Do I really need a DAC with the works?

[ceeceevee]

So, as I mentioned in my introduction email, I'm currently hunting for my first dedicated dac. However, rather than bore you with another "what dac?" discussion, I wanna attack the problem another way.

I've got my short list down to three candidates so now it's down to specs and capabilities. I'm down to comparing sampling rates and I find myself wondering if it's such a big deal that one dac can only do up to 96khz via USB or another can do everything but 176.4khz. I mean, I don't even know where I'd find FLACs in 176.4khz???

So I guess that's my question: for those of you that have one of the Schitt Bifrost, Audio-gd NFB 3.3 or Peachtree dac-it, did it ever really matter that they can't do everything? How often do you find yourself in a situation where you want to listen to a particular piece of music and find that you can't? Isn't everything out there available in 44.1, 96 or 192khz? I'm probably over thinking this, aren't I?

[Batty]

I never needed anything over 96KHz, up until recently I had an NFB-2.

[proftournesol]

The DAC choice is determined by your music, do you listen to any hi-res? If not, save your money.

[betty boop]

is hi-res really hi-res anyways ? a lot of it is really upsampled low res in my opinion.

 

might find an old school dac to be sonically far superior too...who knows...just depends on what looking for

[Guest fordgtlover]

My DAC does all sorts of hires and what not - my music is 44.1/16

 

I don't feel like I am missing a thing.

[ceeceevee]

The DAC choice is determined by your music, do you listen to any hi-res? If not, save your money.

Most of my music consists of CDs, with some lossy tracks here and there. However, I am curious about hi-res and do intend at some point to start shopping for my music purely online, via HDtracks and the like.

However, my initial streamer will just be an appleTV 3 so I suppose that's all moot, since that re-samples everything to 48Khz. I was just trying to future-proof my purchase and save money in the long run but you can never predict what else will be out there in a couple of years...

[ceeceevee]

is hi-res really hi-res anyways ? a lot of it is really upsampled low res in my opinion.

 

might find an old school dac to be sonically far superior too...who knows...just depends on what looking for

I've read that in a few places so I guess I shouldn't worry too much about it and enjoy what I've got. Thanks for the feedback, all!

[georgehifi]

If your going to listen to is 16bit 44.1 Red Book CD's, the best sound you will get is via a good designed R2R Multibit based dac or player. There are many s/h you can get and just a few that are still being built new. Like the Audio GD based PCM1704UK dacs and I believe these will accept high rez via the USB, and of course the fine TDA1541 based AMR CD-77. There may be others you'll just have to look.

 

Cheers George

[davewantsmoore]

My software player converts  44.1 -> 176.4khz .... it seems to sound better this way.

[gz76]

I was just trying to future-proof my purchase and save money in the long run but you can never predict what else will be out there in a couple of years...

 

Of all the components in your system, I would say a DAC is probably the hardest to future proof at the moment as it seems to be a constantly evolving area.

 

Probably best to find something that suits your needs now, and don't overpay for tech features you may not need for another couple of years.

[Kamikaze]

I own one album in 192khz 24 bit (can't remember what it was though... and I can't listen to it, as I use a metrum octave and it doesn't properly support the resolution) and the rest is mostly in 44.1/16bit. I have 2 albums of NIN in 96khz.

 

I don't think hi-res thing is properly established market yet, and I don't think it will be developed in a hurry... so I reckon save your money for your first DAC. By the time it's established, you may be developing an upgraditis.

[deniall]

is hi-res really hi-res anyways ? a lot of it is really upsampled low res in my opinion.

 

might find an old school dac to be sonically far superior too...who knows...just depends on what looking for

 

Agreed. A lot of the HD Tracks stuff is appalling and offers nothing over the CD version.

[gavtron]

Hi CCV,

 

A year or 2 ago I bought my first 192khz capable DAC which was an audio-gd nfb 12 (cheapy for use at work)  I also had a Audio-gd reference 5 (96khz max) at home.

