Bureaucratic Warranties

[bhobba]

Hi Guys

Just a quick post to gather peoples thoughts about what they think of the hoops you need to go through to actually activate a warranty.

I won't name the product right now but it is very expensive. I got it and thought for a product like this everything was set as far as warranty goes and sat down to actually enjoy the product. But an issue came up that caused me to look a bit further into the user manual and noticed the following - your product is warrantied for 30 days from purchase. WHAT - a product this expensive only warrantied for 30 days - gees I had past that already. Then I read a bit further. If you sent them a sales receipt and jumped through a few other hoops in that 30 day period they will warranty it for three years. Well it looks like that's gone for me and my 3 year warranty is out.

What do people think of this type of carry on with expensive high end gear? I would have thought the dealer would have handled this sort of stuff - am I being naive?

The other thing is I have started emails with the company concerned about it and can tell you they are rather snarky to me in their replies so far - but to be fair I have not been what you would call sweetness and light to them about the issue - and the original issue that caused me to check the user manual - this was largely due to the fact they didn't get back to me about it - although they now claim they did. I will not name the company concerned until its all finalised by which time, hopefully, I can report a positive outcome, but from my perspective the whole thing is leaving a sour taste in my mouth.

Thanks

Bill

Edited September 3, 2012 by bhobba

[Addicted to music]

I sympathise for you Bill, what a way to catch peaple out and to get out of supporting a product!!! :mad: Makes me friggin angry at no end definately not good for business. Normally you would be advised on the warranty period. I would give consumer affairs a call to see what is legal in Queensland as the consumer laws are different in each state or can be, I could be wrong and be greatful if someone corrects me!

Edited: Thank Goodness, I just checked the warranty on the M51, it comes with a 2yr warranty!!! Im relieved!

Edited September 3, 2012 by pchan

[aechmea]

Hi Bill,

Reading between the lines, I guess that you bought your item overseas rather than in Aus - in which case I have no idea.

However if you bought in Australia then there are consumer laws that apply irrespective of warranties and guarantees from the manufacturer/distributor. I understand that the consumer laws are national but your state's "Dept of Fair Trading" equivalent may also have an interest in applying the law.

http://www.accc.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/956980

[bhobba]

Thanks for your support.

But to be fair it was in black and white in the user manual - it's just I didn't read it until another issue popped up. Still for a product this expensive I would have thought the dealer (who is not in Queensland so I don't know what states consumer laws apply) would have handled letting the company know this bureaucratic stuff to activate the warranty - at least send a follow up email to me making me aware of what I should do. It also an overseas company that makes the product and who you must register it with so I have zero idea what the legalities are.

I didn't have any of these issues with my WFS DAC when it developed an issue - both the dealer and manufacturer were simply beyond reproach helping me at every turn. I hasten to add the product is working flawlessly - it's just I did not expect to have to go through these hoops.

Thanks

Bill

[bhobba]

Reading between the lines, I guess that you bought your item overseas rather than in Aus - in which case I have no idea. However if you bought in Australia then there are consumer laws that apply irrespective of warranties and guarantees from the manufacturer/distributor. I understand that the consumer laws are national but your state's "Dept of Fair Trading" equivalent may also have an interest in applying the law.

http://www.accc.gov....l/itemId/956980

I bought it from a dealer here in Australia - but not in Queensland.

The product is engineered to a very high standard and I doubt it will ever actually give any trouble - it's just I don't like the whole 'vibe' of the thing. It should be a lot easier IMHO for such an expensive high end product. Every other audiophile product I got such as the WFS DAC has been a lot different - they could not do more for you regarding customer support - but this company seems different. I hasten to point out its not the Australian distributor I am having troubles with - they are the next port of call if I am still having problems - and the story I hear about them is they offer superb customer service - it's just the manufacturer so far.

Thanks

Bill

[GSpot]

Then I read a bit further. If you sent them a sales receipt and jumped through a few other hoops in that 30 day period they will warranty it for three years. Well it looks like that's gone for me and my 3 year warranty is out.

Edited: Thank Goodness, I just checked the warranty on the M51, it comes with a 2yr warranty!!! Im relieved!

Gents,

the warranties mentioned by the manufacturer are minimum warranties. The consumer laws in most states will cover you for more than 30 days if it's a new expensive item purchased locally etc. Tell your retailer to read the consumer laws. Then post the name of the prats because these people should be named and shamed.

[cfcjb]

Sounds like your Playback Designs player/DAC has gone south.

Usually American companies will bend over backward to help. I would presume that given the chunk of change you've spent and that fact that you bought it through their dealer network, that you should have no problems. I'm guessing I'm not so right.

[kdoot]

Bill, if you purchased from an Australian company then I'm pretty sure that Australian law gives you the basic level of protection you would expect, ie at least 12 months of remedy (repair/replace/refund at their discretion). Mind you, it's the local agent who would be legally responsible, not the overseas manufacturer.

