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Posted
1 hour ago, Ian McP said:

New thinking on cartridge compliance/effective tone arm mass matching

http://www.korfaudio.com

 

 

Interesting, Ian ... but no better than the Vinyl Engine compliance calculator, IMO.

 

Posted

My problem is trying to calculate usable compliance ratings of my all Japanese MC cartridges!

(It seems most calcs don't like the Japanese 100Hz compliance ratings...)

Anyone any wiser?

DENON DL-110
DENON DL-103R
SHELTER 501/2

 

Posted
2 hours ago, SONDEKNZ said:

My problem is trying to calculate usable compliance ratings of my all Japanese MC cartridges!

(It seems most calcs don't like the Japanese 100Hz compliance ratings...)

Anyone any wiser?

DENON DL-110
DENON DL-103R
SHELTER 501/2

 

I thought you had to multiply the Japanese 100Hz compliance rating by 1.5x - 2x, Tony, to get the 10Hz rating which the VE app requires.  I suspect Ian's "Korf Audio" calculator also wants to see the 10Hz compliance rating.

 

Posted
2 hours ago, Vinylear said:

From memory double the compliance figure provided by the Japanese.

 

2 hours ago, andyr said:

 

I thought you had to multiply the Japanese 100Hz compliance rating by 1.5x - 2x, Tony, to get the 10Hz rating which the VE app requires.  I suspect Ian's "Korf Audio" calculator also wants to see the 10Hz compliance rating.

 

 

Thanks guys.

Yes, I am aware of this conversion approach.

The problem is...

Among those who know - not including me - the accuracy of this formula seems to be an even split between yay and naysayers.

Posted
8 hours ago, SONDEKNZ said:

 

 

Thanks guys.

Yes, I am aware of this conversion approach.

The problem is...

Among those who know - not including me - the accuracy of this formula seems to be an even split between yay and naysayers.

 

Exactly.  I wouldn't bother with a calculation that is so approximate.   Thankfully though, real world performance is not so critically affected by this "matching" as some might think.    I tend to just give it a try and see how well it works.

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Posted

I had a look on the net and there seems to be no formula to convert from a 100hz compliance measurement to a 10hz. There is only a rule of thumb as stated by Andy.

In a real world situation I ran 2 Denon DL103R side by side about 10 years ago. One on a 9.5 gram effective mass arm and a 18 gram arm, both sounded just fine to me.

I assumed that the Denons were 10 cu to check arm compatibility one arm just scraped in, I think that was the lighter one.

As aussievintage says in a real world situation its not so critical. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
Posted
On 01/01/2025 at 2:28 PM, SONDEKNZ said:

 

 

Thanks guys.

Yes, I am aware of this conversion approach.

The problem is...

Among those who know - not including me - the accuracy of this formula seems to be an even split between yay and naysayers.

 

On 02/01/2025 at 6:57 AM, Vinylear said:

I had a look on the net and there seems to be no formula to convert from a 100hz compliance measurement to a 10hz. There is only a rule of thumb as stated by Andy.

In a real world situation I ran 2 Denon DL103R side by side about 10 years ago. One on a 9.5 gram effective mass arm and a 18 gram arm, both sounded just fine to me.

I assumed that the Denons were 10 cu to check arm compatibility one arm just scraped in, I think that was the lighter one.

As aussievintage says in a real world situation its not so critical. 



Correct on the doubling conversion - a rule of thumb and nothing more.

100hz and 10hz aside;  manufacturers' stated compliance is often considerably off compared to what the calculators infer to you {not to mention there are also somewhat different perspectives on effective mass also!}

You will only ever truly know what the resulting resonance frequency is from testing it after setup.

In my experience matching effecitve mass and compliance (on paper) is a rough ballpark of cartridge combinations to avoid, rather thann a definitive ruling of what "works" and what "doesn't"..

A tonearms ability to deal with resonance is HUGE (not to be understated) balancing factor in the overall performance of the combination (as it the cartridges suspension design).

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