load speakers with ease. ;D Unless I have my maths wrong, it would take a 6500W amplifier to produce 40 amps @ 4 Ohms or a 1600W amplifier to produce 40 amps @ 1 Ohm. Such an amp exists?
Recommended Posts