Warren M. Posted July 20, 2013 Posted July 20, 2013 With my recently acquired Lyra Kleos (and all their premium cartridges), Lyra supplies their SPT Stylus Cleaner/Preservative and strongly recommends using it at least once per record and preferably once per side, to keep the stylus scrupulously clean, extend its life, and, as a side benefit of the interaction between SPT and the stylus, actually improve the sound. I have been a long-time user of Last StyLast, and wanted to know whether there was any opinion by either Lyra or Last Factory, as to the benefits of one over the other. I ran up against something of a brick wall from both directions, with neither professing knowledge of the other. I did find an old comparison here http://www.stereotimes.com/acc072600.shtml which indicates clearly that an SPT-treated stylus sounds better than a Last-cleaned and StyLast-treated stylus. The argument made by Lyra for SPT was also very convincing: All stylus cleaning fluids or treatments will inevitably modify the sound of the stylus, so Lyra formulated SPT to impart a beneficial change to the sound, lessening the volume of clicks, pops and background hiss, while retaining the dynamics of the music, with particular benefits to the sound of Lyra cartridges but some benefits to the sound of all. But while SPT is essentially a very good stylus cleaner, StyLast is designed to actually change the surface behaviour of the diamond colliding with the vinyl so that less damage is done to the stylus by the collision shock waves. It is designed to extend the life a the stylus to several times that of untreated styli. Today, for the first time I had an opportunity to subjectively compare the sound using SPT to clean followed by StyLast, and using SPT alone. In my opinion, the SPT clean followed by StyLast sounds far superior than SPT alone. In particular, dynamics seem to have a sort of effortless quality with StyLast, which might be an indicator that tracking is enhanced by the use of StyLast. Still early days yet. Regards Warren
metal beat Posted July 21, 2013 Posted July 21, 2013 (edited) In my opinion, the SPT clean followed by StyLast sounds far superior than SPT alone. In particular, dynamics seem to have a sort of effortless quality with StyLast, which might be an indicator that tracking is enhanced by the use of StyLast. Still early days yet. Regards Warren Is it really that big a difference? I also use the SPT and I have never heard it improve dynamics - slightly clearer sound perhaps but quickly forgotten once you start listening to the music. . Are you seriously saying fluid enhances the stylus tracking? the Lyra's are seriously good trackers regardless of fluid enhancing :-) the Kleos is a very nice cartridge, you enjoying it more than the Shelter? Anyway, if it is doing all this and more for you, enjoy Edited July 21, 2013 by turntable
Warren M. Posted July 21, 2013 Author Posted July 21, 2013 Yes I am really finding a difference in tracking with SPT to clean, followed by StyLast. Mind you, the Kleos is still only about 30-40 hours in, so it has some settling time to go, and I'll only really refine the VTA and antiskate once it has settled. As for Kleos vs 501 Mk2, the Kleos is better by a significant margin in many areas, but for the moment it is a tiny bit more "hi-fi" to the sound (as distinct from music). Hoping that resolves with settling in or recalibrating the VTA and antiskate. I may also look to modifying by MiniMax phono further to allow me to experiment with cartridge loading, as the Kleos is optimised for between 93 and 816 ohms, so increasing the load resistance may make a significant difference to the sound. Regards Warren
soundfan Posted July 21, 2013 Posted July 21, 2013 I find this thread amusing. People being able to hear sonic differences of a stylus after getting cleaned by 2 different products? Go figure................. and I don't believe it for a minute. A clean stylus is a clean stylus is a clean stylus. A diamond tip should be dry when it rides the groove. So how the hell can someone hear a sonic difference of a stylus cleaned by 2 different products? 5
Warren M. Posted July 21, 2013 Author Posted July 21, 2013 I find this thread amusing. People being able to hear sonic differences of a stylus after getting cleaned by 2 different products? Go figure................. and I don't believe it for a minute. A clean stylus is a clean stylus is a clean stylus. A diamond tip should be dry when it rides the groove. So how the hell can someone hear a sonic difference of a stylus cleaned by 2 different products? Because everything leaves a residue! And both these products are DESIGNED to leave a residue. In the case of StyLast it is designed to leave a residue which remains for an entire record side at least. And its purpose is to lower the damaging effects of the vinyl on the stylus. StyLast is NOT a cleaner at all. It is a product specifically designed to extend the life of a stylus by a factor of 10. Regards Warren
soundfan Posted July 21, 2013 Posted July 21, 2013 Because everything leaves a residue! And both these products are DESIGNED to leave a residue. In the case of StyLast it is designed to leave a residue which remains for an entire record side at least. And its purpose is to lower the damaging effects of the vinyl on the stylus. StyLast is NOT a cleaner at all. It is a product specifically designed to extend the life of a stylus by a factor of 10. Regards Warren Ok, point taken in regards to styLast not being a cleaner. But I am still not convinced that anything put on the stylus to either clean/protect/whatever will affect sound quality.
metal beat Posted July 21, 2013 Posted July 21, 2013 (edited) Because everything leaves a residue! And both these products are DESIGNED to leave a residue. In the case of StyLast it is designed to leave a residue which remains for an entire record side at least. And its purpose is to lower the damaging effects of the vinyl on the stylus. StyLast is NOT a cleaner at all. It is a product specifically designed to extend the life of a stylus by a factor of 10. Regards Warren Warren You love Hyperbole. lets not get the facts in the way to a good story Lyra SPT is NOT designed to leave a residue. It is designed to clean the stylus - period. Lyra quote LYRA Stylus Performance Treatment (SPT) is a purified water-based, non-alcohol stylus cleaner that helps keep cartridge styli scrupulously clean Your Lyra Kleos cartridge will last for at least 2500 hours when aligned corectly. Are you seriously stating that it will now last for 25,000 hours. See how ludicrous this sounds? Even our resident Stylast fanboi Andy replaces his cartridges every 1000 hours. Andy, your benz will last for at least 10,000 hours cheers Edited July 21, 2013 by turntable
Warren M. Posted July 21, 2013 Author Posted July 21, 2013 Warren You love Hyperbole. lets not get the facts in the way to a good story Lyra SPT is NOT designed to leave a residue. It is designed to clean the stylus - period. Lyra quote Your Lyra Kleos cartridge will last for at least 2500 hours when aligned corectly. Are you seriously stating that it will now last for 25,000 hours. See how ludicrous this sounds? Even our resident Stylast fanboi Andy replaces his cartridges every 1000 hours. Andy, your benz will last for at least 10,000 hours cheers You can look at my 501 Mk2 - it has done about 2000 and looks pretty-well brand new.
metal beat Posted July 21, 2013 Posted July 21, 2013 (edited) I can't afford to believe **** like this. C'mon Candy Buy some Stylast and for $40 your cartridge will last 10 times longer Edited July 21, 2013 by turntable
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