Denon Salesman at Courts told me this.. How true is it?

[tempcroupier]

Hi there, I'm new to the world of AVRs and audiophiles. However, I like a good sound and I've been reading the forums extensively and also been to Audio House, Courts, Harvey Norman for auditions.

 

I'm quite set on getting the Denon AVR-X2200W for my 4NG HDB flat in AMK. This will be my first AVR and I will be using it mainly to watch movies. I really like its cinema-like sound.

 

I was thinking of getting floor-standing speakers with the AVR-X2200W. However, one Denon salesman at Courts told me that if I do get floorstanding speakers, the low frequencies and exciting moments in the movies might sound good, but when it comes to dialogue, it would be too soft to hear clearly. And if we adjust the volume so that the dialogue can be heard, the bass at the action moments would be too overpowering.

 

I have a friend who has tower speakers and he experiences the same thing. Throughout the movie, he has to turn the volume up and down so as not to disturb the neighbours.

 

I definitely do not want to do that, so I am wondering if what the Denon guy said is true? Or is it not true, and perhaps my friend just did not do a proper set-up for his set?

 

Thank you so much in advance for all the advice. And happy new year guys! :)

[composition]

I have a Denon AVR and i dont have this issue.

[Doggie Howser]

It's also the case in the cinemas. A good dynamic range in a movie means there will be quiet passages and loud action sequences.

 

It's just that at home, we have to cap the loudness in order not to disturb the neighbours.

 

Dolby and Audyssey both have EQ options to minimise such disparities for home use. But to be honest, I'd rather not use them.

[S1chen]

Hi there, I'm new to the world of AVRs and audiophiles. However, I like a good sound and I've been reading the forums extensively and also been to Audio House, Courts, Harvey Norman for auditions.

 

I'm quite set on getting the Denon AVR-X2200W for my 4NG HDB flat in AMK. This will be my first AVR and I will be using it mainly to watch movies. I really like its cinema-like sound.

 

I was thinking of getting floor-standing speakers with the AVR-X2200W. However, one Denon salesman at Courts told me that if I do get floorstanding speakers, the low frequencies and exciting moments in the movies might sound good, but when it comes to dialogue, it would be too soft to hear clearly. And if we adjust the volume so that the dialogue can be heard, the bass at the action moments would be too overpowering.

 

I have a friend who has tower speakers and he experiences the same thing. Throughout the movie, he has to turn the volume up and down so as not to disturb the neighbours.

 

I definitely do not want to do that, so I am wondering if what the Denon guy said is true? Or is it not true, and perhaps my friend just did not do a proper set-up for his set?

 

Thank you so much in advance for all the advice. And happy new year guys! :)

 

You need to add the centre speaker. This will only happen when you are playing DVD/BlueRay disc with DTS, Dolby etc which it have surround sound information. They will have the dialog from the centre speaker and other sound from the front and rear.

 

Otherwise, if you only want to get front speaker without center, you need the AVR that have phantom mode which It will sure the front speaker to also get the dialog in the proper manner. Note that phantom mode in average AVR is not as good as adding a center speaker. Those superb AVR that have good Phantom are normally those expensive version like Theta, top of the line Pioneer...etc

[composition]

The Denon 7200 looks good. Maybe time for me to upgrade from my ageing 4810.

[Musicalitea]

I have a Denon AVR and i dont have this issue.

 

Is your name Luca and do I live next door to you? ;D

[composition]

Is your name Luca and do I live next door to you? ;D

 

Haha knock on the door and u will know.

[calamity]

Assuming you're not using center speaker.

 

If you use a good pair of floor standers, you will hear the dialogue along with everything else very clearly no matter what, loud volume, very very soft volume.

 

Hope this helps.

 

... The denon salesman may be saying what he said based on average floor standing speakers. Everything people say in Hifi or HT is relative.

[tempcroupier]

Thanks for the reply guys. Yes, there is a center speaker in my friends set-up (5.1). In the Denon showroom, the set up was also 5.1

 

I guess the general consensus is that if i get a decent 5.1 set with front floor-standing speakers, even if the volume is on low, the dialogue should still be heard right?

