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What is the order of importance of things which can get in the way of your listening enjoyment?


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I'm pretty happy with my system overall, but will always wonder "but what if?" I would like to try other power sources, my voltage is pretty steady but a bit high at 248volts. It doesn't stop me enjoying music at all, but for me extraneous noise that I can't control (neigbours dog yapping, lawnmowers etc.) sometimes require a zen like mindfulness. 

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Inadequate wine and cheese.

Wife needing some sort of attention Ditto children Job Dog But seriously.....wife Rolling tubes just to end up with same SQ Rolling tubes just to end up with

It's hard to believe such a comment is being posted on the same forum where people say they can't live without the massive improvements a $1000 ethernet cable (allegedly) provides...

On 24/03/2021 at 11:06 AM, MrC said:

Can you please elaborate?

Really?  You haven't experienced the myriad of people telling you why your system doesn't sound right?   Instead of reading that tripe,  we should spend more time enjoying our listening.

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On 25/03/2021 at 6:00 AM, thethrowback said:

 

Thankfully, I can say none of the above.

 

I just hope that is not all from personal experience. Throw in a dying dog and it reads like a Country & Western lament about audio.

Wash your mouth out?

If people posting here spent more time listening to Hank Williams or Johnny Cash or Merle Haggard or Willie or any one of a hundred players they would be so immersed in the music and the emotion ofThe moment they wouldn’t notice the end of the world let alone a cable not being up to standard

 

 

Even more so after a few ?????

And ????????

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11 minutes ago, keyse1 said:

 

If people posting here spent more time listening to Hank Williams or Johnny Cash or Merle Haggard or Willie or any one of a hundred players they would be so immersed in the music and the emotion ofThe moment they wouldn’t notice the end of the world let alone a cable not being up to standard

 

 

... or even unplugged.

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53 minutes ago, keyse1 said:

Wash your mouth out?

 

You'd have to admit the lyrics to some Country music songs can plumb the depths of misery, and that's not a criticism.

 

"Good Year for the Roses" or "I’m So Lonesome I Could Cry" are some of the saddest songs I have ever listened to.

 

According to the old joke, if you play Country music backwards you get your job and your spouse back, and your dog comes home. ?‍?

Edited by thethrowback
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3 hours ago, aussievintage said:

Really?  You haven't experienced the myriad of people telling you why your system doesn't sound right?   Instead of reading that tripe,  we should spend more time enjoying our listening.

Hey I agree with you  .... I was playing dumb.  I have and I know that certain people on this forum are self-appointed experts and whoa betide anyone who contradicts them.

Edited by MrC
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2 hours ago, keyse1 said:

Wash your mouth out?

If people posting here spent more time listening to Hank Williams or Johnny Cash or Merle Haggard or Willie or any one of a hundred players they would be so immersed in the music and the emotion ofThe moment they wouldn’t notice the end of the world let alone a cable not being up to standard

 

 

Even more so after a few ?????

And ????????

 

And please; take it from someone who never thought he would like country or western music; do yourself a favour and listen to Asleep at the Wheel - what a great band over the decades....

And apologies for taking the topic further off track .... been a long week.

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35 minutes ago, MrC said:

Hey I agree with you  .... I was playing dumb.  I have and I know that certain people on this forum are self-appointed experts and whoa betide anyone who contradicts them.

 

That's odd.

 

I have contributed to and read the entire thread and did not see anything such as you have alluded to. Sometimes when we are not in agreement with one another, one party inevitably gets the self appointed expert tag.

 

In any case the thread is just some fun and banter and discussing ways that people get to enjoy music cannot be a bad thing :)

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15 minutes ago, rantan said:

That's odd.

 

I have contributed to and read the entire thread and did not see anything such as you have alluded to. Sometimes when we are not in agreement with one another, one party inevitably gets the self appointed expert tag.

 

In any case the thread is just some fun and banter and discussing ways that people get to enjoy music cannot be a bad thing :)

 

 

  I am sure @MrC was, and I certainly am, talking about what happens in the many many other threads on these forums.  Don't get me wrong, I keep coming back for more - BUT, it is well to remind oneself about the realities.

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3 hours ago, aussievintage said:

Really?  You haven't experienced the myriad of people telling you why your system doesn't sound right?   Instead of reading that tripe,  we should spend more time enjoying our listening.

