Equipment racks made in Melb.

[SonicArt]

I am not sure which section to post this in, unless I am blind we dont seem to have a furniture/stand/rack forum in here at present?

 

Anyway! A project I have had in the back of my mind for a looong time has started to come together, I have always wanted to design a quality equipment rack. I used to sell the Apollo range of rack long ago, the tempered glass shelves with steel legs range, quite good racks, affordable for UK made, but a bit light in construction, not the best for analogue support.

 

I wanted to use wood, I wanted the structure to be strong and solid, yet with a reasonable level of decoupling of shelves to pillars.

We have some good choices of wood panelling here, Merbau, Teak, Ash are readily available in various thicknesses along with some other hardwoods.

 

The design needed to be modular, able to be flat-packed, easy to assemble, and look nice too.

 

The design is fully customizable, I can make almost any size of panel within reason, leg length can be adjusted to suit the customers needs, the base legs can use spikes for carpet or Delrin feet for other surfaces. So for example if you wanted a double width base section of say 2 shelves, with a single section at one end going up another 2-3 shelves this is easily done.

The shelves in this first test rack are 26mm Merbau, the standard shelf size is 540x460mm and will take most standard full size electronics. Of course the shelf size can be adjusted to suit the users needs, just means a little more wood cost

 

Legs are solid 33mm Alloy with Delrin decoupling spacers at either end. The spacers are recessed so that the coupling area to the legs is minimized yet the rigidity is very high. The finish is brushed "industrial"...IE the legs are not machined finish, they may have the odd minor surface nick or flaw which can be seen if you stick your head up really close to them! Surface machining each leg would add considerable time and cost to the build and the visual result from the brushed finish is very nice IRL.

 

I dont have a fixed final price yet, moreso I want to get a feel for what the audio community thinks, and would be willing to pay for a custom hand made rack that adds something to their system.

A suggestion for the name is "ITS A RACKET" modular equipment stands !

 

 

 

[PKay]

40 minutes ago, SonicArt said:

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I dont have a fixed final price yet, moreso I want to get a feel for what the audio community thinks, and would be willing to pay for a custom hand made rack that adds something to their system.

 

As a pricing comparison you could look at the Ben Burton racks https://lifestylestore.com.au/product/ben-burton-pty-ltd-two-turntable-tier-didgeridoo-rack/

 

Aust made and good quality.

[SonicArt]

Hmm, their construction is hollow steel legs with end caps? The Apollo racks were hollow steel legs with plastic isolators to hold the glass shelves. I think my rack would be more comparable to the quadraspire racks with solid alloy legs (but no decoupling). Of course price wise I would be aiming closer to the burton racks, the idea is to be able to offer a rack with the material quality and build of something like the quadraspire but at a much more affordable price.

 

[Stump]

I use Melbourne based SGR racks. You have the option of using your own wood shelf. Not cheap but will outlast your system.

 

https://www.sgraudio.com/hifiracks

[075Congo]

Just wondering re options for the bottom legs? Spikes with say M6 or M8 Thread......opens the door to say Iso-Acoustics Gaia or some Bunnings wheels (sacrilege). They (your racks) look really excellent and with the range of timbers you mention ....wow!  Pricing........talking to someone re Polish Isolation footers... they made the mistake of going too "cheap" to start with....can be problematic. Good luck with your product development. That delrin in the legs is a great idea. Offering custom shelving is an idea floating around........eg an idiot like me need 900mm width shelving for his audio storage space........if you could do it I certainly would pay a Premium for it. Another range perhaps.

[Artnet]

3 hours ago, SonicArt said:

We have some good choices of wood panelling here, Merbau, Teak, Ash are readily available in various thicknesses along with some other hardwoods.

 

Looking good Mark

Don,t forget Bamboo?

Can the legs be sand or shot filled?

[SonicArt]

2 hours ago, 075Congo said:

Just wondering re options for the bottom legs? Spikes with say M6 or M8 Thread......

an idiot like me need 900mm width shelving for his audio storage space........if you could do it I certainly would pay a Premium for it. Another range perhaps.

