New home, new build?

[blybo]

So just before Christmas we sold our home, including all the home cinema equipment & furniture. It will be hard to leave a room (and the equipment) I put soo much hard work into but the purchaser went well above our reserve price and was keen to have it as is. The new home has a room we could convert to a HT room but the wife doesn't think we have used our current one enough in the last couple of years...

 

This is the floorplan and the living room is the room I'd convert if going down that road, the "theatre" room is too small so will be the kids/secondary TV room. We also like the fact the living room is well away from the kids bedrooms as we wouldn't go over the top trying to stop sound leakage. The house is on 1.6 acres and the nearest neighbours home is some distance away

 

 

 

 

Now the big question is do I go all out on renovations, a laser projector, acoustically transparent screen and hidden atmos speakers, or just go a large TV with a good sound system and save a whole lot of coin?

 

How quickly do the new JVC laser projectors fire up? I admit that the delay of my current lamp projector warming up is a significant reason I often opted not to use our home theatre room in our current home. My other big issue is our puppy loved chewing on my acoustic treatments, so any new room would need to have treatments built in so we could invite him in with us.

[SGS]

If you didn't use the last one much, go with the big TV, I'd still go 5.x.4. Then it becomes where you sit in the evening to watch TV or a movie.

[blybo]

4 minutes ago, SGS said:

If you didn't use the last one much, go with the big TV, I'd still go 5.x.4. Then it becomes where you sit in the evening to watch TV or a movie.

We used it heaps, just not as much recently for the reasons explained. Just not sure I want to drop $50+k on building another one as it would have to be a step up from the current room

[SGS]

Mine is my lounge room so it's also for TV watching. As such I have just a TV, currently 65inch with hopes of going 85inch. With that I also have a good 7.2.4 which certainly makes watching TV more pleasurable and recliners. I find it a good compromise and one I won't change.

 

Guess you need to decide.

[blybo]

Yeah I’m leaning towards an 85” tv at this stage, but thinking about going krix in wall and in ceiling speakers for a neat finish. Still probably go with a processor and Elektra power amps. If I then decide to go projector down the track existing speakers would still work in with a Krix behind the screen speaker system 
 

2ch system in the family room will also be awkward as the log fire is off set on the wall

[purpleninja]

The benefit of the large TV is that you get to see how well it suits your needs in the new place, and also what your use of the room is like.

 

Then if you think you will be spending more time in there watching movies/TV then you can spend the additional $ on a better setup, and move the TV to another room.

 

Sometimes our viewing habits and preferences change when we move house - and rather than invest upfront this way you wait until you're more used to the house before you make the call.

[hopefullguy]

poppy cock.. a ht room is not about watching all the time, its a hobby and its also not a tv room either.  using a tv is a tv room no matter how much you spend on a sound system.

 

you either are a projector/home theatre person or not, its that simple. op knows in their heart, wife or no wife. god she's getting a new house and i bet she got more say in that.

[purpleninja]

1 hour ago, hopefullguy said:

poppy cock.. a ht room is not about watching all the time, its a hobby and its also not a tv room either.  using a tv is a tv room no matter how much you spend on a sound system.

 

you either are a projector/home theatre person or not, its that simple. op knows in their heart, wife or no wife. god she's getting a new house and i bet she got more say in that.

 

 

For you that is the definition of a HT room - not everyone is like you, just like not everyone is like me, and not everyone is like the OP.

 

Not everyone wants or can have a dedicated HT room even if they do want one.

 

We're all just giving some options for the OP - up to him to choose which best suit him and his family.

 

Live and let live.

[Hi-Fi Whipped]

3 hours ago, purpleninja said:

Sometimes our viewing habits and preferences change when we move house - and rather than invest upfront this way you wait until you're more used to the house before you make the call.

Definitely, having just moved house I can vouch for listening habits completely changing so understanding how you will listen to music and watch tv/movies really is the key to calculating ROI on any system.

[blybo]

On 07/01/2023 at 2:05 PM, hopefullguy said:

poppy cock.. a ht room is not about watching all the time, its a hobby and its also not a tv room either.  using a tv is a tv room no matter how much you spend on a sound system.