[calamity]

Thanks for the reply guys. Yes, there is a center speaker in my friends set-up (5.1). In the Denon showroom, the set up was also 5.1

 

I guess the general consensus is that if i get a decent 5.1 set with front floor-standing speakers, even if the volume is on low, the dialogue should still be heard right?

 

There's a quick fix if you have a center speaker. Turn up the volume of the center speaker only.

[S1chen]

Thanks for the reply guys. Yes, there is a center speaker in my friends set-up (5.1). In the Denon showroom, the set up was also 5.1

 

I guess the general consensus is that if i get a decent 5.1 set with front floor-standing speakers, even if the volume is on low, the dialogue should still be heard right?

 

If u have a 5.1, there is a microphone that come with avr and u can use the auto setup in the AVR or use your own ear to setup with the build in test tone for the 5.1.

 

In conclusion, if u have a center speaker，the dialogue is not affected by the main speaker. The bigger the main, the better the sound. Just ensure the AVR have enough power to driver the main speaker. Also, u don't want to end up with those mini 2" cone center but u use a 8" main speaker. It will be size mismatch.

[...1624705943]

I will give you a cost effective way of buying high end electronics but at very sane prices

google dared dv6c, one of the best deals for multi-channel,http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/dared4/dared.html

you can use the savings to buy a better Universal player, like the Oppo

[...1624705943]

there used to be a dared distributor here, and he sold this at $470

[desray]

 

I was thinking of getting floor-standing speakers with the AVR-X2200W. However, one Denon salesman at Courts told me that if I do get floorstanding speakers, the low frequencies and exciting moments in the movies might sound good, but when it comes to dialogue, it would be too soft to hear clearly. And if we adjust the volume so that the dialogue can be heard, the bass at the action moments would be too overpowering.

 

I have a friend who has tower speakers and he experiences the same thing. Throughout the movie, he has to turn the volume up and down so as not to disturb the neighbours.

 

I definitely do not want to do that, so I am wondering if what the Denon guy said is true? Or is it not true, and perhaps my friend just did not do a proper set-up for his set?

 

Thank you so much in advance for all the advice. And happy new year guys! :)

 

Let me sum it up for you - getting a floorstanders will NOT affect the overall sound fidelity of the 5.1 setup IF properly calibrated. The key in HT speaker setup is to get the basics and foundation right first. FWIW I would encourage you to get all bookshelf speakers of the same brand for timbre and tonal matching but that's just me. Floorstanders will be a good choice if you intend to use for occassional stereo indulgence like listening to 2 channel CD playback from a dedicated CD player. The floorstanders will provide good amount of bass that is lacking in the smaller brethren - i.e. bookshelf speakers. Ask yourself this question, "are you a 100% movie person?" The choice is then clear for you.

 

Center speaker will be the "preferred" channel for all dialogue reproduction. Period. For "phantom" center channel to work really well, there are more variables to consider than just reasons like, "I have no space to place my center speaker as it will block my TV viewing" or "since I can't get a good placement to lock in the center channel and get crappy sound out of it, might as well do away with it" and other reasons. Center channel is a "discrete" channel and contributed around 70% to the HT experience in your home. I hope you are not going to do away with a center speaker here.

 

Next, proper calibration is important, don't go easy way out by simply calibrating for the baseline or the minimum. Go for full set of calibration at various seating positions in your entertainment space/area so as to give the AVR a proper set of values to get the best mean results for the seating area.

 

The issue with floorstander that might "muddled" the sound stage is true IF you did not do it properly.

 

Below are some of the steps to get it right.

 

1) Set the speaker size to 'Small' [the physical size of the speakers here does not matter - this is to ensure all LFE (bass effects) will be channelled to the subwoofer to handle instead of the floorstanders]

 

2) Ensure proper placement of your subwoofer (many failed to realize that it is the subwoofer that is causing the entire HT surround experience to screw up. A poor placement and sub-standard subwoofer can do MORE HARM than you give credit for...placement is everything, get the foundation right and the rest of the speakers will be a "walk-in-the-park") - hint: do a search for subwoofer crawl in this forum for more details.

