Scott Field Posted May 18, 2021 Author Share Posted May 18, 2021 1 hour ago, MrBurns84 said: In my current listening room, 5x4x3 but with openings to the side walls. I am using 2 rel1003s, yeah i know, small 10s, 300w class d (meh).. but it fills the room very nicely and evenly with tight bass. I found 1 was uneven, placed off left or right off my ambeo soundbar. I used to think bigger+more power is better, but its all about integration into the listening space. @Scott Field - i would get hold off a umik-1, REW, and a minidsp and do a series of measurements re: placement, phase, etc to integrate it well. Or contact Red Spade Audio for some consultation. I may bite the bullet and buy the mic soon if I cant get any improvement with the above suggestions. I just dont want to end up spending a heap of money on suggestions that may or may not work, because in the end they may add up to the price of a 2nd sub lol. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satanica Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Scott Field said: I may bite the bullet and buy the mic soon if I cant get any improvement with the above suggestions. I just dont want to end up spending a heap of money on suggestions that may or may not work, because in the end they may add up to the price of a 2nd sub lol. Thanks! A second sub might make things worse in fact it could be harder to integrate. The potential problem with multiple subs is if they are not setup well they can work against each other by cancelling each other out. Which highlights another potential problem that a subwoofer or subwoofers can also work against your mains by cancelling some of each other out. Even with a crossover of 80Hz and your speakers set to SMALL your speakers still have plenty of bass to produce (mid bass and upper bass) so the problem assuming there is one could be more in the speaker zone. Too hard to work it out by ear so a UMIK is an invaluable tool with REW. Edited May 18, 2021 by Satanica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Field Posted May 18, 2021 Author Share Posted May 18, 2021 12 minutes ago, Satanica said: A second sub might make things worse in fact it could be harder to integrate. The potential problem with multiple subs is if they are not setup well they can work against each other by cancelling each other out. Which highlights another potential problem that a subwoofer or subwoofers can also work against your mains by cancelling some of each other out. Even with a crossover of 80Hz and your speakers set to SMALL your speakers still have plenty of bass to produce (mid bass and upper bass) so the problem assuming there is one could be more in the speaker zone. Too hard to work it out by ear so a UMIK is an invaluable tool with REW. To eliminate the speaker zone I could set the crossover to 100hz? If i was to get a UMIK id also need a tripod aswell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satanica Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 45 minutes ago, Scott Field said: To eliminate the speaker zone I could set the crossover to 100hz? No, but by doing this you may get an improvement so I think it is worth a try. Midbass is from about 80Hz to about 150Hz. Upper bass is from about 150Hz to 250Hz. 48 minutes ago, Scott Field said: If i was to get a UMIK id also need a tripod aswell? https://www.minidsp.com/products/acoustic-measurement/umik-1 Looking at the website it appears to me you only get a "mini" tripod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Field Posted May 18, 2021 Author Share Posted May 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Satanica said: No, but by doing this you may get an improvement so I think it is worth a try. Midbass is from about 80Hz to about 150Hz. Upper bass is from about 150Hz to 250Hz. https://www.minidsp.com/products/acoustic-measurement/umik-1 Looking at the website it appears to me you only get a "mini" tripod. Sorry for the stupid questions. Even if i run rew and see the dips / peaks etc, I really have no way of fixing them apart from trying to move the sub around the room and re running it right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betty boop Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 one of the things i see with the room is if place is built like most places ... those walls might as well not be there and is a bit too close to room opening.... so in essence consider the sub sitting in middle of nowhere.. this doesnt work that well for subs... its like putting the sub in the middle of the room. I would seriously try moving the sub from where it is to other side ie next to right hand side mains... for starters as might energise room more evenly... the other problems is see is the L&R mains are squished right next to side walls... literally no room to breathe... then also see a problem that the couch and main listening position is pretty much back to wall... also not a great place to be... what happens is that is usually a region of gain and any eq setup is likely going to kill the bass ... all postulation... without some measurement hard to say anything really... its an unfortunate thing with these media rooms you end up with a setup like this... no wall to one side at all... its a bit of a problem room and will take a bit of work in my opinion to make some thing of it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satanica Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Scott Field said: Sorry for the stupid questions. Even if i run rew and see the dips / peaks etc, I really have no way of fixing them apart from trying to move the sub around the room and re running it right? No need to be sorry and of course you'd be wanting solutions such as: Move your subwoofer Move your speakers Move your chair forward An additional DSP for your subwoofer (miniDSP) with better room correction software A different AVR or Processsor with better room correction software for your subwoofer and entire speaker set Edited May 18, 2021 by Satanica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blybo Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 @Red Spade Audio will come out and measure your room with 1 sub and find the best 2 locations in your room to even out bass response. He did that for me years ago as I had much more bass to the left of the room than centre or right. We ended up with 1 sub at the rear centre location, and front right corner. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillmaverick Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 (edited) Hi Scott , Place the sub in the listening position. Play a track with bass.......walk around the room listening ( including standing at both left and right hand corners ). Best spot for sub placement is the spot where you hear improvement in the bass. I have tried this method and it works without spending any more money. If this does not work than Umik-1 is a great tool as well. Good Luck. Edited May 18, 2021 by gillmaverick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satanica Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 2 minutes ago, gillmaverick said: Hi Scott , Place the sub in the listening position. Play a track with bass.......walk around the room listening ( including standing at both left and right hand corners ). Best spot for sub placement is the spot where you hear improvement in the bass. I have tried this method and it works without spending any more money. If this does not work than Umik-1 is a great tool as well. Good Luck. Not a bad idea but the thread starter should remove all room correction so the system is uncorrected when searching for better acoustic placement. The same goes for measuring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillmaverick Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, Satanica said: Not a bad idea but the thread starter should remove all room correction so the system is uncorrected when searching for better acoustic placement. The same goes for measuring. Yupp , All processing need to be off when playing. I think AV receivers have pure direct button which does that but I could be wrong. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Field Posted May 18, 2021 Author Share Posted May 18, 2021 Hi All, I did some small testing tonight and got small minor improvements, increasing the sub distance and upping the crossover to 90hz on the AV settings helped a bit too. Basically ive found from 20-40hz the sub will shake the whole room and it sounds amazing, anything over 60hz it just seems to fall flat on its face. Ill do some more testing and see what i can achieve. Im waiting to wall mount my TV and then ill also have Red Spade come out. Thanks! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest niterida Posted May 18, 2021 Share Posted May 18, 2021 I would start with the easiest option - either a sub crawl as suggested already (puyt the sub in your main seat and then crawl around until you find the spot that sounds the best and put your sub there. Then the nest easiest - download REW and simulate your room and see where the best position for your sub is. And as also suggested - move your seating off the wall as far as you can - against the wall will give very poor bass response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almikel Posted June 2, 2021 Share Posted June 2, 2021 On 18/05/2021 at 5:56 PM, Scott Field said: then ill also have Red Spade come out. Having that option is gold - hopefully happened before lockdowns? Paul can sort your room issues. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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