 

you either are a projector/home theatre person or not, its that simple. op knows in their heart, wife or no wife. god she's getting a new house and i bet she got more say in that.

My wife had a good belly laugh over this one.

 

Yes it is her dream property but she is also correct that we don't use the HT room nearly as much as we once did. I'm thinking a large TV and Atmos sound system to start with might be the best compromise till I discover if I really miss my HT room.

 

On 06/01/2023 at 4:50 PM, blybo said:

How quickly do the new JVC laser projectors fire up? I admit that the delay of my current lamp projector warming up is a significant reason I often opted not to use our home theatre room in our current home

I'm still waiting on an answer to this one. I haven't found any mention of this in the reviews I've read/seen of the JVC NZ7.

[betty boop]

7 hours ago, blybo said:

 

Yes it is her dream property but she is also correct that we don't use the HT room nearly as much as we once did. I'm thinking a large TV and Atmos sound system to start with might be the best compromise till I discover if I really miss my HT room.

 

I think have called it there.

 

comes down to what want in the end. 

 

85" is not large for a projector screen and its not small either for a TV. 

 

I love that we can easily shut a few blinds and watch a movie with a projector. but i get that isnt for everyone  

 

we havent done that much to our room. just taking a bit of care in setup, making best of it with furnishings.

 

yes can spend about $250k on converting it to  dedicated room as have seem some do with panelled walls hiding the treatments, AT screens etc etc but not everyone has that budget or inclination.

 

it looks a lovely room and id personally keep it as living room as possible and make it as usable and capable as possible within your own needs and limitations.

 

I've added a fair few speakers over the years to my room, planning to add more and a couple of more subs  if thats possible in my non dedicated room i think its possible in any really hehe

[Tweaky]

I just did a quick calculation given the room dimensions shown in the floor plan for the proposed new HT room.

Given that I am presuming you'd want around 1m to 1.5m behind the seating to move around, seeing where the room entrance is, and where the windows start on the wall where you intend to mount either a PJ screen or a TV, it's very very close to the same sort of seat to screen ratio as I have at my place.

 

A 83/85" TV would be ideal screen size, filling your field of view without having to move your eyes or head to see the side ends of the screen.

 

Should you go a Large TV or Laser PJ ? Pro's and con's with both.

PJ-Pro's

Can go larger screen size easily if found you can get away with it in the room.

A Laser PJ will probably have a longer life span without PQ degradation over time than any current TV.

Far less chance of having screen nastiness like Banding, Dirty screen effect or Vignetting.....No Panel Lottery.

A Laser PJ will probably stay in a calibrated state longer once done, than a Lamp based PJ or TV, although you will need to pay a pro with very high end equipment to do it

{Tony O'Brien - Clarity Calibrations, told me his current metering gear is getting updated to better calibrate Laser PJ's and QD-OLED TV's....Although he's so not happy about having to fork out the big $$ for it  ]

 

CON's

Possibly needing to have a darkened, if not totally darkened room at all times to get the best PQ.

Having to run long HDMI 2.1 cables and mount the PJ above and behind the seating, adding complexity and cost to install.

None of the current JVC PJ's do Dolby Vision as far as I can see from reading the spec's.....Dolby Vision is much better than HDR-10+ with content coded with it IMHO, especially once a separate calibration has been done for it

Not as bright as the newest TV's.

 

Large TV - Pro's

Probably a brighter picture than the Laser PJ, depends which PJ and/or TV you get.....Newest WOLED and QD_OLED TV's are plenty bright, still not as quite as bright as the best LED/LCD but pretty close.

No need for cabling behind the seating, or having a PJ hanging from the ceiling, overall much neater, less room invasive setup

Probably can get away with not needing a darkened room at all times, again depends on what type of TV you get.....Watching 4K UHDR content on a calibrated QD-OLED TV in total darkness is the best PQ I've ever seen.....the extended colour gamut and colour saturation and infinite contrast is jaw droppingly good.

 

Cons

Limited choice of "Quality TV's" in 83/85" and above sizes and only LG and SONY TV's do Dolby Vision, not Samsung.

