Audessey or Dirac or ARC

[kmolth]

Hi guys,

 

Been out of HT news for awhile, and would like to know if there is such thing or conclusion that one system is best currently in terms of home theater format implementation from what I have listed?

 

Audessey is most common and widely adopted, is this the best if money is not part of the equation?

 

Hoping to hear your opinion.

 

Thanks.

 

 

[kopidilo]

I've not used arc, so can't comment. Only dirac and audyssey.

 

Assuming based on a default calibration on both room eq without further manual tweaking, I would say Dirac live is on another level for room eq, about 30% better than audyssey

 

And dirac in a way is simpler to use too with less settings whereas audyssey has many extra settings which sometimes make it confusing for user.

 

But audyssey is easy to tweak on the fly, esp now with the audyssey app where u can load and save different calibrations.

 

If I had a choice between the two in equal conditions, I would pick Dirac live over audyssey easily anytime.

[ronildoq]

Yea I think Sevenz is spot on.

 

What’s most important is getting the calibration process right, that is far more critical. U can use an entry level AVR like the Denon 3600 and with a good calibrator, can yield significantly better results over a high end processor not calibrated by a professional calibrator. They vary significantly. Good calibrators will be able to bring out the best in every process, from sub Optimization to gain optimisation, maximising headroom , blending the system ... many things To name a few

 

That said, there is no “one button solution” where u hit enter, go for coffee, come back and everything sounds good, no such thing! (That’s maybe possible with Lumagen pro for video calibration) . Not even on the supposedly superior room perfect EQ. There is a lot of ground work to be done before and after that

 

But if we are talking algorithms, then Dirac has an advantage here. They are constantly improving and in the newer versionS, we are seeing reports of improvements in the algorithm , a lot more improvement in the timing response and impulse correction. Something very useful but is not present in audyssey

 

Audyssey is dead, there is no more R&D on this, as the chief designer has joined another company and one would have to live with the last version some 2-3 years back. That said, doesn’t mean it is not good. It is still very good , in the hands of a good calibrator, will sound better than a Dirac capable processor in the hands of non professional calibrator

 

That’s just my experience and views

[desray]

I will keep it short...any form of built-in RoomEQ in a AVR will have its limit - Yes, I'm referring to Audyssey here. No need to look far...Yamaha YPAO, Pioneer MCACC, Onkyo laugable AccuEQ. Of the few I have mentioned, Audyssey is STILL the King. Period. But it has its limitation because you can only "fit" in so much processing power inside a AVR, as such "on-the-fly" computation of the algorithm will be it biggest pitfall...that is why D&M worked with Audyssey to come up with a standalone app to allow more granular adjustments to be made AFTER the calibration. This takes the processing power out of the equation...meaning you can now utilize the mobile Audyssey app on your iOS or Android devices to do more complicated tasks and send it over to the AVR via a stable Wi-Fi connection.

 

If you bring the a/m "concept" over to the other 2 RoomEQs - i.e. Anthem ARC Genesis and Dirac Live, you will know why both of them have an "edge" over Audyssey since it utilize a proprietary s/w on a 64-bit processor to do all those complex "on-the-fly" computation of the aggregated number of listening positions etc. I have the privilege to try Anthem ARC Genesis and I will tell you this...ARC and Dirac Live are pretty much on the "same playing field"...I will say ARC has a slight edge over Dirac Live since there are certain Dirac Live suite components (or add-ons like Bass Management module) that you need to consider to get the best out of your HT setup...Anthem ARC Genesis provides it for FREE and it is COMPLETE suite.

 

While it seems like I am favoring Anthem over Dirac-based AVRs like NAD, ARCAM, AudioControl AVR etc...but I can't recommend Anthem (at this moment) - their last generation - i.e. 520/720 & 1120 models have already passed its EOS period for any piece of technology...it lacks many key features like bluetooth, MQA, support of prominent streaming apps, HDMI 2.1 and the list goes...its last tech refresh was nearly 4.5yrs ago!!! Until Anthem release a new model that comes with all the bells and whistles (latest tech), I will not recommend Anthem ARC even though I am totally floored by the sonic performance of Anthem's proprietary RoomEQ s/w which I think is one of the BEST and yet "affordable" consumer-grade RoomEQ you can find now...the keyword here is "affordable"...hence Lnydorf's RoomEQ Perfect and Trinnov EQ are out of the picture here.

 

My take is...if you can wait, go for Anthem ARC Genesis (my first choice) with a caveat - you must get the latest model and likely by end of this year or early next year, Anthem will probably release the latest MRX AVR series (I can't wait to get my hands on one). Alternatively, if you can't wait, go for AVR that come equipped with Dirac Live - a good one will be NAD T778 for consideration and lastly Audyssey MultXT32 AVR like Denon X8500H which has the best in class hardware (raw power) and superb clean sound! Audyssey is but a tool, proper speaker and subwoofer placements within your MLP is the KEY (> 70%) while RoomEQ will solve about 30% or less. HT, unlike Hi-Fi, isn't about how much $$$ you spent on a certain piece of AV gears but rather how well you understand the fundamentals and literally put it into work to get the best results!

