pools

[Guest JohnA]

Anyone have any contacts in the pool industry

 

I will be looking at putting a pool into the new house it will be either 8mtr x 2.5mtr or 11mtr x 2.5mtr in ground, from around 1.1 to 1.8mtrs deep

prefer salt pool over chlorine

[Sir Triode]

I wouldn't recommended it esp for the sizes you are looking at (you can't do laps in those sizes). They cost a lot to maintain in the long run and don't really add anything to the value of the home. You have to keep the pump running 24/7 and the way electricity prices are heading, it is only going to get more expensive over time.

Better to get a small inflatable above ground pool or get a hot tub or better yet just head to your local public one. 

[ArthurDent]

 or better yet just head to your local public one. 

 

An easy walk to ours, salt water though with waves and sand of course.

[Luc]

I do, I regularly work for the number 1 builder on the Far North Coast but that's not going to help you much down there in Vic is it.

Those measurements mean your doing a lap pool, if everyone in your family is over 1.8m tall then the deep pool wont be a problem but if you have kids, if your missus isn't an amazon then you will find that the shallower option is the wiser one.

 

People make the mistake all the time of thinking 'deep is good, deep is cool'...it's not because most people can't stand up with their heads above water if the pool is deep and they just congregate down in the shallow end. You can't sling a volleyball net over a pool that grades from shallow to deep, same with other net games.

 

Experience says to run the lap pool at one constant depth(1.5m is a very good mean average) or if you must have a deep bit then you grade to the middle(shallow both ends, grading to deep in the middle. One depth makes the pool endlessly usable by kids and mothers, older people, blokes holding beers ect but a deep pool buggers all that up and is good for diving and swimming but not socialising.

 

Just recently worked on two lap pools and one was built on a sloping block with a two story house attached to it, as in the pool was built into and incorporated along the back of the house and when you were inside the house on the lower level, you could look straight into the pool as there was a 5 metre clear section that made up part of the back wall and was a wall of the pool. No real special engineering required as the bulk of the concrete pool was an integral part of the footing construction of the house...quite clever use of money and materials.

 

Plenty of options out there, I'm sure you've looked at them already.

 

Finish is another thing to do some study on, the new fibreglass finish over rendered pool is super schmik  and gives you myriad options for colour and internal lighting. Fully tiled is brilliant but uber expensive and the newer ranges of cut and polished stone like finishes are good as is the ever dependable pebblecrete, with the newer pepples being very tiny now and you don't cut yourselves on it kicking off ect.

 

In floor cleaning systems are the best but again they are also more expensive but prove their worth over the life of the pool. Being a lap pool it is relatively easy to incorporate a built in thermal pool cover that you can automatically wind up as there are quite a few systems to do just that with a WA manufacturer being one of the leaders. You'll also probably make allowance for heating, at the very least remember to include the piping in the construction for eith a future solar or future gas/electrical heat pump. The pvc piping is insignificant in the overall price of a pool. Heat pumps are the best and they are becoming more and more friendly as far as power costs go.

 

Nearly all pumps/controllers these days come in a two cycle config' so again you have the option of making either a spot in the side walls or at one end of the lap pool a spa. Again it's just a bunch of pvc piping to do this, it's very cheap. You will probably have looked into a jet pump system for swimming in one spot and fully adjustable. whether you actually need one in a 11m lap pool is another question.

 

The pool industry is notorious for being shonky and being a self regulated one you can take most advertising blurbs at face value. A recommendation from the pool manufacturer's association is meaningless in most cases. You need to do your homework and get references, get word of mouth references and then do your research.

 

If you see a pool under construction for instance that has it's shell poured, go and see if it has surfaces cracks anywhere in it, this is a sign of a pool being finished in a hot environment and also finished too quickly. If you look along the walls of the pool and see orange electrical conduit sticking out from the walls then you don't want that pool builder as that is a cheap and nasty way to have your pool lights done, it means that they will be afixed after the finish is applied.

