Router question

[doogie44]

May I fall back on the wisdom of the Forum for some advice before shelling out some hard-earned cash? I need a better router for my system to help with 'low' internet speed in my music room. My next stop is the sales/tech guys at Officeworks but the Forum is first!

I have:

 

NBN MODEM: FTCC Network Connection Device; Model NDD-0300 (new last week)

Aussie Broadband subscription: 100Mb/s/10 for several years

Medium-sized house internet area

TP-Link Deco M5 3 Pack Whole Home Mesh Wireless-AC1300 System

NETGEAR Wireless Router - N300 (WNR2000)v5

Speed test: 90+ Mb/s at my office desktop computer/modem/router

Speed tests: (not greater than) 40+ Mb/s in the lounge room (hi fi system)--about 10 metres away through a doorway and with its own mesh node adjacent to my streamer.

'Generally' my internet experience is OK.

AURALIC G1 streamer, playing Qobuz hi-res wirelessly (via iPad Lightning DS app)--this is Auralic's preferred setup. I have never succeeded in playing a wired connection (don't know what I'm doing wrong via the app/desktop computer). Likewise, nor can I access any computer music files utilising the Auralic over my network (can't get it right somehow). I stick with my current streaming setup.

 

I should say right now that my IT-qualified son in law recommended and set all this up for me in the past, and problem-solved it too. He loved doing it. He is not available now, or he would have sorted all this out. I have vowed to stop wasting time trying to understand digital complexities in my life from this year, and just pay money for well-designed gear or professional advice to get things working.

 

PROBLEM: There is some 'stuttering' and occasional dropouts on playing tracks. Annoying. No amount of re-setting the system or re-installing mesh internet or Qobuz apps, or futzing around endlessly has changed this.

 

I am not technically-minded (this is an understatement) but I understand that newer, faster routers might help sort this out. I inclined towards a Netgear one until I read about some horrific installation issues (even for the digital-savvy purchaser) in a review. Now I wonder whether a TP-link one will be better--to go with the mesh system. The ranges and types of router models I find quite confusing; my budget is up to $300 or so (that should be enough for me from what I have read). So far it seems that the TP-link Archer series might be worthwhile--but which (there is the AX1500, AX1800, AX3000 & the AX20, AX23...and more variations )??

 

NOTE:

1. I want the full speed I'm paying for in my music room!

2. I 'must' have a wizard or genie for a simple install, or it's a no-go for me.

 

Any recommendations for a router that will deliver the 2 things, please? Harsh comments? Impure thoughts?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

 

 

 

[Pebbles]

Hi Doogie, me no expert either but I would be trying to connect your mesh point in the Hi-Fi room to your router via Ethernet cable if possible. Can you have a more direct line of sight between your router and mesh point? The Aries does not need to be right next to it, as long as it has a reasonably clear ‘view’, regards

[El Tel]

22 minutes ago, Pebbles said:

I would be trying to connect your mesh point in the Hi-Fi room to your router via Ethernet cable if possible

 

This.

 

Have a sparky come and install a Cat6 run between your listening room and your ISP ingress point where your router is.

 

I suspect, due to the speeds you actually have even over WiFi at 40Mbps, the problem is not your home infra, but it's a Qobuz issue. You're not alone in stutters and drop-outs; I use Roon and Qobuz at the back-end and get maybe two or three 2-3 sec drop-outs in a day of listening. My Lumin T2 is hard wired to a switch in my listening area which is then plugged into a wall port (I installed Cat 6 throughout the house years ago) which goes back to another switch in my office/lab connected to my own router/firewall and then on to the ISP router. My setup is more complex than most (ex-IT tech from network/security/data centre disciplines), but I know the drop-outs are not my issue to fix.

 

To your point on only getting 40Mbps in your listening room, I live in rural Vic. I Speedtest from any node including wired and wi-fi, I only get download speeds of 24Mbps on the best days. This is more than double what is needed for hi-res streaming.

 

Raise a ticket with Qobuz. The more complaints they get in Oz, the more they will fettle their CDN in-country with their provider (Akamai).

Edited March 16, 2023 by El Tel

[Dr.Funk]

Hi David,

 

I am not sure how much this may help, but more information is always the key to solving problems.

We have some similarities in our system of work.

I have Aussie Broadband, 50mbs, I also have a TP-Link Deco M5 pack, but I am only using two of the three units, I have Qobuz too.

 

I live in the hills of Perth, known for internet issues because the copper wires, supplying the main nodes, are often affected by rainwater flooding boxes and junctions.

I did a speed test for you this morning and I am getting 53.8Mbps download (remember I am only paying for 50Mbps!) and 19Mbps upload. I am using the bog standard router supplied from Aussie. So I doubt if a faster router is what you need.

