Flynnyfalcon Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 Hi all, I have been reading and trying to employ some basic tweaks to improve the soundstage which I have previously been impressed with from my KEF R300's in auditions in AV stores prior to purchasing my speakers. I am somewhat limited by my room size/shape as to how I position the speakers, but am willing to modify it within reason... well my wife's reason :-) I have attached a quick mockup of my lounge room in its current guise. The right hand wall has an open fireplace placed halfway along the wall, behind the couch is a large window, covered with a bamboo style curtain and to the left of the speakers/tv is a void where the room opens up to the kitchen/dining/another hallway. The floor is polished floorboards with a large "shag" rug in the middle. Currently the speakers are positioned roughly 30cm from the rear wall, the left speaker is roughly in line with the void edge and the right speaker is approx 40cm from the right wall. Both speakers are toed in towards my typical seating position on the couch (right hand side of couch). Currently the sounstage lacks the 3 dimensionality which I'm searching for, while it's impressive in it's own right, it's not what I am hoping for. Bass is solid, mid is robust and highs are crisp. Are their basic changes I can make to improve the imaging to gain a more forward 3d soundstage? Current setup is: KEF R300, port holes unplugged. Soundstyle ST-122 Speaker Stands, filled with sand Musical Fidelity M3i Cambridge Audio Stream Magic 6 running FLAC's only. Cambridge Audio 700 Series interconnect Chord Carnival SilverScreen Bi-wire speaker cable Thanks for any help.
kunalraiker Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 Could be the equipment, room seems fine to me.
aechmea Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 Suggestion 1 You are sitting ~4M away. This is where room reflections swamp the direct sound from the speaker. Sound will be coming from all directions ==> indistinct directional clues ==> no image. Suggestion 2 You are sitting at the end of quite a narrow isosceles triangle between seat and speakers. Speakers need to be wider apart and the seat closer. I prefer sitting a ratio of 1.25 away from the speakers that are 1 unit apart. ie more near field with speakers well spaced. Suggestion 3 It may not be possible but I would try swapping the seat and the speakers to the alternate ends of the room. The seat end seems a lot more symmetrical and capable of better control of wall reflections and relative distances. Suggestion 4 I would move both the speakers and seat further into the room. They are both a bit too close to the wall(s).
frankn Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 Agree with Aechmea's suggestion, especially #3 & 4. Swapping ends could make a significant change, plus you will be able to move the seat more central to the room than you/partner would feel acceptable with a speaker impinging on the entrance to the room. I don't mean that the seat can block the entrance but having say one quarter of the seat overlap with the entrance a metre or so into the room You would have more flexibility to move both speakers & seat placements reversing the ends
Gee Emm Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 (edited) try swapping ends. Having speakers at that end is doing you NO favours. After relocatiion... If possible, have speakers away from side walls & rear wall at lest 0.5m. Try seat ~3m back from speakers, instead of the ~4.5m you have now. Toe speakers in exactly, so that they look like they are actually facing your listening position. Enjoy some music whilst drinking quality beer. Fine tune positions of speakers & seat. Top up beer. Graham Edited August 23, 2013 by mr-happy-pants
svenr Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 In addition, your arrangement needs to make sure that the side walls where the important first reflections occur are symmetrical in an acoustic sense. Have a read about the parameters apparent stage width (ASW), listener envelopment (LE) and interaural crosscorrelation (IACC). Once you understand how they correlate to the spatial listening experience and how they are determined, you'll be able to change your setup to achieve the desired spatial impression you're after. 1
ArthurDent Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 Does anyone not think that swapping ends, moving the speakers and seating further into the room, the speakers away from the walls, sorting out speaker to speaker distance and listening distance ratios and a getting a bit of symmetry going isn't the obvious solution. So there must be something else going on as none of this is currently happening.
Gee Emm Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 kunalraiker thought the room was OK. So that's 1 for, 5 against. Let's wait to hear what flynny thinks of the majority's suggestions. Graham
ArthurDent Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 kunalraiker thought the room was OK. So that's 1 for, 5 against. Let's wait to hear what flynny thinks of the majority's suggestions. Graham Whilst not wanting to offend kunalraiker (or the OP I guess) how anyone could think the current room layout is okay beggers belief.
rocky500 Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 Try moving the speakers around 1m from the back wall. The more you can distance from the back wall, I find with my stereo, the better the depth of the soundstage.
Flynnyfalcon Posted August 23, 2013 Author Posted August 23, 2013 Thanks all for your input, I've spoken with the other half, and swapping ends is not an option :-0 aesthetically in this case I have to agree. Am I bound to have disappointing imaging in the room's current layout? I can probably move the left speaker across another half metre and bring the right across a touch further, but that could be it :-/
Peter_F Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 Could you 'try' and see how the system sounds with it setup along the long wall? Although this is not generally considered ideal, at least this you will have less obstruction on either side of the speaker and may help minimise reflections. You may also be limited how far you can have the speakers away from the front wall as well.
frankn Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 (edited) If that is it then try that, plus move the speakers in another 30cm from the front wall, listen, then another 30cm, listen again. Did the soundstage improve with both moves? Did the bass stay the same, get better or worse with each move? Depending on your answers you may have found an acceptable location. You might need to play with moves as little as 10cm. Once you have an acceptable speaker position you should try similar corrections with the couch. In the end you might also need to look at room corrections Edited August 23, 2013 by frankn
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