You actually want to see round/square plastic enclosures fitted into the walls with concreted sprayed around them, not the other way around. This means that your light enclosures were fixed in amongst the reo shell of the pool and flexi conduit will be egressing out the back of the pool wall and you should see that grey flexi either outside the coping or plugged into orange conduit in the steel frame and exiting through the coping. Little things like this separate the average builder from the best ones.

 

These lights here>>>Click<<< are amongst the best and they are fairly universally used by quality pool builders, I have the them in mine and they are surprisingly easy to change globes(which are not cheap).

 

Just saw Shannon's post and he's wrong about running them 24/7, once you get your head around your own pool and it's requirements as far as filtration goes, then you'll work out what is the optimum time to run your pump to keep the thing clean.

 

Salt pool is actually salt chlorinated but you can also go the other way and have fresh, but this is a bit more expensive, it's called an ozone system.

 

You effectively half your resale market, not your value when you put a pool in as there is a fairly even split in the demographics for buyers; half love a pool and half wont even look at a house with a pool. If you have small children then it's an absolute god send and one of the best investments you'll make in their happiness. If the pool is done with a fair amount of design thinking then you can make it an asset to your house. I know our pool is a lovely, lovely thing to look at all year and it's tied directly to our house and not situated in it's own enclosure away from the house, you get a view of it from all rooms and all windows in our place and we love it: Bottom line is. it's expensive to build and it can be expensive to maintain and the work involved in keeping it clean and looking brilliant is a chore if you make it so. I actually enjoy the whole process of keeping my pool looking as good as it does so that people go Wow! when they see it and my pool is surrounded by f/ing koala highrise apartments so it's no easy thing to keep clean.

 

Comes down to what you want in the end.

 

Cheers Lee.

[Sir Triode]

Lee,

 

My family home has a kidney shaped pool built in the mid 80s. The thing was only used in the Summer and hardly ever because it was so small  - about the same dimensions John is thinking of. Couldn't do laps in it.

 

The cost of running the pump and pool maintenance eventually got to my dad and now the pool is pond. 

 

We would have been better off with a hot tub  or membership to a local public pool.

 

Once the kids grow out of the pool, it will become a white elephant. The on going costs are just not worth it. Esp after you become a pensioner.

Edited March 22, 2014 by Sir Triode

[Guest JohnA]

Lee cheers for all the advice there mate..much appreciated.

 

We have been talking with a few friends who have done it, and talked to some pool companies also.

 

At the moment, just getting ideas. We could go the full side of the house 20mtrs+ but i think 11- 13mtrs will be plenty big enough for a family of 3 to have some fun in and for when the daughter has her friends over during the summer months.

 

I dont care about running costs, nor am i looking at it to add value to my home.

I dont go to local pools as cant stand most of the idiots there, and nothing better then doing a workout in my home gym then taking a quick dip in the pool

[Luc]

Lee,

 

My family home has a kidney shaped pool built in the mid 80s. The thing was only used in the Summer and hardly ever because it was so small  - about the same dimensions John is thinking of. Couldn't do laps in it.

 

The cost of running the pump and pool maintenance eventually got to my dad and now the pool is pond. 

 

We would have been better off with a hot tub  or membership to a local public pool.

 

Once the kids grow out of the pool, it will become a white elephant. The on going costs are just not worth it. 

 

 

Gotta disagree Shannon, my kids are gone from home and there are just the Handbrake and me firing salvos around here now but we love our pool.

 

Having said that though, I can empathise with your Dad and of course a kidney shaped pool . Unless you give careful thought to your pool design(a bit like most things really when you think about it) your going to end up with a dated bit of infrastructure that no one in their right mind would want.

 

If your going to put a pool in, then think really really hard about it's design and it's function, not function as in it's water usage but function as in form, how does it blend/meld into your landscape, your house, how does it look as a mere object? Does it reflect the moonlight on a clear night into your room's walls and ceilings, same with sunlight? does it compliment your landscaping, both soft and hard. Do you get a buzz from just looking at it?

 

All these slightly esoteric reasonings come into play when you really think about your home environment.