 

My internet  floor plan layout is; the main Aussie router in my office, supplying one Deco M5, 20m away, in the lounge is the other Deco unit. The reason I only use two is I have no drop out areas in my 150 sq m home, in fact I also have wifi in my outside patio area, which is about 12m from the nearest Deco. I keep the third unit in case I need to reach out further, for example, if I ran a power cable into the middle of my lawn I fill my whole back yard, which is 1,000 sq m!

 

So from my router I have one ethernet cable going to the ethernet input on the first Deco, that supplies the mesh wi-fi into the house. I then have another ethernet cable going from the ethernet output of the Deco to an 8-port Netgear switch. This then connects to my desktop, network printer, solar panels and NAS. I have then run one CAT6 ethernet cable from this switch (in my office, furthest room to the west)  all the way through the roof to my lounge, furthest room in the east, around 40m of cable. This cable terminates at another Netgear 5 port switch. This feeds all my lounge room media needs (TV streaming, Bluray etc) and , this is where my second Deco sits as well. From this switch I run another 10m CAT6 back to my Lumin A1 in my hi fi rack.

This second Deco supplied my Lumin with ample wi-fi signal, in fact when I had a CXNv2 streamer, this showed 100% signal strength received. It is worth noting that the Lumin does not have wi-fi built in. I sat the Deco next to my Lumin and connected a patch lead to it via the Deco ethernet output. It worked extremely well, no drop outs ever. However, in an experiment, I found a slight improvement in sound when connecting a 10m CAT6 directly from the switch to the Lumin. So the second Deco's sole purpose is to supply wi-fi to the east end of the house.

 

Whilst I have been writing this, you have had two other replies, El Tel is far more qualified than I to answer your issue. Touch wood (placing my hand on my head) I have never had a drop out from Qobuz since I joined a year ago. I would as a minimum connect the a Deco directly to your Auralic to see if it improves. I doubt it is one of the Deco's, but have you updated your Deco's, via their app, to the latest firmware v3.2.13, a very easy process, click one button and it will update and reset all the Deco's in about 5 - 10 minutes.

Also, have you clicked the 'More' button on the app and initiated Network optimization? It will just double check everything for you.

 

My last comment, may or may not have some relevance? I did a home audition of an Auralic Vega G1 (had a Dac in it) and using wi-fi it kept dropping out, every couple of minutes, the dealer blamed my internet and said Auralic is obviously not for me, obviously! Changed to the Audio Cambridge CXN v2 (saved heaps of money) and got 100% wi-fi strength immediately, with the same setup!! As I said earlier, my Lumin A1 does not have wi-fi but there is nothing to assume anything would be different if it did.

 

I would definitely contact Aussie Broadband, if nothing else, why pay for 100Mbps if your only getting 40mbps?

 

Sorry for the ramble, I hope you find something useful out of that lot.

PM if you need to.

Cheers

Andy

 

 

[doogie44]

Thanks guys. Very helpful indeed.

 

No new router: OK

 

Used the Deco app to optimise and check network. Updated.

 

I have got an Ethernet outlet under the floor to the music room! I never used it. I connected it to my Deco node inlet- no joy. Then I noticed the ‘Access point’ option in the advanced options in the Deco app. Changed to this, rebooted. Result: 60-70 Mbs now. Incredible.

 

Lets see if this helps from here?

 

One is feeling chuffed in any case…

[El Tel]

17 hours ago, Dr.Funk said:

Hi David,

 

I am not sure how much this may help, but more information is always the key to solving problems.

We have some similarities in our system of work.

I have Aussie Broadband, 50mbs, I also have a TP-Link Deco M5 pack, but I am only using two of the three units, I have Qobuz too.

 

I live in the hills of Perth, known for internet issues because the copper wires, supplying the main nodes, are often affected by rainwater flooding boxes and junctions.

I did a speed test for you this morning and I am getting 53.8Mbps download (remember I am only paying for 50Mbps!) and 19Mbps upload. I am using the bog standard router supplied from Aussie. So I doubt if a faster router is what you need.

 

My internet  floor plan layout is; the main Aussie router in my office, supplying one Deco M5, 20m away, in the lounge is the other Deco unit. The reason I only use two is I have no drop out areas in my 150 sq m home, in fact I also have wifi in my outside patio area, which is about 12m from the nearest Deco. I keep the third unit in case I need to reach out further, for example, if I ran a power cable into the middle of my lawn I fill my whole back yard, which is 1,000 sq m!

