tsammyc Posted November 25, 2007 Posted November 25, 2007 Just started on a project to convert my 5-yr old Creative SLIX (really a an early Shuttle compact PC) to play HD and hopefully, BD and HD-DVD. One might think it is an impossible task to get a 5 year old machine enough processing power to display HD, but ATI's HD 2400 and 2600 graphics chips change this by offloading the H.264/VC1 processing to the graphics chip. The SLIX had been upgraded from the original 1.5Ghz Pentium 4 to a 2.8Ghz P4 about 3 years ago, so it has a reasonably fast processor. However, with a 5-yr old ATI Radeon 7000 card, it could barely play a simple 3D game - SIMS 2 at 800x600 with all the options turned off. The main issue with this machine is its unique compact power supply, which is just 200W and I can't upgrade it because regular power supplies are too big for the case. In early 2006, I tried installing a Nvidia 6600GT AGP card, but it just sucked too much juice and the power supply couldn't cope. The new ATI 2xxx cards use much less power and some don't even require a 2nd power connector or even a fan. On the low end, the choice (ranked in terms of processing power) are 2400Pro,2400XT,2600Pro and 2600XT. All are available in AGP (as well as PCI-E). I decided to go for the 2400Pro because it has the fewest transistors and runs at the lowest clock speed. It was also cheap at $119 vs $259 for the AGP 2600XT, which might have overwhelmed the 200W power supply. Sucess on the install. Runs perfectly and a benefit is that 3D is now quite fast. SIMS 2 now runs full speed at 1280x1024 with all the options turned on. It can also play home-made 1080p HD M2TS files with Windows Media Player and the PowerDVD 7 codec. Not sure if it will play Blu Ray or HD-DVD yet, but I think there is a good chance that it will. However, I will have to transfer my LG drive from the HTPC to test it. For those old AGP PCs with small power supplies the ATI 2600Pro AGP card really gives the machine a new lease of life, The PowerColor version is slightly better than the Sapphire version because it includes a HDMI dongle.
mcmaranello Posted November 26, 2007 Posted November 26, 2007 thank you...now i know what to buy for the coming Sitex.. btw, my athlon xp 2000 is still running all these years, no games no reason to change yet.
simic Posted November 26, 2007 Posted November 26, 2007 H264 on HDVD or BD can be offloaded to GPU. but x264 on MKV containers will still be CPU bound, I afraid. So if you are trying to play 1080p content that is downloaded from the usual sources, u still need a C2D processor.
tsammyc Posted November 26, 2007 Author Posted November 26, 2007 but x264 on MKV containers will still be CPU bound, I afraid. So if you are trying to play 1080p content that is downloaded from the usual sources, u still need a C2D processor. Can you point to some 1080p stuff that I can download and try. Do you perhaps mean H.264 encoded content in WMV files. The PC used to be able to play 1080p WMV-HD before I upgraded to the 2600Pro. You don't need a C2D. It played fine on my P4 2.8Ghz slightly overclocked to 3.0Ghz (which is the minimum requirement). At one time a bunch of us were all trying to play Terminator II in WMV-HD and it worked fine two years ago. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WMV-HD
simic Posted November 26, 2007 Posted November 26, 2007 nope wmv-hd is vc-1 codec, which is easy peasy to decode. x264 is significantly more difficult. PM if you need a sample.
tsammyc Posted November 26, 2007 Author Posted November 26, 2007 I did some research on the issue. It doesn't have anything to do with VC1 vs H.264 in terms of difficulty of decoding because the HD2XXX series can handle both easily. I happens to be a bug in the ATI drivers that H.264 content created with a specific encoder - X264 - and put in in a MKV package, where, due to the bug, hardware acceleration is disabled. It seems that there is a lot of pirated content floating around the net in this form. Apparently ATI have promised to fix it in the 7.12 drivers according to a post on AVSForum.
Quest88 Posted November 26, 2007 Posted November 26, 2007 I know slightly off-topic but here are some WMD-HD clips for those who are interested to test: :) http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/musicandvideo/hdvideo/contentshowcase.aspx
simic Posted November 27, 2007 Posted November 27, 2007 Apparently ATI have promised to fix it in the 7.12 drivers according to a post on AVSForum. This is good news! Looks like I dont have to overhaul my AMD 3000+ afterall.
