Balzer Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 Hi Everyone, Sorry to pop another question about streamer but I have no idea how to choose. Lots of noise about Cambridge Audio and eversolo made think too much about what I want from a streamer. They all have the same options (I think) I want to play Tidal and Flac Files. and cd from a cheap dvd player used as a trasnport into Topping E30 My files are on a Drive enclosure and maybe moving to a NAS. The DAC wouldn't effect my choice, only because I have already one and whatever I'm gettin will be better anyway. I thought a lot between CA MXn10 and Eversolo DMP-A6. Reason I like the eversolo: Pretty Screen I love that can be used as a server Ripping CD Reason I like MXN10 Small print. Those 4 preset buttons at the front Apparently good App? But I also think that the screen is not a deal cutter (but it use cute) would ripping cd better than using a PC? Its probalby not as good as the bluesound vault.... should I go with the MXN10 and with the money saved buy a good DAC in the near future? I have a weston troubadour 350 standard Tubes Focal chora 826 Topping E30 I cant find anyone talking about different streamer Software on YT. I feel everyone judges mainly a stremer just for the DAC ( I could be wrong though) I'm no expert but I'd like to know as much as i can before spending big bucks Thanks everyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 What’s your budget and then go and have a listen, if you buying new. Neo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy8 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 Please have a look at the video in this post While Lumin likely to be beyond your budget, Lachlan, the reviewer, raises some important questions at the beginning. Are you a person who believes "digital is digital" and it does not matter what streamer you get? If so, then stay with entry streamers. And it does compare some streamers including the A6. The A6 has a large following here largely because of the screen, but not the best SQ. If SQ more important, consider the CA CXN100 instead of the MXN100. And if you are prepared to do some simple DIY, I can recommend a Pi5 running SnakeOil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JkSpinner Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 I have recently gone down this path, however stayed away from the budget streamers and focussed on SQ. However I struggled to accept that decent SQ in a streamer (inc decent dac and power supply) was an $8k and up exercise. It was also difficult to quantify the SQ advantage of a Lumin / Aurender / Aurealis over the A6 or CXN 100, they are better, but how much better considering they are three times the price. As I was also looking at a CD Player, I ended up with. Marantz Network CD player with HEOS. in my search, many people pointed out that the App is as important as DAC etc, but I kind of brushed that aside, thinking it’s just an app. i bought the Marantz 3 weeks ago - what have I learnt. 1. the app is very important. HEOS is not that easy to use, I will get by, but it’s a PITA for a beginner. Also support for Spotify Connect and Tidal Connect makes life easier. Not just support for Tidal and Spotify via the app, this can be a PITA. 2. Connectivity is important - ensure the streaming device easily connects to USB drives and NAS drives. The same goes for NAS drive choice. I have a Synology NAS drive which is a complex system. I had previously owed a WD NAS with simply network shares, my dog could have connected to it. Many Streamers do not support all USB drives. My streamer does not appear to support USB 3.0. Try buying a USB 2.0 SDD today, I cannot locate one as yet. i would personally nut your priorities out prior to purchase, email the manufacturer and get confirmation that your priorities are supported as well, just as a fall back. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 3 Author Share Posted July 3 Neo : I'm not sure about the budget, its always a compromise with how much I'll get out of it. It's more about how much I gain for the extra $$. The reason I was going for the MXN10 is so I can use extra cash for a great DAC. I guess around the $1500 mark, I could push extra like CXN100. Snoopy8 : I have a RPI4 and was thinking to run plex server as I have also Digital movies.. SQ is very important to me but its hard to judge a streamer when I cant test it with my set up. I assume SQ is not just about the DAC, Power supply is important but its about how much difference i can hear ( can only do with tests) I've heard a lot about lumin, apparently the software is not bad either JkSpinner : You are reading my mind I think when it comes to the app, it's important that music is loaded quickly enough and can handle a large library. Also important that the app gets developed and updated at a decent pace, unfortunately I haven't found anyone reviewing apps. I dont mind spennding extra as long as i like it, I just need to save more but as you mentioned how much will I gain from the extra $$$. I recently went to addicted to Audio and the guy didnt really sound confident, he told me that MXN10 and AXN10 are totally different as the AXN10 is a faster trasnport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy8 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 30 minutes ago, Balzer said: Snoopy8 : I have a RPI4 and was thinking to run plex server as I have also Digital movies.. SQ is very important to me but its hard to judge a streamer when I cant test it with my set up. I assume SQ is not just about the DAC, Power supply is important but