 

So from my router I have one ethernet cable going to the ethernet input on the first Deco, that supplies the mesh wi-fi into the house. I then have another ethernet cable going from the ethernet output of the Deco to an 8-port Netgear switch. This then connects to my desktop, network printer, solar panels and NAS. I have then run one CAT6 ethernet cable from this switch (in my office, furthest room to the west)  all the way through the roof to my lounge, furthest room in the east, around 40m of cable. This cable terminates at another Netgear 5 port switch. This feeds all my lounge room media needs (TV streaming, Bluray etc) and , this is where my second Deco sits as well. From this switch I run another 10m CAT6 back to my Lumin A1 in my hi fi rack.

This second Deco supplied my Lumin with ample wi-fi signal, in fact when I had a CXNv2 streamer, this showed 100% signal strength received. It is worth noting that the Lumin does not have wi-fi built in. I sat the Deco next to my Lumin and connected a patch lead to it via the Deco ethernet output. It worked extremely well, no drop outs ever. However, in an experiment, I found a slight improvement in sound when connecting a 10m CAT6 directly from the switch to the Lumin. So the second Deco's sole purpose is to supply wi-fi to the east end of the house.

 

Whilst I have been writing this, you have had two other replies, El Tel is far more qualified than I to answer your issue. Touch wood (placing my hand on my head) I have never had a drop out from Qobuz since I joined a year ago. I would as a minimum connect the a Deco directly to your Auralic to see if it improves. I doubt it is one of the Deco's, but have you updated your Deco's, via their app, to the latest firmware v3.2.13, a very easy process, click one button and it will update and reset all the Deco's in about 5 - 10 minutes.

Also, have you clicked the 'More' button on the app and initiated Network optimization? It will just double check everything for you.

 

My last comment, may or may not have some relevance? I did a home audition of an Auralic Vega G1 (had a Dac in it) and using wi-fi it kept dropping out, every couple of minutes, the dealer blamed my internet and said Auralic is obviously not for me, obviously! Changed to the Audio Cambridge CXN v2 (saved heaps of money) and got 100% wi-fi strength immediately, with the same setup!! As I said earlier, my Lumin A1 does not have wi-fi but there is nothing to assume anything would be different if it did.

 

I would definitely contact Aussie Broadband, if nothing else, why pay for 100Mbps if your only getting 40mbps?

 

Sorry for the ramble, I hope you find something useful out of that lot.

PM if you need to.

Cheers

Andy

 

 

 

My guess would be that Qobuz are using a different CDN zone for WA to the East Coast and it is less contended. Qobuz need to buy more data from Akamai for Syd/Mel/BNE.

Edited March 16, 2023 by El Tel

[BugPowderDust]

My data comes out in Sydney via Starlink (although I’m in regional Victoria) and I can’t think of the last time I had a dropout on Qobuz. I do have a USA based Qobuz account though. I wonder if that factors into this at all.

[davewantsmoore]

On 16/03/2023 at 12:03 PM, doogie44 said:

1. I want the full speed I'm paying for in my music room!

Fair enough.... but.

I don't believe that this is necessarily responsible for your stuttering, pausing, etc ..... and it is definitely not responsible for the inability to access files.

 

So my advice is to try to find a router to purchase somewhere where they will entertain the possiblity of a return/refund if the purchase "doesn't solve your problem".

[davewantsmoore]

On 16/03/2023 at 2:40 PM, El Tel said:

This.

Have a sparky come and install a Cat6 run between your listening room and your ISP ingress point where your router is.

Before you do this.    Buy an Ethernety cable for << $1/meter.... and run it along the floor, and see if it makes any difference.

 

On 16/03/2023 at 2:40 PM, El Tel said:

I suspect, due to the speeds you actually have even over WiFi at 40Mbps, the problem is not your home infra, but it's a Qobuz issue.

Yes, or some sort of device compatibility/configuration issue..... and so just replacing the router isn't a sure-fix.

[Full Range]

 

You need to optimise your system in settings - remove stuff you don’t use 

 

Example- My router has gaming mode that I don’t use so it is switched off 

 

My router is an Asus RT-AX88U and can be set up as a mesh system but it’s so powerful I just don’t need any mesh satellites 

 

[MrBurns84]

1 hour ago, Full Range said:

 

You need to optimise your system in settings - remove stuff you don’t use 

 

Example- My router has gaming mode that I don’t use so it is switched off 

 

My router is an Asus RT-AX88U and can be set up as a mesh system but it’s so powerful I just don’t need any mesh satellites 

 

Agreed.  Im using an older router Asus AC5300 as the main router, has enough grunt.  I also use 8 Tplink M9 Decos as access points into various rooms - this improved the efficiency of wifi throughout the house as the AC5300 can lose signal strength (blackspots) in some bedrooms and lower levels of the house.  

