bhobba Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 (edited) Hi Guys I had a pair of ML1 Reference I lent to a guy in the US. Anyway when his time was over with them I thought I might get them reviewed prior to selling them and contacted Steromojo who were happy to oblige. Well they have published the review and here it is: http://www.stereomojo.com/ There seems to be a technical glitch and you can't actually read it right now - but hopefully they will fix it soon. However I can reveal one reviewer, an audio engineer, thought they were hopeless, horrid, he hated them. But another reviewer thought they were the best mini monitors he had ever reviewed and wanted to shout far and wide how good they were - in fact he wanted the magazine to give them its prestigious maximum mojo award. He has many years DIY speaker building experience and has heard and built all sorts of stuff. Really weird hey. You may not like ML1's and that perfectly OK, but to think they are hopeless - that's another matter. It really makes you wonder about some peoples ears. Hopefully the glitch will be fixed soon and we can have a more detailed discussion about what was said. Added Later: Someone found a link that worked - check it out: http://www.stereomojo.com/LENEHAN%20ML1%20REFERENCE%20SPEAKER%20REVIEW/LenehandML1ReferenceSpeaker.htm Thanks Bill Edited June 27, 2013 by bhobba
Guest Muon Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 (edited) Pretty obvious that Bruce Brown is hearing the chain preceding the speakers IMO. Pity...he doesn't list the rest of his components. Edit: Meh...maybe he has other reasons for his review *shrugs* Edited June 27, 2013 by datafone
Cafad Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 Interesting read. Hard to tell exactly what the first guy was on about, it almost seemed like he was hearing something so different to what he was expecting to hear that he just couldn't wrap his head around it. He called them "maybe even polite", I would call them accurate to the point where they can be scathingly critical of the upstream components feeding them, which is a long way from polite. I'd love to know what his upstream gear is. Oh well, you can't please everyone.
Once was an audiophile Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 Pretty obvious that Bruce Brown is hearing the chain preceding the speakers IMO. Pity...he doesn't list the rest of his components. Edit: Meh...maybe he has other reasons for his review *shrugs* Delta sigma dacs with a pc could be a possibility
Guest Muon Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 (edited) Yeah, I don't know, there are a range of reasons of what could cause his negative view. That's why I would be interested in a list of the rest of what he had in the chain/s. Edited June 27, 2013 by datafone
bhobba Posted June 27, 2013 Author Posted June 27, 2013 I would call them accurate to the point where they can be scathingly critical of the upstream components feeding them, which is a long way from polite. I'd love to know what his upstream gear is. Mate that's the interesting thing. I have people over all the time to hear my speakers and have been with plenty of others at GTG's etc with Mikes speakers - and you have been to a couple as well. What's the common thing you hear from people that don't like them - its too dynamic and in your face. John Darko had ML1's for a while and got rid of them because - how did he express it - they were too ultra accurate and revealing. I have never heard anyone say what Bruce said - some don't like them and to be blunt I really couldn't care a shite - other than its interesting to hear the reason - but polite - most definitely they are not polite. At first I thought as a recording engineer he was listening to over bright pro monitors. But he has very well respected, if overpriced (IMHO), Wilsons so he has heard proper gear so maybe they have a sound totally alien to Mikes speakers - just a guess. Rawl99 knows Wilson's very well so maybe he can comment. It's very interesting doesn't matter how you look at it. Thanks Bill
bhobba Posted June 27, 2013 Author Posted June 27, 2013 Interesting read Bill, thanks for posting Mate I have never read anything like it. My response to the publisher was its the most fun and interesting review I have ever read and on that basis alone I am really happy I sent them for review. But it was so strange I sent it to another reviewer before I sell them - his view is like the second guy and it will be very interesting to see exactly what he says. But after that, despite how much fun and interesting this is, I must sell em. Thanks Bill