its about how much difference i can hear ( can only do with tests) You can do all of this at home with your setup. With the Pi4, use Raspberry Pi Imager to load Bookworm Pi OS Lite (64 bit) on a microSD card, start Pi with network cable attached, and run this script on terminal to load SnakeOil bash -c "$(wget -qLO - https://artifacts.snakeoil-os.net/artifacts/snakeoil-installer.sh)" More info here https://www.snakeoil-os.net/forums/Thread-Announcing-Snakeoil-Measurements-1-3-0 Use a browser to access SnakeOil and there are existing web music players or you can use free apps like Squeezer (LMS, Squeezelite) or MpDroid (Mpd) on an Android phone. There are also iOS apps. You will be surprised about the SQ produced by the free version of SnakeOil. If you donate, say $10, you will get an activation code that provides further tweaks. Yes, a power supply can improve things further, but that can be done later. But SnakeOil by itself will give the largest SQ jump and more than likely to beat the streamers that you are considering. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 4 Author Share Posted July 4 45 minutes ago, Snoopy8 said: You can do all of this at home with your setup. With the Pi4, use Raspberry Pi Imager to load Bookworm Pi OS Lite (64 bit) on a microSD card, start Pi with network cable attached, and run this script on terminal to load SnakeOil bash -c "$(wget -qLO - https://artifacts.snakeoil-os.net/artifacts/snakeoil-installer.sh)" More info here https://www.snakeoil-os.net/forums/Thread-Announcing-Snakeoil-Measurements-1-3-0 Use a browser to access SnakeOil and there are existing web music players or you can use free apps like Squeezer (LMS, Squeezelite) or MpDroid (Mpd) on an Android phone. There are also iOS apps. You will be surprised about the SQ produced by the free version of SnakeOil. If you donate, say $10, you will get an activation code that provides further tweaks. Yes, a power supply can improve things further, but that can be done later. But SnakeOil by itself will give the largest SQ jump and more than likely to beat the streamers that you are considering. I'll give it a go, I have an isotek evo 3 that should help me a bit with noise ( i suppose) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 10 Author Share Posted July 10 Thanks for that. Snakeoil is pretty good but I can't run tidal because it requires squeezebox server authentication and they are done running Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy8 Posted July 10 Share Posted July 10 19 minutes ago, Balzer said: Thanks for that. Snakeoil is pretty good but I can't run tidal because it requires squeezebox server authentication and they are done running There is a new Tidal plugin for LMS that no longer requires the server. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 10 Author Share Posted July 10 Thanks . I probably searched for the wrong thing. I'll definitely donate to snakeoil. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawso8 Posted July 12 Share Posted July 12 I recently went through a similar process and got a lot of assistance from the brains trust right here: Couldn't be happier with my WiiM Pro / Gustard A26 combo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeptical Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 (edited) I'm also very happy with my setup - see my signature for details. If your streamer and DAC and amplifier work to spec then SQ is dictated by speakers and room, so that is where the $ should go. The only criteria for choosing electronics is the look, the functionality (including the app), connectivity, price and after sales service. All assertions that electronics affect the sound are based on scientific ignorance. Edited July 13 by Skeptical Extra details added 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 13 Author Share Posted July 13 49 minutes ago, Skeptical said: All assertions that electronics affect the sound are based on scientific ignorance Ha ha, I love that. I think some people need to justify their choices in some way . Some needs numbers, other wants to use ears. We all have different taste at the end of the day...... remember, some people put pineapple on pizza 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawso8 Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 1 hour ago, Skeptical said: I'm also very happy with my setup - see my signature for details. If your streamer and DAC and amplifier work to spec then SQ is dictated by speakers and room, so that is where the $ should go. The only criteria for choosing electronics is the look, the functionality (including the app), connectivity, price and after sales service. All assertions that electronics affect the sound are based on scientific ignorance. Perfect username! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tone Malone Posted July 21 Share Posted July 21 My experiences are similar to @JkSpinner's. Usability is crucial and a part of the overall enjoyment of a system. A lot of good demos for streaming interfaces can be found on YouTube, I'd check them out before purchase to ensure the device you buy is not only *technically capable* of doing what you want, but allows you to use those functions easily. Re the debate about what affects the SQ of digital signals, I'll say this much: I had an original Blusound Node ("the cube") which sounded ok but bloated the bass a bit. So I figured I'd do optical out to a DAC to bypass the issue. No dice ... the colouration added by the streamer in this case could not be removed. I haven't lost hope that some combinations of "inexpensive streamer + better DAC" will punch well above their weight - just flagging that the DAC can only do so much with the material it receives. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 21 Author Share Posted July 21 31 minutes ago, Tone Malone said: My experiences are similar to @JkSpinner's. Usability is crucial and a part of the overall enjoyment of a system. A lot of good demos for streaming interfaces can be found on YouTube, I'd check them out before purchase to ensure the device you buy is not only *technically capable* of doing what you want, but allows you to use those functions easily. Re the debate about what affects the SQ of digital signals, I'll say this much: I had an original Blusound Node ("the cube") which sounded ok but bloated the bass a bit. So I figured I'd do optical out to a DAC to bypass the issue. No dice ... the colouration added by the streamer in this case could not be removed. I haven't lost hope that some combinations of "inexpensive streamer + better DAC" will punch well above their weight - just flagging that the DAC can only do so much with the material it receives. Are you of the opinion that it's not just 0 and 1? It's really hard to judge. If only we had the chance to try different combinations at home with our systems..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy8 Posted July 21 Share Posted July 21 31 minutes ago, Balzer said: Are you of the opinion that it's not just 0 and 1? It's really hard to judge. If only we had the chance to try different combinations at home with our systems..... I have compared and embarrassed a few expensive commercial streamers with SnakeOil. There are quite a few things you can do to improve SQ. Try enabling CPUset and playing from RAM. Use a linear power supply with the Pi4. And if you use USB, get the Gieseler Reinigen (USB reclocker). 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tone Malone Posted July 21 Share Posted July 21 8 hours ago, Balzer said: Are you of the opinion that it's not just 0 and 1? It's really hard to judge. If only we had the chance to try different combinations at home with our systems..... Good question, putting it that way. Yes, I believe the source material is just 0s and 1s, but that the design of the interconnecting components can still impact the transmission of that data and final sound quality to some (usually small) extent. That said, IMO the law of diminishing returns is strong with digital components. @Snoopy8's suggestion sounds like a good option to me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 22 Author Share Posted July 22 Snakeoil is working well. Having issues playing flac files from my hd but it's probably just a mounting issue. I have a denafrips pontus 12th in my hands and want to compare with my current dac. Trying to configure the rpi with 2 usb dacs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy8 Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 10 minutes ago, Balzer said: Snakeoil is working well. Having issues playing flac files from my hd but it's probably just a mounting issue. I have a denafrips pontus 12th in my hands and want to compare with my current dac. Trying to configure the rpi with 2 usb dacs Have you defined the HD music library in LMS? You should be able to plug in 2 USB DACs and it will show up as USB Audio (hw: 1,0) and (hw: 2,0) in Player tab. Your hw: numbers may be different. You can then assign Squeezelite R2 output to either (hw:1,0) or (hw:2,0). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted July 22 Author Share Posted July 22 Somehow the hd changed so I just had to correct the music folder were LMS was looking. I'll check fir the USB. Thanks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RhettM Posted August 13 Share Posted August 13 On 21/07/2024 at 2:50 PM, Snoopy8 said: I have compared and embarrassed a few expensive commercial streamers with SnakeOil. There are quite a few things you can do to improve SQ. Try enabling CPUset and playing from RAM. Use a linear power supply with the Pi4. And if you use USB, get the Gieseler Reinigen (USB reclocker). does anyone sell an already set up Pi and snakeoil? I have no tech skills at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted August 13 Author Share Posted August 13 1 hour ago, RhettM said: does anyone sell an already set up Pi and snakeoil? I have no tech skills at all! I don't think so. I just followed snoopy8 instructions. Below is how to install the os https://howtohifi.com/beginners-guide-to-raspberry-pi-os-installation/ Then follow the instructions for snakeoil. I'm no expert either , I installed the os 5 times before pi stopped crashing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy8 Posted August 13 Share Posted August 13 1 hour ago, RhettM said: does anyone sell an already set up Pi and snakeoil? I have no tech skills at all! Are you able to buy a Pi with a case and put the Pi in the case? If so, cover cost and I can send you a microSD card with SnakeOil. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balzer Posted August 13 Author Share Posted August 13 On 22/07/2024 at 7:53 PM, Snoopy8 said: Have you defined the HD music library in LMS? You should be able to plug in 2 USB DACs and it will show up as USB Audio (hw: 1,0) and (hw: 2,0) in Player tab. Your hw: numbers may be different. You can then assign Squeezelite R2 output to either (hw:1,0) or (hw:2,0). Not sure why but it doesn't show them together. They both work if attached one at a time. I need to dig into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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