Depending on type of Panel Tech used, possibility of screen nastiness like Banding, Dirty Screen effect and Vignetting [Panel Lottery] with WOLED type TV's, reports of these problems tend to happen on WOLED TV's 80+" size and above the most, and maybe QD-OLED TV's, which has only been available at Max 65" screen size until recent CES 2023 where largest screen size is now 77", they have had pristine panels as a rule so far.....so that's a unknown with this ATM.

 

WOLED and QD-OLED have a half life of 35,000 hours before picture starts to dim like old CRT TV's.

 

QLED - MINI LED/LCD TV's can't do true Black like WOLED /QD-OLED, although with the top 2022 models there is not really that much in it TBH from comparisons I've recently done with top WOLED/ QD-OLED 2022 model TV's.

 

Some QLED-Mini LED/LCD can suffer from limited angle of view to some extent, if you are not sitting directly in front of the TV the sides can look washed out.

 

 QLED/MiniLED/LCD TV can still suffer from blooming, only really noticeable when subtitles are showing on the best 2022 model FALD TV's

Edited January 9, 2023 by Tweaky

[blybo]

3 hours ago, Tweaky said:

Limited choice of "Quality TV's" in 83/85" and above sizes and only LG and SONY TV's do Dolby Vision, not Samsung.

Yeah I think the Sony X95K is the way I'd go. We recently got my parents a lower spec 65" Sony and I'm very happy with the UI and how it faultlessly controls his Marantz AVR for family ease of use. We lived there for several weeks while the sales campaign on our house took place, so got quite comfortable with it's smart features too.

 

An 85" TV

is roughly 1900mm wide so it should leave just enough room for Krix SX Megaphonix in walls as my LCR combo, but I'll have to wait till we are in to get exact measurements of how much wall real-estate is lost with windows and diagonals.

3 hours ago, Tweaky said:

Given that I am presuming you'd want around 1m to 1.5m behind the seating to move around, seeing where the room entrance is, and where the windows start on the wall where you intend to mount either a PJ screen or a TV, it's very very close to the same sort of seat to screen ratio as I have at my place.

 

We sit 3.8m from a 130" cinema scope screen in our current HT room, which equates to 103" for 16:9 material, so we will be losing some "seat to screen ratio" immersion for movie viewing but suspect will be a good sweet spot for everyday use. I will also make the entrance to the room a single doorway along with a solid door with proper acoustic seals all round. Again this door seal was a weakness with my current room.

 

18 hours ago, betty boop said:

I've added a fair few speakers over the years to my room, planning to add more and a couple of more subs  if thats possible in my non dedicated room i think its possible in any really hehe

Hehe, yes I know. Finally I'll also have under floor and in ceiling space to run cables. Because I've sold all my existing gear, I have a clean slate equipment wise to choose from. I'm leaning towards a Marantz Cinema 40 and a 7ch Elecktra power amp to run everything. From what I've read the pre section of the new Cinema series is a big step up from existing Marantz AVRs and the reason there is no 2nd tier processor in the new range. THe possibility of 4 subs and Dirac live to play with is certainly tempting. I always felt it was my subs in my existing system that was the weak point. That will not happen again.

[Tweaky]

I bought my sister a 65" Sony X90K a few months ago, it's the one down from the X95K, but actually has slightly better contrast [The X95K still hadn't arrived in Australia at the time -late October 2022]

 

I'd wait and see what SONY's 2023 TV line up is going to be, they aren't showing at CES 2023, they might do a separate State of Play like video, like they do for PlayStation, announcing what's coming out TV and electronics wise in a month or so.

There is a expected much need chip update due on most, if not all 2023 SONY TV's, this will sort out the current limitation re having to choose between having one of the only two HDMI 2.1 ports to be either enhanced DV capable, or 120hz VRR capable, plus one of those HDMI 2.1 ports is also the eARC port.....it's a bit of a PITA ATM even if you have a new AVR that can easily handle this stuff.

The new chip should allow more HDMI 2.1 ports, if not all 4 current HDMI ports to be HDMI 2.1 compliant, and at full 48 GPS bandwidth, and full 4.4.4 rather than the current 4.4.2. , which will appeal to PC gamers who have been ****ing about it, probably 144hz gaming as well, not that there are any 144hz games that I know about.