There are a lot of people who want their particular preference, or maybe the membership of their tribe, to be validated, as well.

 

If you want to be popular among audiophiles (and I found out that I know many more in real life than I thought, recently)  - don't buy a high priced class D amp, and never say you prefer CD to vinyl to someone's face.

 

As for all the technical faults getting in the way of your listening, remember back when you were listening to a cheap MP3 player, or if you go back to my era the all in one "record player" and the cheap transistor radio? Wasn't music fun in those days? Yet now a bit of background noise or slightly inadequate bass stops you listening? I had a great time in Coles a few days ago when some of that early 80s jazz funk came on, practically dancing down the aisle.

 

Sure, I can listen "better" on my overly expensive stuff in the living room. But do you lot never get caught unawares like that by music in a public place, in the background during a TV programme, wherever? If not, you've lost it.

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On 25/03/2021 at 1:18 PM, BlueOceanBoy said:

As you know Hugo......this is a huge rabbit hole. Tidal MQA vs Non MQA? CD via transport or using ripper like Antipodes K10 to store on external or internal drive? NAS connected to streamer? Which sounds better? Don't get me started on vinyl! Is one album version better mastered than another? Because it was "mastered"? Was that from original master tapes or remastered from digital? And how and by whom? 

Many on this forum decry Tidal in general and particularly MQA. To me, sometimes MQA is better and sometimes not. Sometimes Tidal is better than CD etc. Is it a mood thing? There was some heated discussion recently about Neil Young pulling his albums off Tidal because of how they (to him) were remastered. Bring on Qobuz!!!


These are probably the things that get in the way of enjoying music the most for me, but I don't give too much thought to it anymore.

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It is always about the music first with me - I used my system to listen to the music not the other way around (music to listen to my system) but have enjoyed my current upgrades - and one of the upgrades is a Class D amp ? (PS Audio Stella Strata)

 

Edited by April Snow
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1 Sudden inspiration that perhaps I should experiment with different speaker placement. 

Edited by Moikel
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1 hour ago, Moikel said:

perhaps I should experiment with different speaker placement

 

It's the cheapest upgrade anyone can make. A few centimetres can sometimes be the difference between good and great sound.

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1/ Thinking too much.

 

2/Thinking too much. 

 

3/Thinking too much. 

 

Once I've shut off my brain as an acoustician I really get to enjoy it all and realise I'm splitting hairs over any issues remaining.

 

Before studying acoustics and engineering, I happily enjoyed far lesser systems. 

Edited by DrSK
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11 minutes ago, DrSK said:

Once I've shut off my brain

 

That will increase the enjoyment of most aspects of life, not just music.

Edited by thethrowback
I stand corrected!
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Guest Eggcup the Dafter
1 minute ago, thethrowback said:

 

That will increase the enjoyment of all aspects of life, not just music.

Doesn't work for crosswords.

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18 minutes ago, Eggcup the Dafter said:

Doesn't work for crosswords.

Shutting off my brain works for me on these too! Stop stressing and just give up. 

 

My dyslexia gives me a warped mind. Can do engineering and get through theoretical text books. 

 

Yet fail miserably at crosswords, bingo, sudoku and word finds. Or reading lists and menus. 

 

Wife and inlaws were in hysterics last week at me, I could only get 50% in my 5yo's kindy homework which was a word find! Luckily I can laugh at myself too! 

 

I was tempted to scan the word find, run optical character recognition and then write code to find the words. That I can do.  I have coded some silly stuff looking back as it meant survival. 

 

And music gives me a massive escape from the world of text and writing. 

Edited by DrSK
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On 20/03/2021 at 12:45 PM, Satanica said:

Up until a while ago I would say inconsistency in source material especially in how much bass content varies between recordings.


This recording does not have enough bass...

This recording has the right amount of bass...

This recording has too much bass...

 

So what to do?

And to make the matter even more complicated my system is a dual purpose Music and HT system.

Well on my main digital processor I now have four profiles and they all get some use.

 

Flat

2dB Bass Gain (Harman based)

4dB Bass Gain (Harman based)

6dB Bass Gain (Harman based)

 

Tone controls ?!?!?

 

My quirky dual stereo 4.0 setup helps me when too much base is an issue. 