Braddles 63 Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 Well it's good to see that's its not just here that the ML1 manages to cause conflict. I've never known a speaker that can divide opinion as much as the ML1. 1
Lenehan Audio Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 Hi Guys Bruces results seem very unusual , it would be interesting as datafone says to know what was upstream of the ML1ref's. If there is ever anything negative said about ML1's it's that they are a little analytical and upfront in presentation. This usually can be explained by looking at upstream components as I believe the ML1 is quite transparent to the source. Dagogo has the very same pair of ML1Refs right now ! it will be interesting indeed to hear what they think of the presentation. Regards Mike Lenehan LenehanAudio 1
vic Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 Here at Puget Sound Studios we have the only purpose-built high-end Mastering room in the Pacific Northwest that can record, edit and master multi-track DSD/SACD, DVD-A Surround and Blu-ray projects. Built around the Rupert Neve Masterpiece 2, we have spared no expense in bringing you the best environment and acoustics that a Mastering suite has to offer. We specialize in Audiophile mastering, Archival and Restoration for analog tape, vinyl and digital. Workstation/Monitoring Sonoma DSD workstation Sequoia PCM workstation SADiE DSD/PCM workstation Pyramix 7.0 MassCore DSD/PCM Pass Labs XA-160.5 Pass Labs X-3 Evolution Acoustics Wilson Audio Specialties Playback Designs MPS-5 Grimm Audio AD1/OC1 Digital Audio Denmark AX24 EMM Labs ADC8 IV / DAC8 IV Weiss AD2 MSB Tech Platinum ADC with- Diamond Base Crane Song Avocet Surround EMM Labs Switchman 3 Transport Playback Designs MPS-5 Exempler Modified Oppo BDP-95 Alesis Masterlink Korg MR2000s Tascam DV-RA1000HD Tascam DA-45HR DAT Sony PCM9000 Sony AITI200s Exabyte EXB-88900T EMT 948 with modified vDh cart. Studer A80RC MkII (2) Studer A80VU preview Ampex ATR-102 1/4" and 1/2" with Aria Nakamichi Dragon cassette Cables by JPS Labs, Canare, Mogami Analog Rupert Neve Masterpiece2 Crane Song STC-8M Pendulum OCL-2 Prism MLA-3 Sontec 482C EAR 825 Millennia NSEQ-2F Digital TC Electronic 6000M Weiss DS1-Mk2 Z-Systems Z-16.16 Digital Detangler **Subject to change without notice** http://pugetsoundstudios.com/?q=mastering
vic Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 (edited) New mastering speaker install below, http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?9778-The-Alexia-s-are-HERE! Studio room build, http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?9628-Studio-Build http://www.whatsbestforum.com/forumdisplay.php?235-The-Pro-Audiophile-By-Bruce-Brown Edited June 27, 2013 by vic
gainphile Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 On female vocals, Jacintha in particular, it sounded like she had just drunk a glass of milk. I’m no singer but I think that’s a no-no. Both on speakers and headphones I always thought Jacintha recording is poor at the vocal ranges ? I don't know why audiophiles use them as reference ?
automated Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 (edited) And what has this to do with the thread? He is listing the specs and equipment of the reviewer Bruce Brown's studio. Edited June 27, 2013 by automated
davewantsmoore Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 analytical and upfront IME this is what happens when people get used to speakers with giant "holes" in the response (usually off axis) ... You add back what's missing, and it seems "too much". If the criticism is universal, then of course perhaps something's wrong..... otherwise, you should be almost be tempted to take it as a compliment
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 Inexperienced or brain-damaged reviewers are common throughout the industry. There are very few who can be relied upon to provide intelligent, IMPARTIAL comments on products. I view all reviewers with deep suspicion. 2
gainphile Posted June 27, 2013 Posted June 27, 2013 IME this is what happens when people get used to speakers with giant "holes" in the response (usually off axis) ... You add back what's missing, and it seems "too much". If the criticism is universal, then of course perhaps something's wrong..... otherwise, you should be almost be tempted to take it as a compliment I'm not sure what he meant by 'analytical' and 'upfront'. I assume analytic = no 'warmth' ? Do the speakers (ML1) employ baffle step compensation circuit?