 

I downloaded some hires test files to compare 192khz on the nfb 12 to the same recording at 96khz.  I preferred the playback on the reference 5 despite the lower bit rate.  

 

I then compared 192 khz on the nfb 12 to 44.1khz on the Reference 5 - I still preferred the sound of the reference 5. 

 

My suggestion would be to stretch your budget to the nicest sounding dac you can afford, that matches the majority of your music collection's format.

 

Cheers,

 

gav.

[ceeceevee]

Thanks, guys. This is great feedback. A lot of you have convinced me that I should make the most of the music I've got now by getting a DAC which meets my current needs and not worry about bells and whistles I can't use yet. 

 

Cheers,

 

cc.

[bzr]

CC, very good analogy. I've owned or listened to the best of digital & if you can't afford it, don't fret. Get some music that you really know, go do a demo & get an at least one week return agreement on whatever you buy. You need to hear it in your own system & it needs to have at least a hundred hrs to bed in on it so leave it playing.

There are some amazing dacs out there & some are under 2k, hell, some are under 1k, just because they aren't the latest greatest doesn't mean they don't sound good anymore. Bells & whistles are for porters, what are you?

[rawl99]

My software player converts  44.1 -> 176.4khz .... it seems to sound better this way.

And that will depend entirely on what you are using for playback.

I have not heard a hi-rate dac that outperforms a really well put together NOS unit.

Additionally, I have never heard up-sampling improve the presentation over 44.1.

It would seem that our experiences differ somewhat.

And is that not what this game is all about?

Dontcha love this pursuit that we entertain ourselves with!

Rawl

[Briz Vegas]

Whatever DAC you buy just remember it would sound better if it was a turntable and you were playing vinyl :-)

I have thrown everything but the kitchen sink at digital and my resident DAC ( thats a smart arse way of saying " the one what i bought" ) will play anything up to 700 khz ish, except DSD. It sounds really nice to my ears. My observation is that 16 bit 44.1 is still bread and butter. Yes I have 192 kHz 24 bit files but that is not the bulk of my program material / music collection even after a few years of DAC ownership.

Better to find a DAC that plays music as you like it and forget the specifications and the bit rates.

I have a 2 box DAC with a big and fairly heavy power supply sitting outboard. It only powers the analogue components of the DAC. Add the cost of the Nordost power cord and I think of the derogatory definition of an audiophile. Putting the self flagellation aside for a minute, I also note that the sonic improvement I forked out for was due to the power supplied to the analogue side of the DAC only.

If I were starting out again I would look for a DAC the sounded best with my music, ignore bit rates, you can always down sample and still be happy.

Bit rates are not the constraining factor on your audio enjoyment. 16 bit is more than capable of keeping you happy. 16 bits can also sound very un digital, with all the negative sonic cone rotations ( I love auto spell) that brings.

[Guest fordgtlover]

Thanks, guys. This is great feedback. A lot of you have convinced me that I should make the most of the music I've got now by getting a DAC which meets my current needs and not worry about bells and whistles I can't use yet. 

 

Cheers,

 

cc.

 

DACs are evolving so quickly - it almost seems like every week that Bhobba has an amazing new one - so it is likely that things will continue to evolve over the coming few years.

Edited August 9, 2013 by fordgtlover

[Briz Vegas]

You know, I think there is an alternative viewpoint to this.

As an expert on getting excited about small differences, I think there is a lot of that going around.

[WhakPak]

I've been contemplating a DAC purchase but my current state of thinking is just send the analog out from my source player direct to the pre-amp and bypass everything in-between.

[betty boop]

I've been contemplating a DAC purchase but my current state of thinking is just send the analog out from my source player direct to the pre-amp and bypass everything in-between.

 

there are a lot of players with very lovely dac stages...so for that matter cant see anything at all wrong with that approach. something I do myself in my main system with a cd and sacd player