 

I spin the seat around and reverse the room, rotate the 'surrounds' 90 degrees to become normal stereo and send from the same source to the speakers. Some amp differences but the blown base is often at the pop and so I'm not worried. 

 

Fronts are Lenehan ML2+Rs and the surrounds etc ML1+Rs. Stereo amps driving each. Oppo 205 sorts for HT but use a better DAC/Pre for music with two outputs which can feed either stereo pair. 

 

Although probably should get around to using EQ etc in Roon. 

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20 minutes ago, DrSK said:

 

My dyslexia gives me a warped mind.

 

I envy you. You can legitimately type things like “ecxuse my pselling, I ahve sexdaily”.

 

:D

 

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6 minutes ago, Steffen said:

 

I envy you. You can legitimately type things like “ecxuse my pselling, I ahve sexdaily”.

 

:D

 

 

It's what I miss type and can't proof read properly that has created a stir. 

 

Caused a stir writing government policy writing mortality instead of motility.  And referring to a well respected older consultant's testes rather than tests... 

Edited by DrSK
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21 hours ago, DrSK said:

 

It's what I miss type and can't proof read properly that has created a stir. 

 

Caused a stir writing government policy writing mortality instead of motility.  And referring to a well respected older consultant's testes rather than tests... 

Honestly, I think mistakes like that could make government documents actually readable.

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  • 1 month later...
On 27/03/2021 at 9:34 PM, DrSK said:

Once I've shut off my brain

I shut my brain off once - haven't been able to get it started again since............

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for me - my system is still relatively new so the music that I was once familiar with are now different. also every so often my system crackles. which is very annoying. so i purchased box to hopefully resolve this annoying issue.

 

 

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On 08/05/2021 at 1:23 AM, genkifd said:

 

... also every so often my system crackles. which is very annoying. so i purchased box to hopefully resolve this annoying issue.

 

 

What sort of 'crackle', g?  And is it all the time - or only at some times of the day?

 

And did your 'box' solve this annoying issue?

 

Andy

 

 

 

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the box has yet to arrive - dont know why massive delays on this HDMI to I2S boxes. 

 

the crackle sound is random. at time i hear it 3 time in a single song while other times i wont hear if for 5 songs. if i replay the song it doesnt happen at the same place. its not the time of the day as on weekend when im only one awake it still happens and also i have dedicated lines in my music room.

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The worst upgrade I ever made was installing a girlfriend in the centre of my couch.

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Satanica touched on this earlier but number one for me is boomy bass due to poor speaker/room interaction. Ive been struggling with this since my first 'semi serious setup back in 1990 whereby certain LP's excited the room so bad resulting in boomy uneven bass that I could no longer tolerate listening to them.

 

Even today when I listen to the same albums in my now semi treated environment I still get some anxiety thinking im still hearing room boom as one of the first things I lock onto when listening is the bass guitar and if the notes played are uneven in volume on the  lower registers I know its time to move stuff around again. Its anoying....

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6 hours ago, Tubularbells said:

Even today when I listen to the same albums in my now semi treated environment I still get some anxiety thinking im still hearing room boom as one of the first things I lock onto when listening is the bass guitar and if the notes played are uneven in volume on the  lower registers I know its time to move stuff around again. Its anoying....

 

It was 2007 when I thought enough is enough so I first started with DEQX room correction.

Now, with a miniDSP I'm now using Dirac Live room correction with MSO subwoofer integration.

I could never go back to living with uneven bass notes.

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On 26/03/2021 at 6:07 PM, MrC said:

Hey I agree with you  .... I was playing dumb.  I have and I know that certain people on this forum are self-appointed experts and whoa betide anyone who contradicts them.

Hi @MrC I haven't come across that expression since I last heard it many many years ago in grade 6 used by my RC Nun teacher in a stern warning to all the classroom pupils to stop their loud talking...it both froze and puzzled me the first time I heard it..."whoa" I understood...that's like in cowboys and horses right?!? when you want to stop your horse! Anyways what's a horse doing in a classroom?!?...I was too scared to ask that one of the ferocious Nun in case I got pinged for being a smartarse! Now as to "betide" that was a tad different to this lil tacker...never heard of that one...no sireeee...nope...nadda....nix...I just kept staring at her wide eyed....mute and quiet (just breath, don't move!) Thinking...thinking...'tide' I have heard of that one...I think it's summit to do with the beach right! So then its high and/or low tide right?!? and "be" is short for in between...in between high and low tide! Betide got it!!! Soooo "whoa" as in stop the between tide?!? nahhhh that just doesn't make sense...."whoa betide" just always meant some mysterious watery threat to this tacker...which when you think some more about it made sense...tear wise for misbehaving! 