 

3) After calibration is done, go to the crossover setting and ensure that the floorstanders and the center speaker channels are set set at around 60Hz - 80Hz for the floorstanders and around 80Hz for the center channel. The rest of the speakers - i.e. your surround/surround back will be set around 80Hz - 90Hz. (take note that this is a ball-park figure assuming your setup comes with 2 floorstanders, a center speaker and the surround speakers are bookshelf speakers)

 

This is the abridged version for you...of course there are many more things involved but let's get the basics right first. You may come back to us again for advice and we'll help you out with the fine-tuning.

 

Hope it helps... ;)

 

 

[desray]

there used to be a dared distributor here, and he sold this at $470

 

Did it ever occur to you that the TS might need the AVR to act as a switcher for various HDMI sources? Does Dared able to provide that?

 

[...1624705943]

Did it ever occur to you that the TS might need the AVR to act as a switcher for various HDMI sources? Does Dared able to provide that?

 

need you take this tone? did good manners on conducting a decent conversation ever occur to you?

No, the oppo can do that, if that's what you were wondering about,being a Universal player

[desray]

need you take this tone? did good manners on conducting a decent conversation ever occur to you?

No, the oppo can do that, if that's what you were wondering about,being a Universal player

 

What's wrong with my tone? You can sense hostility in my "tone"?

 

[desray]

there used to be a dared distributor here, and he sold this at $470

 

I think you are referring to AnalogAudiolabs

 

[tempcroupier]

Wow desray, thank you very much for your detailed reply. It was immensely helpful!

 

Yes, I am nearly a 100% movie person. And I am not planning on doing away with the center speaker. I know its important.

 

The calibration steps you highlighted were very helpful to a newbie such as myself as well. Thank you for them. I had to google subwoofer crawl and even crossover to learn what they meant!

 

So at the moment, I am more or less set on purchasing the Denon AVR-X2200W. I want to pair it with 5.1 or 5.1.2 speakers. And I would like the front speakers to be floor standing.

 

My friend owns a JBL LX7 pair of floorstanders and also a JBL center speaker. However, they are old and I cant find much information on them online. I think they are from the 1990s. He is willing to give them to me, should I want them for my HT. However, I am uncertain if I should accept and use them. Or would I be better off buying a new 5.1 (with floorstanding) speakers.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated :) Thank you!

[treesmaker]

Its not true. The setup will automatically set the correct volume for each channel.

[desray]

Wow desray, thank you very much for your detailed reply. It was immensely helpful!

 

Yes, I am nearly a 100% movie person. And I am not planning on doing away with the center speaker. I know its important.

 

The calibration steps you highlighted were very helpful to a newbie such as myself as well. Thank you for them. I had to google subwoofer crawl and even crossover to learn what they meant!

 

So at the moment, I am more or less set on purchasing the Denon AVR-X2200W. I want to pair it with 5.1 or 5.1.2 speakers. And I would like the front speakers to be floor standing.

 

My friend owns a JBL LX7 pair of floorstanders and also a JBL center speaker. However, they are old and I cant find much information on them online. I think they are from the 1990s. He is willing to give them to me, should I want them for my HT. However, I am uncertain if I should accept and use them. Or would I be better off buying a new 5.1 (with floorstanding) speakers.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated :) Thank you!

 

You are most welcome...all the best in your quest to setup your dream HT.

 

[desray]

Its not true. The setup will automatically set the correct volume for each channel.

 

Yes, treemaker is right. During calibration, the Audyssey will try to adjust the trim levels for each individual speakers to have the same SPL. On top of that, even if you mix and match with other brands of speakers (with fairly similar characteristics in sonic quality), it will still sound good. For more details on Audyssey setup and getting the best out of it. Visit this Audyssey 101 which I have created in the past for future reference - http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=152738.0

 

 

[foxz15]

Another option. .. try to buy an Amp with Pre out ... so that u can upgrade to Power Amp if needed .. so u wouldn't stuck with it if u need upgrade for power to drive your future speaker when u need it ... enjoy and have fun

[DJQ]

haha bro fox, dun scare and poison TS yet. he is still learning and want his basic HT setup done right. eventually he will upgrade as his HT senses improve as to what else can be done. its a journey, but also a fact half of the HT bros here just keep their HT to the bare basics. every speaker powered by the AVR itself.

[foxz15]

Bro DJQ, yap true agree