 

I doubt much else will change with SONY's 2023 line Mini LED/LCD / FALD TV's, spec wise, only the chip change will still probably cause a change in the model numbers.

 

Agree about the SONY UI, it's brilliant and a joy to use.

You'll get a Backlit version of the remote as well with the X95K, or it's 2023 replacement, I love the remote, but it's a bugger for finding it's way behind cushions.

You'll also get the camera that fits into a slot at the top rear of the TV [I got one with my A95K] you can control the TV with hand gestures apparently, among other things, I doubt most people will either fit it of use it, I didn't bother, seemed too gimmicky to me.

 

I might send it up to my sister so she can use it, she's already liking using the remotes voice command to control the TV

[betty boop]

love our sony oled, if going Tvs ... if i was going large TV it would be my pick again right now  

[blybo]

2 hours ago, Tweaky said:

There is a expected much need chip update due on most, if not all 2023 SONY TV's, this will sort out the current limitation re having to choose between having one of the only two HDMI 2.1 ports to be either enhanced DV capable, or 120hz VRR capable, plus one of those HDMI 2.1 ports is also the eARC port.....it's a bit of a PITA ATM even if you have a new AVR that can easily handle this stuff.

The new chip should allow more HDMI 2.1 ports, if not all 4 current HDMI ports to be HDMI 2.1 compliant, and at full 48 GPS bandwidth, and full 4.4.4 rather than the current 4.4.2. , which will appeal to PC gamers who have been ****ing about it, probably 144hz gaming as well, not that there are any 144hz games that I know about.

 

I don't think that will matter to us and I don't want to wait 6 months plus for it. We'll probably only have the AVR connected directly to the TV, and perhaps an Apple TV and Panasonic UB9000, though more likely those will switch via the AVR/processor. 

[blybo]

20 minutes ago, betty boop said:

love our sony oled, if going Tvs ... if i was going large TV it would be my pick again right now  

but they don't make an 85" OLED. Apparently there is SFA in it between OLED and mini LED these days anyway. I doubt I'd notice the difference.

[betty boop]

39 minutes ago, blybo said:

but they don't make an 85" OLED. Apparently there is SFA in it between OLED and mini LED these days anyway. I doubt I'd notice the difference.

theres a 83" OLEd. whats couple of inches ? LED is still LED....but if cant notice the diference .... 

 

83" a90j oled are an incredible bargain as they get optimum yield for the panel due to size,

https://www.thegoodguys.com.au/sony-83-inches-a90j-4k-bravia-xr-master-series-oled-tv-xr83a90j?

Edited January 10, 2023 by betty boop

[Tweaky]

I expect SONY will update their none QD-OLED TV's for 2023, especially the ones larger than 65".

The only OLED TV SONY makes at 83" is still the 2020 released A90J, as betty boop linked to.

 

If SONY choose to still use WOLED panels from LG, and the new MLA that LG are using on their 2023 TV's is unknown ATM.

I suspect they will still use LG panels, but not the MLA as used on LG's 2023 G3.

So it will end up being like a SONY version of LG's current G2, a newer, brighter panel than the current A90J.

 

From what I've been reading, the so called 70% increased brightness the 2023 LG G3 has is mainly marketing hype, as they are basing it on being brighter than a lower rung LG WOLED.

The actual brightness increase of the 2023 G3 with MLA, is actually only 5% over the current G2, and from what I've been reading about the technology of MLA, there are some downsides, like loss of picture sharpness due to the MLA lenses light scattering properties.

 

I'm also wondering how having a Micro Lens Array [MLA] on a WOLED might effect calibration, the light scattering might confuse the meter, especially high end spectros with under 10mm metering when calibrating secondary colours.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Tweaky

[blybo]

On 09/01/2023 at 6:05 PM, betty boop said:

yes can spend about $250k on converting it to  dedicated room as have seem some do with panelled walls hiding the treatments, AT screens etc etc but not everyone has that budget or inclination.