 

I have what's called a sheer decent(a slash in a rendered wall) and it's a great thing when it's turned on as kids just love sitting under it and poking their heads through it and now that we don't have kids here it doubles up as a mood soother and a conversation piece when we have party's or a few couples around; the sound of the water falling, the waterfall if you will both masks our conversation from the neighbours and makes conversation amongst the guests.

 

 

Your 80's inspired kidney shaped pool is a classic case of what I'm talking about when I mention the need to think about what your trying to achieve and to think long term. Classic styling of a pool is essential to my mind and it makes a much safer option than a contemporary design which most likely will end up dating the pool and the house when it comes time to sell.

 

Straight lines and angles have been used ever since the inground pool was thought of and used. A classic style like a 30's deep/shallow with diving board design does not date especially if you incorporate all the modern touches.

 

Putting a Bali hut at the end of your pool is something that will ultimately date and look increasingly ugly as tastes change over time, just like a concrete/fibreglass kidney shaped pool will, just like a succulent(plants) based landscape around your pool will date it to the era of the makeover shows and people with perfect smiles and jaunty personalities...

 

During the 80's+90's big bush rocks set into the pool waterline and recycled railway sleepers as decks and swimouts, pepplecrete beach swimouts with curvilinear walls were all the rage and they now firmly date a house and are an item that is out of fashion. That means a makeover which means serious money...goodbye to half your potential buyers in this case...not so with a classically designed pool.

 

A 'Resort' style look can be achieved through the use of some design principles and the right materials. A look that can be either tropical or perhaps Mediterranean or that heated pool look you can see in England and France. All reasonably classic styles and all neutral in dating your  construction and concept.

 

It is an individual decision for (in this case) JohnA and his family .

 

 

* Just saw your post John, and what you say is as good a reason for doing anything in life isn't it. Just get good advice and look at as many places as you can. You might not care about running costs and contemporary looks but down the track when it comes time to sell you will make or break your sale by the decisions you make right now.

 

Cheers mate

[kdoot]

We bought an established house with an ageing pool at the beginning of last year. It's about 10 x 5 x 1.4 with a 1.8 depression in the centre of one end. Really simple sand filter and manual chemical treatment. And we (family with three young kids) absolutely love it.

The best thing I did was buy a Floatron. It puts copper ions (and possibly a bit of silver) into the water which stops algae from growing and inhibits bacteria also. With less crap in the water you don't need as much oxidiser like chlorine and you don't need to run the filter as much. I've only had to use a small amount of cheap granulated chlorine, a couple of litres of acid for pH, and twice a "clarifier" to catch the ultra-fine stuff which can cloud up the water. The filter is on a timer between 10AM and 4PM daily which is more than it actually needs but I'm a bit lazy about finessing it. Daylight hours chosen because it works well with the solar-activated Floatron and my 5kW solar PV system.

The downside of copper is that it can make blond hair take on that green tint. It's avoidable/manageable but not something you want to discover by surprise.

Tip #2 is to get a good pool blanket. We've been maintaining water temps between 30 and 32° all summer this year compared to about 24-26 last year. It actually got to 36° during one really hot week. Even if you don't get a huge amount of sun on the pool, they prevent overnight heat loss.

Whatever you end up doing, I hope you get a lot of enjoyment from it.

[Gee Emm]

I loved our pool we built at our previous house.

No dramas at all to maintain.

10m x 4.5m with a deep end.

I don't get it when people say pools are hard work.

It cost us $1 a day on average to run the 2 pumps.

[Guest JohnA]

Thanks again for the tips guys, and Lee, yes also thought about a flat bottom pool all at 1.5mtr

My daughter is 13 now and as tall enough to stand with head above water at 1.5

 

I also think it will look beautiful weather sitting in the lounge or dining and looking through the big windows out the side of the house viewing the pool, or sitting in the alfresco with the pool coming along the side of it

[Peter_F]

I wish you could take my pool, I hate it!  Not worth the expense or hassles IMO.  

