Bugs Posted September 12, 2012 Posted September 12, 2012 What is the general rule of thumb regarding setting volume levels when you have a CD Player running through a DAC with adjustable output, into a PRE AMP with volume control into a POWER AMP with volume controls?.At present I run the DAC at two thirds output and the POWER AMP at max and adjust the sound level I want with the PRE AMP. I'm happy with the sound quality but if it can be improved with a bit of tweeking than that's even better! Cheers every one......Bugs
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted September 12, 2012 Volunteer Posted September 12, 2012 If your power amp has a volume control why not try removing the preamp altogether ans see how that goes.
Bomber Rock Posted September 12, 2012 Posted September 12, 2012 I set the gain on my power amp so that 12 o'clock on the pre amp is my comfortable listening position.
Grainy Posted September 12, 2012 Posted September 12, 2012 I was reading about this recently in regard to pre and power amp. I found a suggestion you set your power amp to a level where the pre is set very high, say 90% when at the maximum volume you would listen at. This gives you the best signal to noise ratio...... Did I regurgitate someone else's theory ok? I was worried about running my pre at near max, so my power amp is set to about 25% so my pre is about 75% at the maximum level I would listen at. I like it better than running the power at 100%. Its not a hard thing to play around with yourself. I'd have your sources volumes set at 100%, but no real theory as to why, I guess it's its based on my main source being a PC and not wanting to loose any quality.
LuzArt Posted September 12, 2012 Posted September 12, 2012 (edited) I was reading about this recently in regard to pre and power amp. I found a suggestion you set your power amp to a level where the pre is set very high, say 90% when at the maximum volume you would listen at. This gives you the best signal to noise ratio...... Did I regurgitate someone else's theory ok? I was worried about running my pre at near max, so my power amp is set to about 25% so my pre is about 75% at the maximum level I would listen at. I like it better than running the power at 100%. Its not a hard thing to play around with yourself. I'd have your sources volumes set at 100%, but no real theory as to why, I guess it's its based on my main source being a PC and not wanting to loose any quality. A number of us on here use attenuators between the source and preamp and enjoy a better sound, less cluttered, more space between instruments etc. I have a pre that has both input pots and output pots and an output control, and I run the input pots at around 11 o'clock, which is around 2 volts, which is what my power amp is rated at on it's input. For my headamp, I use inline attenuators, same effect, you're controlling the level of the source before it hits the preamp. It makes a world of difference, why not try it and see what differences you can hear. Edited September 12, 2012 by LuzArt
andyr Posted September 12, 2012 Posted September 12, 2012 What is the general rule of thumb regarding setting volume levels when you have a CD Player running through a DAC with adjustable output, into a PRE AMP with volume control into a POWER AMP with volume controls?.At present I run the DAC at two thirds output and the POWER AMP at max and adjust the sound level I want with the PRE AMP. I'm happy with the sound quality but if it can be improved with a bit of tweeking than that's even better! Cheers every one......Bugs As you can see from the responses, there is no "rule of thumb"! My position comes from the belief that all volume controls degrade the sound - so, if you can't physically remove them, set them at "max" (which effectively takes them out of circuit) apart from the preamp. So I personally would set the power amp volume control at max, if I couldn't remove it. In terms of your DAC/pre combo, you say you run the DAC at 2/3rds output and adjust the sound level you want with the PRE AMP. Seeing as you have 2 volume controls in play, I don't think it will make any difference to SQ whether you set the DAC volume control to 2/3 or 3/4; I suggest the DAC volume control should be used to set its output to the same level as your other sources. (If you don't have any other sources then you might like to experiment with removing your pre, as you're not making any use of the other function of a pre (apart from volume control) which is source selection. ) Regards, Andy
andyr Posted September 12, 2012 Posted September 12, 2012 A number of us on here use attenuators between the source and preamp and enjoy a better sound, less cluttered, more space between instruments etc. I'm interested to know why you think lowering the input volume to the preamp results in a better, less cluttered sound with more space between instruments? Regards, Andy
LuzArt Posted September 12, 2012 Posted September 12, 2012 (edited) I'm interested to know why you think lowering the input volume to the preamp results in a better, less cluttered sound with more space between instruments? Regards, Andy Many sources today are too hot, too high a voltage and overdrive the pre stage, ie the pre stage of an integrated, a preamp, receiver etc It's relative to the input rating of your pre stage. For example my CS2 has input trim pots. When I turn these right up and lower the volume pot (when using headphones for example, as the output trim pots are bypassed when using cans) the sound is overdriven, cluttered, too much happening. When you go the other way, it opens up. Similarly the Lyr's input stage (therefore pre stage) is overdriven with the 2V from the Metrum, attenuation of 10db makes a very pleasant difference. The Rotel integrated I owned, same thing, can't turn up volume above 10 o'clock, attenuators in, volume knob can go up, the soundstage opens up and it's more pleasing. Try some. Edited September 12, 2012 by LuzArt
Grainy Posted September 13, 2012 Posted September 13, 2012 As you can see from the responses, there is no "rule of thumb"! Yeah, there's so many way to skin the audio cat..... Many sources today are too hot, too high a voltage and overdrive the pre stage, ie the pre stage of an integrated, a preamp, receiver etc It's relative to the input rating of your pre stage. I reckon my DAC runs "a bit hot" so will give it a try, thanks.
andyr Posted September 13, 2012 Posted September 13, 2012 Many sources today are too hot, too high a voltage and overdrive the pre stage, ie the pre stage of an integrated, a preamp, receiver etc It's relative to the input rating of your pre stage. For example my CS2 has input trim pots. When I turn these right up and lower the volume pot (when using headphones for example, as the output trim pots are bypassed when using cans) the sound is overdriven, cluttered, too much happening. When you go the other way, it opens up. Similarly the Lyr's input stage (therefore pre stage) is overdriven with the 2V from the Metrum, attenuation of 10db makes a very pleasant difference. The Rotel integrated I owned, same thing, can't turn up volume above 10 o'clock, attenuators in, volume knob can go up, the soundstage opens up and it's more pleasing. Try some. Aah, thanks, LuzArt - yes that makes sense. But I can assure you my system does not suffer from over-driven inputs. Regards, Andy
Jventer Posted September 13, 2012 Posted September 13, 2012 I dont have a volume control on my power amps. I do use pre outs from AVR into a pre/dac with volume control. I used the volume control on the AVR with the pre/dac on maximum.Through further research I have read that on my pre/dac it is recommended that the volume should be set at about 80% and not max.
Bugs Posted September 18, 2012 Author Posted September 18, 2012 Thanks everone, it seems that running the DAC at about 3/4 level is the max level before it starts to sound a bit harsh to me.The Power Amp at 100% and fine tune the level with the Pre Amp, sounds the best to my ears. The reason I don't run the DAC direct to the Power Amp is 'cos I need the bass managament capabilty for my sub.Thanks again for your advice.....Bugs
olderas Posted September 23, 2012 Posted September 23, 2012 If your power amp has a volume control why not try removing the preamp altogether ans see how that goes. Interested to know if you get better sound this way. Being a bit of a minimalist myself, the thought of less electronics in the way sounds attractive. I tried this with a Wadia DAC using the digital volume control on the DAC straight into power amps, and it wasn't great. I have heard it said, "a good preamp rounds out the sound" or something to that effect. Similarly a passive "preamp" didn't sound great. I wonder if it isn't all about impedance matching, or being able to "drive" the power amp? I suspect there are some components suited to this setup, and others not?
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