bfg100k Posted November 28, 2007 Posted November 28, 2007 Just started on a project to convert my 5-yr old Creative SLIX (really a an early Shuttle compact PC) to play HD and hopefully, BD and HD-DVD. One might think it is an impossible task to get a 5 year old machine enough processing power to display HD, but ATI's HD 2400 and 2600 graphics chips change this by offloading the H.264/VC1 processing to the graphics chip. The SLIX had been upgraded from the original 1.5Ghz Pentium 4 to a 2.8Ghz P4 about 3 years ago, so it has a reasonably fast processor. However, with a 5-yr old ATI Radeon 7000 card, it could barely play a simple 3D game - SIMS 2 at 800x600 with all the options turned off. The main issue with this machine is its unique compact power supply, which is just 200W and I can't upgrade it because regular power supplies are too big for the case. In early 2006, I tried installing a Nvidia 6600GT AGP card, but it just sucked too much juice and the power supply couldn't cope. The new ATI 2xxx cards use much less power and some don't even require a 2nd power connector or even a fan. On the low end, the choice (ranked in terms of processing power) are 2400Pro,2400XT,2600Pro and 2600XT. All are available in AGP (as well as PCI-E). I decided to go for the 2400Pro because it has the fewest transistors and runs at the lowest clock speed. It was also cheap at $119 vs $259 for the AGP 2600XT, which might have overwhelmed the 200W power supply. Sucess on the install. Runs perfectly and a benefit is that 3D is now quite fast. SIMS 2 now runs full speed at 1280x1024 with all the options turned on. It can also play home-made 1080p HD M2TS files with Windows Media Player and the PowerDVD 7 codec. Not sure if it will play Blu Ray or HD-DVD yet, but I think there is a good chance that it will. However, I will have to transfer my LG drive from the HTPC to test it. For those old AGP PCs with small power supplies the ATI 2600Pro AGP card really gives the machine a new lease of life, The PowerColor version is slightly better than the Sapphire version because it includes a HDMI dongle. Excellent post. Can you also share your HTPC setup? I will be building one to connect to a pio 508 as the primary display. Intent is to use it for PVR + viewing HD content from my NAS based media library. Will appreciate any advice you may have.
tsammyc Posted November 28, 2007 Author Posted November 28, 2007 If you are building one from scratch, then follow Fook Lai's post. This was more on converting an old PC to do some modern things given some advances in display technology.
sonique Posted January 1, 2008 Posted January 1, 2008 i have a 2.4Ghz intel mobo and wants to convert it to HTPC. which gfx card would u recommend... - Nvidia's 7600gt - ATI's HD2x00PRO/XT series?
BuRR06 Posted January 1, 2008 Posted January 1, 2008 hi tsammyc , i was also thinking of getting a small PC like those shuttle type as my media PC and was hoping if u could give me some advice. Question: Using the PC with the HD graphics card that u recommended, is it able to upscale dvds to 1080i for 1080p? So instead of me spending like 300 ++ to get a Oppo dvd player i might as well do up a HTPC. Further more i have a lot of anime content in my comp which i would like to view on my LCD tv.
tsammyc Posted January 7, 2008 Author Posted January 7, 2008 Generally, the PC is an excellent upscaling SD DVD player as long as you get one of the newer DVD player software like WinDVD, Sonic or Theatertek. The only downside to me is that it takes some time to boot up.
BuRR06 Posted January 21, 2008 Posted January 21, 2008 tsammyc how did u connect ur 2400 Pro to ur TV ? Through HDMI using a DVI-HDMI converter? then what about the sound ? i just bought the 2400 pro also .. had a hard time looking for the AGP ver.
tsammyc Posted February 16, 2008 Author Posted February 16, 2008 tsammyc how did u connect ur 2400 Pro to ur TV ? Through HDMI using a DVI-HDMI converter? then what about the sound ? i just bought the 2400 pro also .. had a hard time looking for the AGP ver. Sorry missed this. The 2400Pro is connected to a projector via a special ATI DVI-HDMI connector (its a unique connector that also passes audio). Regular DVI-HDMI don't work
hosm Posted February 20, 2008 Posted February 20, 2008 Sorry missed this. The 2400Pro is connected to a projector via a special ATI DVI-HDMI connector (its a unique connector that also passes audio). Regular DVI-HDMI don't work Sam, Which shop you got the 2400Pro card from? do you think it will fit in a SFF casing ( XC cube )? AGP interface and the Brand? Thanks sm
BuRR06 Posted February 20, 2008 Posted February 20, 2008 I got it at some shop on 4th floor. But it is the last piece already. Before that i went to about 3-4 shops but all dun carry the agp ver. already. shld fit SFF as it is quite a small card with a simple fan only.
hosm Posted February 20, 2008 Posted February 20, 2008 I got it at some shop on 4th floor. But it is the last piece already. Before that i went to about 3-4 shops but all dun carry the agp ver. already. shld fit SFF as it is quite a small card with a simple fan only. Thanks for the reply. is it package under Sapphire, Powercolor, Visiontek?
esc Posted February 28, 2008 Posted February 28, 2008 hi, any want know of a good half PCI sound card with digital output to AV amp for the DTS / AC3 passthru. me thinking of using SFF PC, so normal sound card won't fit ;D
hosm Posted February 28, 2008 Posted February 28, 2008 hi, a452-- now of a good half PCI sound card with digital output to AV amp for the DTS / AC3 passthru. me thinking of using SFF PC, so normal sound card won't fit ;D My old SFF by AOpen comes with built-in optical in/out. You dont need a additional sound card for that.
esc Posted February 29, 2008 Posted February 29, 2008 only problem is my SFF only got the normal sound card built in .. no digital out :( My old SFF by AOpen comes with built-in optical in/out. You dont need a additional sound card for that.
hosm Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 Mine is under PowerColor Got my Powercolor HD 2400 Pro AGP. Experience graphic card shutdown. ( no display ) after 10 to 15min use But the PC is still running. only way is to power down. Did you have any problem?
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