vic Posted June 28, 2013 Posted June 28, 2013 And what has this to do with the thread? The system he review on,thanks auto.
bhobba Posted June 28, 2013 Author Posted June 28, 2013 I'm not sure what he meant by 'analytical' and 'upfront'. I assume analytic = no 'warmth' ? Do the speakers (ML1) employ baffle step compensation circuit? Mike said that. Of course Mike has been with many many more people that listen to his speakers than I have, but in my experience people that don't like them say they are too dynamic (that could be construed as analytical) and have a presentation that is a bit forward (upfront) and in your face - but as the second review said - its not too bad - its not like you feel you are in the front row - but a little back from it. Mike doesn't employ BSC. What you didn't see was the measurements the second reviewer took - he sent them to me - see sattached. They were very good showing nothing to explain the first review. Thanks Bill ml1_on_and_30_deg_off_axis_response.doc
davewantsmoore Posted June 28, 2013 Posted June 28, 2013 Do the speakers (ML1) employ baffle step compensation circuit? Mike doesn't employ BSC Hmmm... Depends on how we define "BSC". The shape/size of the ML1 cabinet has a large effect on the response of the drivers. That is (obviously) accounted for in the design.
bhobba Posted June 28, 2013 Author Posted June 28, 2013 (edited) He is listing the specs and equipment of the reviewer Bruce Brown's studio. The system he review on,thanks auto. Yea - I think we can take it as given his source gear and material he has is beyond reproach. It would come down to the amplification (highly unlikely IMHO - but I mention it anyway) and speakers. By reputation Wilson's are very dry and analitical eg the following is typical - 'I thought the Spectral/Wilson room sounded excellent but agree with most on the very dry, analytic nature of the sound'. If he is used to that then a speaker like the ML1 which most definitely is not dry and analytical (Mikes comment I am pretty sure referred to their dynamics rather than the kind of sound you get with Wilsons) may sound 'strange'. I will give Rawl, who knows Wilson's very well, a tingle to see if he can comment. Thanks Bill Edited June 28, 2013 by bhobba
vic Posted June 28, 2013 Posted June 28, 2013 or on this system Here at Puget Sound Studios, we have a full Recording and Post Production 5.1 Surround suite built around a Pro Tools HD Accel system with Focal monitoring. We also use an Avid and Final Cut Pro video workstations that are compatible with all HD content and Blu-ray. Some of the gear that is available: Workstation/Monitoring Avid Pro Tools 8.0 HD Waves Mercury/SSL 4000 All Sonox plugs All Sonox plugs Digidesign Control24 Digidesign 192 I/O Digital Audio Denmark AX24 Lynx Studio Aurora Focal Twin6 Be L/R Focal Solo6 Be C/LS/RS Focal Sub6 Digidesign Pre Millenni HV3- Great River ME-1NV Transport Playback Designs MPS-5 Alesis Masterlink Signature Oppo BDP-95 Sennheiser HD650 Sony MDR7506 Analog Millennia NSEQ-2 Crane Song STC-8 Chameleon Labs 7720 Video Avid MediaStation Final Cut Pro Studio Autodesk Maya Unlimited Sony Vegas Pro 9 with Blu-ray Sound Forge 9/10 Digidesign Sync I/O DigiDelivery ftp server Avid Mojo Aja Express I/O Canopus ADVC-110 Horita Blackburst Generator Vizio 42" LCD display Vizio 26" LCD display Yamaha C3 Grand Piano Microphones Neumann U-87Ai Neumann KM-184 (2) Cascade Fat Head II stereo pair Cascade X15 stereo ribbon Royer R-121 EV RE20 SE Electronics Z3300A AKG C1000S (2) Shure SM7B, SM 57, SM58 Cheers Victor.
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