[kopidilo]

+1 on the impt factor of price point. We can get avr with audyssey at much lower price point vs Dirac. Cheapest avr with Dirac live is Nad T758. Many other Dirac avr cost 2-3 times price of a good jap avr w audyssey. Question is, if we spend 2-3 times more, are we getting 2-3 times more the perf. This is something I struggle with when I wanted to buy audio control or arcam.

 

I still have a very strong affinity and loyalty to audyssey becoz it journeyed with me since day 1 of my hobby and the price is vfm. My next project (which I hv no time for) is to use manual tweaking and calibration to see if I can bring the audyssey avr performance close to Dirac's. But I must admit dirac gives great outcomes in terms of the HT sound inmersion n bass integration, hard to beat. Getting 80-90% close would be a good target for me.

 

[ronildoq]

Hi guys,

 

Been out of HT news for awhile, and would like to know if there is such thing or conclusion that one system is best currently in terms of home theater format implementation from what I have listed?

 

Audessey is most common and widely adopted, is this the best if money is not part of the equation?

 

Hoping to hear your opinion.

 

Thanks.

 

If money is not part of the equation, I will tell you from my experience, room perfect is the best room eq software out there

 

I’d rate the room eq software in this order from my personal experience (assuming same calibration skills) , as I’ve used these software in my room, in my hall in fact.

 

YPAO , accueq , audyssey, Dirac live, room perfect

 

The most challenging aspect is Bass. That is extremely challenging . Room perfect does the best job because of the algorithm’s focus on power response , integration and time. It also has something called “physchoacoustic bass steering”, a very special feature on how the processor does processing for bass, very Unique indeed. This feature is what sets it apart from the pack. Superb bass management

 

Anthem should be good as well pointed out by Desray above, but I’ve not had the chance to try it.i have received feedbacks from various users it does seem  to work better, compared to audyssey

 

It’s a good question really, because there are 1001 reviews out there. Almost all reviews will put a 5 stars ️ on those product. So this is the right place to ask, as u can hear it from the horse mouth, people who have actually used it and they can share their experience

 

 

[Guest jonlee]

What's the price of a NAD T778?

[desray]

What's the price of a NAD T778?

 

https://www.lenbrook.com.sg/collections/nad-classic-series/products/nad-t-778

 

should be cheaper...

[rayleh]

Take note that all the NAD AVR will not be able to integrate with the new Dirac Bass Module. Like what Ron have said, lower frequency is the most difficult to EQ and manage.

[ralfale]

From my personal experience, the dirac bass management module really UP the game of dirac. Pretty significant in results. The software has also evolved to become very simple to use like audyssey but yet is is very configurable.

[kenshin07]

Hi

 

Just want to check with those using NAD avr dirac live user. After running dirac live calibration and uploaded the profile. Are you still able to increase the volume of individual channel?

[domj]

Hi

 

Just want to check with those using NAD avr dirac live user. After running dirac live calibration and uploaded the profile. Are you still able to increase the volume of individual channel?

You can adjust for centre and surr (all surr together) but the avr won’t save the settings after you switch it off. I have not felt the need to adjust the individual volumes unlike my old Pioneer where I had to bump up the centre and surrounds.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[kenshin07]

You can adjust for centre and surr (all surr together) but the avr won’t save the settings after you switch it off. I have not felt the need to adjust the individual volumes unlike my old Pioneer where I had to bump up the centre and surrounds.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

Thanks for clarifying.

[ronildoq]

Take note that all the NAD AVR will not be able to integrate with the new Dirac Bass Module. Like what Ron have said, lower frequency is the most difficult to EQ and manage.

 

Oh is that so ? I thought NAD is always the first to get these updates

 

The new bass management from Dirac looks promising ... looking forward to further reviews from forums, particularly the audio control using the Sabre dacs 9038 pro, that one looks very promising

[desray]

My next upgrade will either be the new Anthem MRX series with ARC Genesis or Dirac Live with BM.

[kenshin07]

I have not felt the need to adjust the individual volumes unlike my old Pioneer where I had to bump up the centre and surrounds.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

Maybe that me, i like to further enhance the center, surr and atmos level. I noticed most atmos channel level doesnt sound too pronounced after the auto run / calibration that why i have to bump up a few db more.

Want to adjust to my preference level.

[econav]

Maybe that me, i like to further enhance the center, surr and atmos level. I noticed most atmos channel level doesnt sound too pronounced after the auto run / calibration that why i have to bump up a few db more.

Want to adjust to my preference level.

For full liz dirac , all version can do every channel by software then transfer into a slot .

User can also pre-define the gain on the AVR/ processor itself that will not affect the EQ , but is personal preference , as it hv a reserve headroom of 6db.