The bottom legs have M6 thread right now, I can put M6 or M8 in the base, the threaded joiners are M12 but I am going to reduce them to M10, they dont need to be that big.

 

As I was saying, custom, CUSTOM! I can build any size you need, if you need 900mm wide shelves no issue, just means more wood is all.

 

I think we will be looking at around $1600 for the 4 shelf rack, there is 3-4 solid days work in each one plus a day getting materials and cutting the boards to size at a friends factory. For 900mm how many shelves would you want?

[SonicArt]

1 hour ago, Artnet said:

Looking good Mark

Don,t forget Bamboo?

Can the legs be sand or shot filled?

Thanks mate, yes I have been looking around for bamboo sheets that would be suitable, bamboo is quite expensive considering its...bamboo!

Legs are solid alloy, nothing to fill

[075Congo]

I'll need to do accurate measuring! And get back to you........meranti?? You are on a roll!

Mick

[SonicArt]

I will have to look around for meranti, if you find a Melb supplier in the SE side let me know

 

[Artnet]

On 22/11/2022 at 6:15 PM, SonicArt said:

Legs are solid alloy, nothing to fill

 

Even better.  Can you post a close up of the machine finish of the leg or is it brushed?

[SonicArt]

Its brushed Steve, I could machine each leg to make it absolutely perfect but that would add quite a bit of time cost. I skim them with wet & dry in the lathe then brush finish. I will get you a pic closer up tomorrow!

[cafe67]

On 22/11/2022 at 3:07 PM, SonicArt said:

 

I think we will be looking at around $1600 for the 4 shelf rack, there is 3-4 solid days work in each one plus a day getting materials and cutting the boards to size at a friends factory. For 900mm how many shelves would you want?

$1600 aka $400 a shelf sounds good considering the construction and style. Considering some of the shelves available are nudging $3k a shelf or more. 
 

As per your research , shelves perhaps seem to fall into either cheap (tube steel and glass or wood and hollow tubes for example) then very quickly spiral upwards pricewise. 
 

the solid steel range seem good, but seem to offer a bewildering range of styles and prices. 
 

Customisation and easy access ( made in Australia) will be big in your favour..I’ve looked at a some shelves, a dimensions work for one component but too big or too small for other components.. 

 

Down the track, don’t forget to consider perhaps a standard model and reference , there’ll  always be some who will pay extra. 
 

Good luck with project

Edited November 23, 2022 by cafe67

[SonicArt]

Its like everything commercial, as soon as you start selling on a larger scale, making the components $20 cheaper is a big deal. I hate that idea, always have, everything I have designed over the last 30 odd years has been low scale production, boutique basically, and I like it like that.

 

What this means is my choice for solid alloy legs comes from wanting to go all the way with the material choice, I could have chosen alloy tubes, and put end caps on them, tubes were 1/3rd the cost of solid, but the material cost difference is small in the grand scheme of things when dealing with low production product, who wants to have to fill tubes with sand etc.

 

Same with the delrin decouplers at each end of the legs, I could have simply made the legs 180mm butted against the wood, I believe the Quadraspire racks are like this, $2800 for a 4 shelf model! They have fancy tapered legs, but they are solid alloy same as mine, slightly smaller diameter too. Yes their finish is to a high commercial standard, but mine is not far off, and mine is hand made, Aussie materials, aussie labour, and every rack will be unique

[075Congo]

Just finished reading "Who and What is Sonic Art".........fascinating. With your background experience in Asia and in Australia making excellent equipment racks is a cinch. Your fabrication skills opens the door to all sorts of creations.Talking to an SNA member the other day re equipment footers.....Stillpoints I think.........custom made equipment footers........machines brass or aluminium plus delrin...interesting!

[NonPlayableCharacter]

This might well be worth a chat... I am doing a house reno at present and at the end of it I intend to finish acoustic treatments in my listening space (which is the main family room and has the TV in the mix too) and then go for new racks. I was looking at the Quadraspire SVT kit, but your value proposition plus the Delrin decoupling you are talking about has me intrigued.

 

Having options for spike feet *and* having floor protectors for those with lovely wooden floors (thinking like the Quadraspire QC and QX7 floor protector options for their racks) would be a real selling point too. Getting height adjustment for levelling into the mix for the bottom set of legs/feet/spikes would also be a deal clincher for many.