 

I'd be aiming for around $50k if going the whole hog, but I could do much of the work myself, except the fine details like plastering and the acoustic design

 

I've recently found out the Krix inwall speakers don't have a paint-able grill. Still leaning that way as I'd like to support an Aussie company, but what would be my other in wall options of a similar SQ and bang for buck? JBL, Klipsch, B&W, Focal?

[Hi-Fi Whipped]

30 minutes ago, blybo said:

I've recently found out the Krix inwall speakers don't have a paint-able grill. Still leaning that way as I'd like to support an Aussie company, but what would be my other in wall options of a similar SQ and bang for buck? JBL, Klipsch, B&W, Focal?

I haven't heard them but the Dali Phantom range looks like a quality option, some LCR options come fully enclosed too.

 

https://www.dali-speakers.com/en/products?series=phantom

Edited January 11, 2023 by Hi-Fi Whipped

[blybo]

8 minutes ago, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

some LCR options come fully enclosed too

this is what appeals about the Krix, as well as the high dynamics of a horn/waveguide type construction.

[betty boop]

9 hours ago, blybo said:

I've recently found out the Krix inwall speakers don't have a paint-able grill. Still leaning that way as I'd like to support an Aussie company, but what would be my other in wall options of a similar SQ and bang for buck? JBL, Klipsch, B&W, Focal?

 

Id have a chat to @Krix Loudspeakers on what suggest. in my opinion the local aussie option provides such excelletn value in the ht dedicated speakers it woudl be hard in my opinon to justify some of the other brands.. 

 

B&W focal i would only go for if had a focal passion or wanted to match up with other B&W/focal speakers ... JBL klipsch have to be a fan of tier sound..not everyone is can be a bit polarising  

if i were doing a dedicated room id just get one of the krix mx walls and be done with it  their in wall are fully boxed decent too...never been a fan of in wall that arent boxed.

 

the other brand which heard at audio trends in their main room that i found neutral and very good sounding wiht good dynamics and detail is mk sound. come with decent back boxes as well

 

another sensational sounding again neutral and dynamic are lyngdorf  planning on a couple of their subs  for rear boundary hehe

Edited January 11, 2023 by betty boop

[Tweaky]

I would have thought that trying to EQ a HT system using in wall/ceiling speakers properly would be a lot harder if they weren't boxed type.

 

The box would keep the pressure on the rear of the driver constant, and of a know value

Where if using multiple drivers in a wall/ceiling space, the pressure produced by the multiple drivers in the same air space would effect each other, how badly would be dependent on the frequency being reproduced.

 

 

[blybo]

3 hours ago, Tweaky said:

I would have thought that trying to EQ a HT system using in wall/ceiling speakers properly would be a lot harder if they weren't boxed type.

 

The box would keep the pressure on the rear of the driver constant, and of a know value

Where if using multiple drivers in a wall/ceiling space, the pressure produced by the multiple drivers in the same air space would effect each other, how badly would be dependent on the frequency being reproduced.

 

 

Yes I'd only go for a fully boxed in wall or in ceiling speaker, also to minimise sound leakage throughout the house.

 

12 hours ago, betty boop said:

Id have a chat to @Krix Loudspeakers on what suggest. in my opinion the local aussie option provides such excelletn value in the ht dedicated speakers it woudl be hard in my opinon to justify some of the other brands.. 

Been chatting for a couple of days now . The 190mm depth of the SX and MX range would cause some issues if wanting the room to still be multi use and decorated as such. For best effect it will require deepening the wall cavities and re-plastering. They aren't exactly pretty speakers and designed for dark dedicated rooms. I'm fussy in wanting dedicated room performance but wanting to keep the room aesthetically pleasing. For instance we'll probably go for a reclining couch this time rather than individual cinema style recliners.

 

12 hours ago, betty boop said:

if i were doing a dedicated room id just get one of the krix mx walls and be done with it  their in wall are fully boxed decent too...never been a fan of in wall that arent boxed.

I would too if getting a projector, but that would necessitate significant renovation of the room as the wall I plan to put the TV on probably won't hold a 130" inch screen (I don't have exact dimension of that wall), and it has a window right next to it. I am hoping that having 3 corners cut on a diagonal will help with standing waves and bass response though... time will tell.

Edited January 11, 2023 by blybo