[econav]

That is no point comparing a calibration process using AVR and make judgement base on that , As inside all AVR there is amp and every amp has it own sound signature .

 

AVR example :

Current  Top Marantz AVR vs Denon AVR both using the exact same Audy eq processor and share the same HDMI pcb but the sense of immersion feel is totally dif ????.why ????

Arcam , AudioCobtrol, Lexican all share the same HDMI board and using the same dirac process , but the 3 also sounded dif and dif in immersive feel ....

I connected both pre-out of Marantz and Denon to same external amp and same speaker and done audy at same location , the result ? you can come to my workshop and listen for yourself .

 

Comparison should be carry out with same amp and same speaker at the same location setting , and the only dif in the chain should be a processor ( act as a pre and decoding device ), then the result of each calibration of Ady/ARC/RP/ Dirac are fed to the same down chain , this is the only way to listen to how each SW carry out the EQ and integration of all the channel and the result is very very clear .

[kmolth]

Thanks everyone for all your valuable opinions and observations through actual experience.

 

I have been using Audessey for quite a few years, think my current processor Marantz 8802 is maybe 7 or 8 years. Tried in the past Pioneer LX90 before the current Marantz, preferred the 8802 obviously it was an upgrade then. Now that I have all the multichannel power amps, I need to look for a new processor and also likely adding Atmos channel etc. Been reading a bit before I post and Dirac seem to be quite interesting or good, but thats is just reading off the net not that I hear it actually.

 

I am also thinking of going back to projector and screen set up as the 75" LED tv just don't have the visual I remember when I had my JVC.

 

This is still early stage of my renew interest to get back and built something slowly to what I like.

 

For processor based setup I don't have many choice I think, and I don't want to spend too much too. The question "if post if is not money a concern is just hear what you guys think is best" Obviously there are very good engine beyond dirac/audessey range but it seem if I want something within this year Dirac seem a good bet. I always like to try something new!

 

So far I read about 8805 from Marantz, NAD and Arcam, the later 2 is Dirac. Don't seem a lot more of processor I think.

 

Yes, I agree totally that calibration is very important and tweaking it, not just press a button and come back 5 mins later.

 

My plan:

Currently, I am doing sound insulation door by door and am getting quite good result. Once this done I need to shift my current big subwoofer to a new location to make way for a bit more room for my front speakers. With this shifted, I hope I can put in a 100" 16-9 screen and PJ. I used to have PJ and miss that, the experience is just another world. Add 2 rear channel, but must be slim tower speaker. This will be a slow project for me, so it will keep me engage for a while and see improvement bit by bit .

 

Looking for a good contractor that know wiring well ( HT and 230wiring) and renovation, any one can recommend?

 

Thanks everyone again and appreciate you guys.

[rayleh]

Besides NAD and Arcam, there is also Audio Control AVR which comes with Dirac and the new BM module.

[rock123]

That is no point comparing a calibration process using AVR and make judgement base on that , As inside all AVR there is amp and every amp has it own sound signature .

 

AVR example :

Current  Top Marantz AVR vs Denon AVR both using the exact same Audy eq processor and share the same HDMI pcb but the sense of immersion feel is totally dif ????.why ????

Arcam , AudioCobtrol, Lexican all share the same HDMI board and using the same dirac process , but the 3 also sounded dif and dif in immersive feel ....

I connected both pre-out of Marantz and Denon to same external amp and same speaker and done audy at same location , the result ? you can come to my workshop and listen for yourself .

 

Comparison should be carry out with same amp and same speaker at the same location setting , and the only dif in the chain should be a processor ( act as a pre and decoding device ), then the result of each calibration of Ady/ARC/RP/ Dirac are fed to the same down chain , this is the only way to listen to how each SW carry out the EQ and integration of all the channel and the result is very very clear .

 

Agree :)

 

Whether it is Audessey or Dirac or ARC,  it's self preference on the AVR\AVP brand\specs\sound signature that one like. :)

 

[rayleh]

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/nad-t778-audio-video-receiver-avr-review.15643/

 

For those interested in NAD T778

[Guest jonlee]

Hi.  May I ask if system only consists of a single sub and all speakers are “small”, the need for the Dirac base control module will be less?

[Raylim76]

5 hours ago, jonlee said:

if system only consists of a single sub and all speakers are “small”, the need for the Dirac base control module will be less?

 

No true...you will still benefit. In fact, more important considering one subwoofer response will always almost be less than ideal compared to a duo subwoofer setup.

[Guest jonlee]

1 hour ago, Raylim76 said:

 

No true...you will still benefit. In fact, more important considering one subwoofer response will always almost be less than ideal compared to a duo subwoofer setup.

Tks for the view. No doubt it will also benefit single sub+small speakers setup, but the benefit will be less?  
 

Am I correct to put the benefit in decreasing order as follows:

 

 1. Multi sub

2. single sub + full range speakers

3. single sub + small speakers 

Edited March 14, 2021 by jonlee