 

I need to house the TV and Foxtel/PS4 stuff on one unit and then have a separate taller rack for HiFi (I am really missing my vinyl rig which is packed away at present), so maybe a hybrid or some other custom option may work.

 

I think commercially, if you were to offer a modular kit with 4 or 5 leg lengths, this would be an easy sell to the market if people could configure their ideal rack on your website and order that way. Then there is always the custom option for those with bespoke needs.

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by El Tel

[SonicArt]

I think it will take a week or so to set up a basic page/s on the website with the standard rack size offering, and some options for legs, but custom will only be a matter of emailing me with what you need to make your system fit and the room work, then I can calculate what is needed and quote you.

 

Bear in mind too, you might spec up a 2 shelf rack for say the TV with some gear under it, and specific leg lengths to make it all neat, then a few years down the track find you need to increase the height, well thats where the custom fabricator who is local comes into play All you need is to order a set of new legs and pop them in to your rack and away you go!

 

I know there are a few different finishes that appear on wooden shelves, but I was going to stick with oiled natural wood, for the one reason that its easy to repair/refinish for the end user, when hardwood is finely finish sanded it comes up very silky with a good furniture oil, and its easy to re-oil in the years to come, I want you to buy anything Sonic Art with the intent of being able to keep it a long time, modify it if necessary, and be able to repair it 10-20 years down the track if ever needed. (of course in 20yrs time I may be too decrepit to repair anything )

[NonPlayableCharacter]

2 minutes ago, SonicArt said:

I think it will take a week or so to set up a basic page/s on the website with the standard rack size offering, and some options for legs, but custom will only be a matter of emailing me with what you need to make your system fit and the room work, then I can calculate what is needed and quote you.

 

Bear in mind too, you might spec up a 2 shelf rack for say the TV with some gear under it, and specific leg lengths to make it all neat, then a few years down the track find you need to increase the height, well thats where the custom fabricator who is local comes into play All you need is to order a set of new legs and pop them in to your rack and away you go!

 

I know there are a few different finishes that appear on wooden shelves, but I was going to stick with oiled natural wood, for the one reason that its easy to repair/refinish for the end user, when hardwood is finely finish sanded it comes up very silky with a good furniture oil, and its easy to re-oil in the years to come, I want you to buy anything Sonic Art with the intent of being able to keep it a long time, modify it if necessary, and be able to repair it 10-20 years down the track if ever needed. (of course in 20yrs time I may be too decrepit to repair anything )

 

Oh, we're going to be chatting when I get an idea on the timescales of when the reno gets to the family room... This is the kind of commercial engagement I love - getting to talk directly with the craftsmen and decision-makers and knowing you're supporting local businesses and families. It speaks to me on so many levels.

[SonicArt]

7 hours ago, El Tel said:

Having options for spike feet *and* having floor protectors for those with lovely wooden floors (thinking like the Quadraspire QC and QX7 floor protector options for their racks) would be a real selling point too. Getting height adjustment for levelling into the mix for the bottom set of legs/feet/spikes would also be a deal clincher for many.

Its always my intent to build in usefulness into any product, hence any rack will have either spikes or feet that screw in, therefore adjustable and able to be leveled.

Delrin feet would be something like 30mm diameter and 15-20mm thick, creating a nice inert sink that can be sat onto wood or tile without issue. Stick on rubber or felt pads could also be used if the owner wanted extra protection.

 

When it comes to delrin, you only have to look at a famous TT builder like Oracle, the original delphi sat on Aluminum pucks that screwed into the base threaded rods, current model uses alloy and...Delrin!, the alloy feet are now like mini legs firmly screwed against the base, the delrin becomes the adjustable foot inside the alloy, and helps to decouple the table from its support. I have been making custom feet for equipment for years now just like this, in fact my Isolation platform design uses a version of these feet with various platform woods layered up.

[NonPlayableCharacter]

On 27/11/2022 at 8:06 PM, SonicArt said:

Its always my intent to build in usefulness into any product, hence any rack will have either spikes or feet that screw in, therefore adjustable and able to be leveled.