[bhobba]

Sounds like your Playback Designs player/DAC has gone south.

Usually American companies will bend over backward to help. I would presume that given the chunk of change you've spent and that fact that you bought it through their dealer network, that you should have no problems. I'm guessing I'm not so right.

Well I wasn't going to name it - but it was the PD.

No its working flawlessly and the more I use it the more I like it. It is engineered extremely well and I doubt it will ever give problems.

The issue is the attitude they have taken towards me in correspondence. It has been snarky and oriented towards getting me to jump through their hoops rather than address the issue I had. They didn't respond to that issue (although they now claim they did - well I never got the response) but it fixed itself ages ago. The issue now is the attitude they are taking towards me regarding registration. They just keep with the mantra - register it before we do anything.

Thanks

Bill

Edited September 3, 2012 by bhobba

[bhobba]

Bill, if you purchased from an Australian company then I'm pretty sure that Australian law gives you the basic level of protection you would expect, ie at least 12 months of remedy (repair/replace/refund at their discretion). Mind you, it's the local agent who would be legally responsible, not the overseas manufacturer.

Bingo. That seems to be the answer. I will simply correspond with the local agent in future and give the company a big miss. Their whole attitude towards me as far as I am concerned stunk.

Thanks

Bill

[cfcjb]

Hey Bill. I'm with Kdoot. Go thru Warwick at Pure Music Group. He's a stand up fella and will get what ever you need done, also register it thru him if you can.

It's pretty dispiriting when you deal with a company and they treat you like an after thought. It has happened to me as well.

Edited September 3, 2012 by cfcjb

[Willco]

I also agree with Kdoot-- I'm sure Warwick at PMG will sort this--well he needs to fast-- I'm sure he doesn't want this stench hanging around one of his Hi End products more than necessary.

Hope all sorts out soon for you Bill

Good Listening,

Willco

[DoggieHowser]

I've never had to register the EMM Labs. I just emailed them my serial number and was given the password for the drivers.

I too overlooked the need to supply a receipt because never had to before. All they needed to see was my address and my serial number to ascertain which dealer I had gotten from.

Have asked PMG for a soft copy of the invoice so I can forward that along.

[bhobba]

Yea I think thats the answer - deal with Warwick. The story I hear is his service is spot on.

Thanks guys for all your help - much appreciated.

Thanks

Bill

[WarwickF]

Hi Bill

This is the first I have heard of your issue. Please feel free to correspond with me and I will do my best to get it sorted out for you.

All the best.

Warwick

[Guest JohnA]

yea i wouldnt worry too much about the registration part.

I know when i purchased my esoteric cd player, it came with a 3 year warranty, however like, you, reading further into it, it says, 1 year and an extra 2 when you fill out and send the registration form.

I simply rang the dealer and he told me not to worry about it, they will just cover it for the full 3 years.

[bhobba]

This is the first I have heard of your issue. Please feel free to correspond with me and I will do my best to get it sorted out for you.

Hi Warwick

Thanks mate. Its nothing to worry about per se - its just the attitude they were taking with me I found annoying for such an expensive product.

I will send you the full details.

Thanks

Bill

[Bronal]

In my view, if a piece of equipment is bought from an Australian retailer or distributor, then it is preferable to contact the seller in the first instance to sort out any queries about operation or problems that may arise. They are the ones under Australian law responsible for warranty support and, of course, part of their margin goes towards this. In addition, you are probably providing the Australian seller with useful feedback about the product. Obviously a different scenario applies if the product was bought from overseas and has no support in Australia.

As far as I am aware, there are only a few instances of mandatory warranties on goods - secondhand cars bought through a licensed dealer would be a good example. It may even be possible to offer goods for sale with NO warranty, provided (1) the buyer is clearly aware of this and (2) the goods are fit for purpose at the time of purchase.

The question of having to register a product to get what most people would call a reasonable warranty does seem odd, however, and unnecessary since many resellers send purchase details back to the manufacturer. I'd be interested to know what warranty PMG offer, since they are the ones on whom claims would be made.

Edited September 3, 2012 by bronal

[WarwickF]

PMG passes on the Manufacturer's Warranty except where there is a conflict between Australian Consumer Law and the Manufacturer's Warranty, in which case Australian Consumer Law overrides.

PMG supports any customer who has a warranty problem during the warranty period. There have been occasions where this has been done when done when products were technically out of warranty and we have found our suppliers to be more than co-operative when the circumstances of a failure have been explained. With modern day equipment this mostly entails the swapping of a circuit board which is no big deal.

I don't think Bill has any fault with his unit. He just has an issue with the method of warranty registration. I will make sure his unit is registered so that he can receive the warranty and service support.