[cazzesman]

On 20/03/2023 at 10:39 AM, Full Range said:

 

You need to optimise your system in settings - remove stuff you don’t use 

 

Example- My router has gaming mode that I don’t use so it is switched off 

 

My router is an Asus RT-AX88U and can be set up as a mesh system but it’s so powerful I just don’t need any mesh satellites 

 

 

 

I have the RT-AX86U.   Beast of a router.    I had my mobile on wifi and stood on the opposite side of the road from home.  Probably 60 metres from the router and 2 walls away and still a great connection.     I was after the 88U initially but they were sold out in Victoria at the time.

 

Not cheap, but I think you get what you pay for with this Unit.    No need for any mesh in my home, which is a double front, single story, weatherboard.     

 

Regards Cazzesman

 

 

[LogicprObe]

 

I researched this only last year and got these.................

 

https://www.asus.com/au/networking-iot-servers/whole-home-mesh-wifi-system/zenwifi-wifi-systems/asus-zenwifi-ax-xt8/

 

Unfortunately, I have to use a wireless channel for backhaul and it still flies.

I'd love to see how  fast they'd go with an ethernet backhaul!

[Chigurh]

On 16/03/2023 at 11:03 AM, doogie44 said:

Likewise, nor can I access any computer music files utilising the Auralic over my network (can't get it right somehow)

As a work-around for playing computer music files why not put them on an external usb hard-drive and plug it directly into the Auralic? That way you would not need to have your pc on to play them.

[doogie44]

Yes—excellent idea. I have done this and it works well. Powered HDD.

 

What has thrown me in the networking of music files within my computer is specifying the name of the folder. Try as I might I cannot get this correct! All my files are sitting in a folder on my D drive called ‘Music’. I know this is basic stuff. After hours of trial and error and internet research, I have abandoned the field. I suppose it’s a simple answer. Just can’t discover it. I am not cut from the same cloth as the digital gurus here on the Forum. My strengths lie elsewhere.

 

Since I’m playing Qobuz and my portable drive OK I don’t need the aggravation. Also, I am keeping my personal promise from 2022 not to waste any more precious time trying to understand digital information that is utterly counterintuitive to me. Thank God for program wizards and automation of setup. 
 

The only reason I am playing and enjoying digital at all is due to the constant attendance for, advice about, and fixing of such problems by my IT qualified son in law. He has torn out what was left of his hair doing this for me in any case: an object lesson I should have appreciated much earlier. Sadly he is no longer available.

 

Not that one is getting bitter and twisted in one’s old age…no, one merely observes.

[Chigurh]

Just FYI I have an Auralic Altair G1 and also a Bluesound Node 2i. As nice as the Auralic sounds, IMO the Bluesound runs rings around the Auralic in terms of stability and user friendliness.

[Dr.Funk]

@doogie44

David,

If you would like help accessing your 'Music' folder I am willing to use Teamviewer and access the folder remotely, and set it up for you. We can talk on the phone whilst I do it.

 

If you are not comfortable with strangers accessing your PC, although you would be sitting there watching your end, why not reach out to your son and ask him to do it remotely for you.

PM me if you would like to set this up.

Cheers

Andy

[doogie44]

Now that is a generous and thoughtful offer indeed. In keeping with the activities and attitudes of the very friendly denizens of the SNA Forum. Thank you for thinking of me.

 

You’ve certainly put your finger on the best kind of solution. So many savvy humans know this answer even if I’m not one of them.

 

I’m not worried about remote access. I tend to avoid my computer in any case.

 

Your suggestion about my son in law and remote access is a better option for me; I realise that at one level I was concerned that I would be a liability to him! I’m going to suck it up and ask. He does have the continuing use of my daughter, after all (this is a less than woke joke). He probably knows the answer off the top of his head.
 

My other son in law is a terrific handyman who has fixed our shower piping, bedroom fan, courtyard benches and numerous minor problems. I never shirk from asking his help. I suppose that my digital problems have just been so very numerous and dysfunctional. Many of them required his major time and effort. This was uninspiring.

 

 I could also see that the many points of dysfunction were frustrating to him as well. Finally, my incoming line, power system, network, mesh system, routers and modems were all upgraded to new but that was no guarantee that digital components would actually work together— or even survive a night alone. Let’s not start on my own massive ignorance. I just watched all this, feeling bilious.

 

Now I closely resemble the driver who can drive really well but has no idea at all why their car won’t start.

 

See how easy it is to get me started on this topic?? I must have digital PTSD…

 

Thanks again. I’m storing your kind offer away in my mental ‘break glass in emergency’ box.