Delrin feet would be something like 30mm diameter and 15-20mm thick, creating a nice inert sink that can be sat onto wood or tile without issue. Stick on rubber or felt pads could also be used if the owner wanted extra protection.

 

When it comes to delrin, you only have to look at a famous TT builder like Oracle, the original delphi sat on Aluminum pucks that screwed into the base threaded rods, current model uses alloy and...Delrin!, the alloy feet are now like mini legs firmly screwed against the base, the delrin becomes the adjustable foot inside the alloy, and helps to decouple the table from its support. I have been making custom feet for equipment for years now just like this, in fact my Isolation platform design uses a version of these feet with various platform woods layered up.

 

Some good options for adjustable feet, be it spikes or Delrin. Goes without saying that most floors have, let's call it, idiosyncrasies I presume this is why some rack manufacturers opt for a 3 leg design.

 

If you want to think further on this, then some cable management options would be a bonus. I could always use Velcro ties to segregate power from interconnects, but any proper designed-in option, either on the back of each shelf or on the legs on either side at the back maybe at the joins would get interest.

 

Really looking forward to seeing what comes of this. I will be talking to you when you're ready.

[SonicArt]

Sorry for the delay in replying, been a lot on my plate the last week or two!

 

Cable management, it really could only be on the back edge of the shelf, as the legs screw together it would be impossible to tap threaded holes into them and ensure they ended up at the back!

Open to ideas on cable management attaching to the back of the shelf, show me any picks you might have or links of current ideas. I can easily tap threaded holes into the back of the shelves in order to fit some sort of stays or fittings for ties straps etc.

 

I will try to get the new pages up this week for the basic rack and some options lists so there is more idea of what you can get. I can make pretty much any shape length height within reason.

 

[075Congo]

The issue of cable-management for me is directly connected to the number of audio components I install in my audio system. And it is one of the final stages in creating an audio system.I do not think it possible for a rack designer to take this into account.........anticipating the number of cables; the sizes of cables and other variables like speaker size and type and factors like power outlet positions. And all the other factors as well......like power conditioners. Design custom racks but adding cable management to the design brief is my idea of a nightmare.

[SonicArt]

You are right Mick, I hate dealing with cable as well, and power cables are the worst as the end user cannot just cut n shut a cable shorter to fit in neatly with their system!

 

However it would not be impossible to at least have threaded holes in the back of the shelves, one either side maybe, even just in 2 shelves, top and middle, with maybe an alloy or delrin fitting that can take cable ties? So the cables could be routed as signal down one side and power down the other?

 

Just some thoughts floating around...

[NonPlayableCharacter]

4 minutes ago, SonicArt said:

You are right Mick, I hate dealing with cable as well, and power cables are the worst as the end user cannot just cut n shut a cable shorter to fit in neatly with their system!

 

However it would not be impossible to at least have threaded holes in the back of the shelves, one either side maybe, even just in 2 shelves, top and middle, with maybe an alloy or delrin fitting that can take cable ties? So the cables could be routed as signal down one side and power down the other?

 

Just some thoughts floating around...

 

Mick is on the money, yep. I guess I was just throwing out a laundry list of things that bug me that might be incorporated into the rack design. I was thinking of some hoops incorporated into the leg joins (one side or other of the Delrin separators), with requisite spacers on the front legs to allow for the 2-3mm or so caused by the hoops.

 

The main consideration would be if the shelves were tapped for secondary fittings, the choice of material for the fitting/anchoring to the shelf would probably need to be closely considered else the damping qualities of the Delrin shelf decouplers be compromised.

 

With the benefit of a little time and thought, plus taking into consideration comments made, I probably need to allow smarter people to direct the development and see what options might arise. I'd be satisfied with accommodation of velcro cable tie anchor points in all honesty.

 

 

[075Congo]

I like the idea of anchoring positions at the rear left and rear right of rack shelving to manage power cords and signal interconnects. Offer as an accessory option maybe.........pretty sure I would go for it. Something like a  circular disc with provision to run velcro ties off it. The disc is screwed onto the back of a rack shelf. Terrible description .