[ThirdDrawerDown]

Ive come across this thread while sitting in our spa pool and reading the interweb on the mobile phone. We have a mere 1000 litre spa pool. Its bromine based and so runs at 39 degrees and has an excellent cover on it. We cant swim in it but i use it daily, with maintenance once a week ( bromine allows a bit more flexibility in maintenance)

Edited March 22, 2014 by ThirdDrawerDown

[Luc]

Here's some late afternoon early evening shots I just took of the pool and while they don't do justice to the pool and it's surrounds it does give you a bit of an idea of how it's set up.

 

A shot looking out from upstairs dining breakfast table

Looking out from my daughter's room

Looking out from downstairs rumpus/lounge/Handbrake's cave

At the laundry door

Looking back from pool deck at the deep end

 

 

Up on the deck looking down with a Dundee IPA on hand.

 

 

@@JohnA. The only thing I'd say John about your pool depth is that you fall(bad pun)into the trap when you say your daughter's tall enough for the 1.5m depth...when you go to sell your place in the future(if you do), then the next potential buyers might have kids and if mum can't sit at one end of the pool and play with the little ones then they wont buy your house. That's the only thing I'd suggest you consider. We build a 500 x 500 seat underneath the sheer descent for that exact reason and mums who still come here with littlies go straight there

Edited March 22, 2014 by Luc

[Guest JohnA]

looks good lee and i hear what you are saying regarding the depth

 

this is the sort of thing i will be looking at

 

 

so picture where the stairs are, thats coming from the alfresco area, and the pool following around the side of the house

 

the house is just about at lock up stage and the block beside us and behind us is currently vacant, so would like to get it all done before they start building on those blocks, for easy access

[Luc]

Looks fantastic, very similar to the pool I worked on at Wategoes Beach, which is currently up for sale for 7.5 mill and comes with a house attached to it...lol.

 

With a pool situated like yours is/will be John, it shouldn't be too hard to work in a shallow area to cover the concerns I mentioned above.

 

 

Yeah hook into the excavation/construction of it John whilst you have the access. The pool I mentioned above had the added cost of crane hire in it.....all 20k's worth of it because of limited access.

[mondie]

Dont do it. Got one in our Adelaide hills property and its nothing but a big fat pain in the arse. More wasteful on the hip pocket than hifi

[progladyte]

Wow Lee! Some fantastic contributions and advice there man! 

 

I personally found owning a pool with 3 kids to be more trouble for me than it was worth. Mind you, I'm probably being selfish here as our kids absolutely loved it and you could never put a price on their happiness plus the fact they were playing outside together and not stuck indoors all the time. I found that the ONLY time I had to spend  in the pool was the incessant amount of hours needed to try and remove all the algae off the sides of the walls and flooring, despite owning a Creepie Crawley and spending loads of cash on chemicals / filters and the like. This was over 25 years ago mind however, all bad things became good again when we agreed to spending an extra $100 over the price of new pebble crete by opting for a $2,400.00 fibre-glass finish to the sides and flooring. It made a huge difference and meant I could FINALLY use the pool for its intended purposes.

 

As luck would have it, we moved to Queensland about 3 months after resurfacing the pool so never really gained the benefit of the expense.

 

John, as Lee has so eloquently stated his case for a pool, I have to nevertheless agree with him about his suggestions and advice. My own experience with a pool, while only brief should not cloud your own wishes nor those of your family. As far as a pool being a deterrent when we sold our house, we actually kept increasing the price of our house each week by $5-10K during a boom period until it sold about 3 weeks later. I think we only had to drop $5K off our price to lock in a sale. (It was a fantastic house mind you with a really good extension done only 12 months earlier so the buyers were blown away by everything they saw).

 

As with any major purchase;

 

Use the internet to aid with your research

Listen to some experts

Ask to see previous customers work and canvas them for their true opinion out of earshot of the pool seller

Look at as many other projects as you can

Use a quality pool builder who can talk to you on your level

Stick to your budget

Look at lots of options

 

Good luck with the project.

 

Prog.