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Sealed box design speakers


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Done a search on floor stander sealed box...almost none available except

Magico

 

Does anyone know of any brand/model except the above?

 

Thanks!

 

 

 

ATC SCM20, Dynaudio Contour 2.8 (almost impossible to find one now).

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Thanks Key.  Forgot about ATC, they have pretty nice speakers.  Will check out.

 

Bass from Sealed box sounds different, a matter of taste.  Uh, there is no free lunch --

Not so sure about stuffing the port since it is designed to move air.  Has someone tried?

 

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Don't agree. It's closer to sealed boxes bass. Dyn C2.8 is one with passive radiator.

 

From Wiki

"Passive radiators are used instead of a reflex port for much the same reasons—to tune the small volume and driver for better low frequency performance. Especially in situations in which a port would be inconveniently sized (usually too long for practical box configurations)."

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ok. Agreed that it's somewhat "ported" since it is not sealed. What I meant was the sound from the passive radiator speakers.

 

Have you heard it? I have heard my friends Dyn C2.8.  It has some similarities to sealed box bass in terms of bass performance and also has similar issues that is...it's freaking hard to drive.

 

From Wiki

"Passive radiators are used instead of a reflex port for much the same reasons—to tune the small volume and driver for better low frequency performance. Especially in situations in which a port would be inconveniently sized (usually too long for practical box configurations)."

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I checked out the ATC, not sure about sound but for the price, they are quite ugly  :o

 

Naim Ovator looks quite good, anyone heard it?

Which ATC u saw?

 

Naim OVators are probably not even available in Singapore. And if they sound anything like SBL, it will be acquired taste.  ;D

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I checked out the web, all ATC look like typical British monitors, except the flagship which look impressive but it's just 'a bit' out of reach.  Who sells ATC here?

 

Ovators is just in Absolute Sound.  Will try to go soon.

 

But both  of them are not sealed box.

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For ATC only 20T are seal box floorstander design...

 

If want good seal box floor stander design you only have a few choices , YG acoustic, Duntech , Genesis , Nola , Gryphon etc

 

BTW,IMHO for Floor stander, Seal box do not have any advantage against port design, the advantage of seal box is it's bass extend lower due to slower roll off of bass response, port design will have sharper roll off on bass (although it got flatter bass down to where its port's resonant frequencies designed),  although is don't go as low as seal box type...

 

... while smoother and slowly roll off bass response of seal box design is good for smaller speaker , it do not help much for floor stander which already have good bass extend itself; also a sharp roll off is better for smaller room too, too slow bass roll off the floor stander speaker have,the greater the chance of getting unwanted lowest bass resonant of the room ; and lastly  Port design do able to withstand higher power too(if I remember correctly)....

 

Thats why nowadays MOST of the seal box design only used in small speaker,and MOST of the High End floor speaker using port design~~~ Wilson , B&W , Karma, SF,Marten etc etc all using port design...even speaker like Avalon which use seal design in the begining, on their flagship model like Accent II or Eclipe in 90's , have turn to port design after that...

 

As for many people claim that seal bos design is "cleaner" and "Faster" than port type, IMHO, how "clean" and "Fast" is totally depend on the Speaker designer ~~~ who would say a ported JM LAB or passive woofer Thiel bass is not clean and fast?

 

:)

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Thanks for the very useful comments and info.

Agree different designs can produce good speakers, just that I have a bit of subjective preference, similar to people preferring tube amps etc. Only in this case the sound difference is not so pronounced (gut feel since there is no apple2apple comparison).

 

Nola is new to me and I think the Viper Reference looks promising.

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BTW,IMHO for Floor stander, Seal box do not have any advantage against port design, the advantage of seal box is it's bass extend lower due to slower roll off of bass response, port design will have sharper roll off on bass (although it got flatter bass down to where its port's resonant frequencies designed),  although is don't go as low as seal box type...

 

(side track a bit)

Not really lower... example below using simulated Scanspeak 8531 midbass in 30L floorstander box. Yellow line is the freq response for sealed box while the white line is freq response for ported box. It clear that ported box can give useable lower bass extension about 20Hz lower than sealed box. Sure overall bass response for sealed box is lower but after -18dB, which doesn't count...  If somebody has loose/boomy bass from this ported box design, he better calls you to treat his room.  ;D  ;D

 

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just that I have a bit of subjective preference, similar to people preferring tube amps etc.

There are many more speaker designs than just Infinite Baffle (sealed) and Bass Reflex (ported).

Keep an open mind and listen to all types.

You need to know which amp goes well with the speaker you have decided on and don't ever assume if you already have an amp it will partner with the speaker of your choice.

Audition both amp and speaker together.

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(side track a bit)

Not really lower... example below using simulated Scanspeak 8531 midbass in 30L floorstander box. Yellow line is the freq response for sealed box while the white line is freq response for ported box. It clear that ported box can give useable lower bass extension about 20Hz lower than sealed box. Sure overall bass response for sealed box is lower but after -18dB, which doesn't count...  If somebody has loose/boomy bass from this ported box design, he better calls you to treat his room.  ;D  ;D

 

 

 

Yes, that is the reason why I said for floor stander, which already have good low frequency extension  , seal box do not have too much benefit

compare to a ported type...

 

On the other hand, for smaller speaker (20 liter below), the smoother roll off of seal box , IMHO , might sound more nature to some because it don't "cut off the bass too suddenly" like a ported design~~~

 

~~~ not to forget , Room boundary effect will increase the lowest bass output of any speaker in a room, a -20dBat  30 hz in computer simulations or anechoic room , might become a -3 dB or + 10dB at a small room in real life ~~  to a bookshelf speaker, any little bit of lowest bass extension do help it to sound "larger" .... ;D

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Thanks for the very useful comments and info.

Agree different designs can produce good speakers, just that I have a bit of subjective preference, similar to people preferring tube amps etc. Only in this case the sound difference is not so pronounced (gut feel since there is no apple2apple comparison).

 

Nola is new to me and I think the Viper Reference looks promising.

 

from what I learn , only experience audiophile have strong "subjective preference" , so I guess you must be in this hobby for quite some year already right?  ;) ;D

 

* NOLA used to call ALON in 90's....the founder is Mr Carl Marchisotto who designed the "time alignment" Dahlquist speaker (which influence a lot of speaker design later) in 70's  , when not much speaker designer understand what time alignment is about at that time.....    :)

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Haha u r so right.  One wonders how the years went by just like that.

 

Despite the 'subjective preference', I will still be looking out for Avalon, Rockport and the likes.

 

Emailed Nola, so far no reply about who the local dealers are.  Any idea?

Thanks.

 

 

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What you say is correct and this only applies to the SAME driver when used for both instances. However, drivers used for sealed box design have a higher compliance (Qts), both mechanical and electrical. Good examples of sealed box designs are from Naim, Meridian, the late Acoustic Research (which I have the AR M1 and M2) and ATC (I have the SCM7). To me, bass reflex sound boomy and the bass is usually a bit "laggy" or slow. At high SPLs, the port will start to chuff. Increasing the port diameter will allow midrange frequencies to "escape" through the port, thus interfering with the main output. A variation of a sealed box would be the coupled cavity design or also known as 4th order bandpass which designs like Ascendo, Burmeister and KEF employ for their bass.

If you notice that the current trend of high end subs are either towards sealed box design or use high mass passive radiators. Only the cheaper subs employ bass reflex ports. Go figure.  ;D

 

 

Yes, that is the reason why I said for floor stander, which already have good low frequency extension  , seal box do not have too much benefit

compare to a ported type...

 

On the other hand, for smaller speaker (20 liter below), the smoother roll off of seal box , IMHO , might sound more nature to some because it don't "cut off the bass too suddenly" like a ported design~~~

 

~~~ not to forget , Room boundary effect will increase the lowest bass output of any speaker in a room, a -20dBat  30 hz in computer simulations or anechoic room , might become a -3 dB or + 10dB at a small room in real life ~~  to a bookshelf speaker, any little bit of lowest bass extension do help it to sound "larger" .... ;D

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What you say is correct and this only applies to the SAME driver when used for both instances. However, drivers used for sealed box design have a higher compliance (Qts), both mechanical and electrical. Good examples of sealed box designs are from Naim, Meridian, the late Acoustic Research (which I have the AR M1 and M2) and ATC (I have the SCM7). To me, bass reflex sound boomy and the bass is usually a bit "laggy" or slow. At high SPLs, the port will start to chuff. Increasing the port diameter will allow midrange frequencies to "escape" through the port, thus interfering with the main output. A variation of a sealed box would be the coupled cavity design or also known as 4th order bandpass which designs like Ascendo, Burmeister and KEF employ for their bass.

If you notice that the current trend of high end subs are either towards sealed box design or use high mass passive radiators. Only the cheaper subs employ bass reflex ports. Go figure.  ;D

 

 

Exactly!  I used to owned quite some small speakers in the pass before I started floorstander too, some port design I owned sound not bad, like AE-1,TAD 300, Harberth HL Compact , Roger LS 5/9 etc ......all are good speaker , but if to talk about bass I would still prefer the more nature bass extend of seal box ATC SCM 20, 10, Celestion SL 600si, few brands of LS3/5A,AR M1 or Spica TC-50~~~the only exception is Ensemble Elysia (back fire KEF 139, 13" X 9" passive woofer), this well designed passive woofer speaker bass roll off is not as fast and steep as a ported design,and it do have the benefit of stronger mid bass, this make it sound like a floor stander even though it size is not bigger than SL-600...

 

 

SilverPS3 ,sorry I don't know who is the dealer of NOLA in Singapore , maybe they don't have one.

 

BTW its good to see old timer audiophile post in xtremeplace

 

:)

 

 

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