Edited by BLAH BLAH
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5 minutes ago, BLAH BLAH said:

Hi @MrC I haven't come across that expression since I last heard it many many years ago in grade 6 used by my RC Nun teacher in a stern warning to all the classroom pupils to stop their loud talking...it both froze and puzzled me the first time I heard it..."whoa" I understood...that's like in cowboys and horses right?!? when you want to stop your horse! Anyways what's a horse doing in a classroom?!?...I was too scared to ask that one of the ferocious Nun in case I got pinged for being a smartarse! Now as to "betide" that was a tad different to this lil tacker...never heard of that one...no sireeee...nope...nadda....nix...I just kept staring at her wide eyed....mute and quiet (just breath, don't move!) Thinking...thinking...'tide' I have heard of that one...I think it's summit to do with the beach right! So then its high and/or low tide right?!? and "be" is short for in between...in between high and low tide! Betide got it!!! Soooo "whoa" as in stop the between tide?!? nahhhh that just doesn't make sense...."whoa betide" just always meant some mysterious watery threat to this tacker...which when you think some more about it made sense...tear wise for misbehaving! 

 

It's actually 'woe' betide, BB.

 

Andy

 

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32 minutes ago, andyr said:

 

It's actually 'woe' betide, BB.

 

Andy

 

No cowboys and horses then?!? I don't know whether to feel disappointed or relieved...

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39 minutes ago, andyr said:

 

It's actually 'woe' betide, BB.

 

Andy

 

You are correct ... the whoa was inserted for added emphasis !!!

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  • 1 month later...

My Hearing..   The drop off that happens to all of us as we get older but I am sure we don't want to admit it.

 

Listening to music thinking I am sure this sounded better in the past?  And that is with a substantially better system than anything I had in my younger years. 

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7 minutes ago, Syrot said:

My Hearing..   The drop off that happens to all of us as we get older but I am sure we don't want to admit it.

 

Listening to music thinking I am sure this sounded better in the past?  And that is with a substantially better system than anything I had in my younger years. 

Really? Have you been to a live acoustic performance of something to see your enjoyment of that has also diminished and that it sounded better?

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10 hours ago, Ittaku said:

... a live acoustic performance of something to see your enjoyment of that has also diminished and that it sounded better...

 

These days if going to a live classical music concert in a concert hall, with no artificial sound reinforcement, I make sure to get seats not too far back. That way not only is the sound pressure level generally higher but the additional attenuation of higher frequencies (dependent on humidity) that is unavoidable as sound waves pass through air, is less than it would be for seats further back.

 

This seating strategy reduces in part the impact on my listening experience of age-related reduction in general sensitivity in my hearing, and the greater reduction in acuity for higher frequencies.  However sitting closer cannot fully compensate. I can no longer hear above 15kHz, even at very high sound pressure levels.

 

Such reductions in hearing acuity begin quite early in adult life. I commented on this recently in another thread, as  reproduced in part below. I note that the graphs don't show the tapering off for frequencies above 6kHz, which would even more pronounced than the tapering off at 6kHz!

 

Here is an example of a  graph for hearing threshold change with age (taken from https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/age-shift-in-threshold-d_1474.html):-

 

Men - age and shift in hearing threshold 

 

I'm not sure what studies were used for compiling the above graphs or how accurate they might be,  but it is certainly well known that hearing acuity decreases with age, with the upper frequencies being affected quite noticeably. 

Edited by MLXXX
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5 hours ago, MLXXX said:

 

These days if going to a live classical music concert in a concert hall, with no artificial sound reinforcement, I make sure to get seats not too far back. That way not only is the sound pressure level generally higher but the additional attenuation of higher frequencies (dependent on humidity) that is unavoidable as sound waves pass through air, is less than it would be for seats further back.

 

This seating strategy reduces in part the impact on my listening experience of age-related reduction in general sensitivity in my hearing, and the greater reduction in acuity for higher frequencies.  However sitting closer cannot fully compensate. I can no longer hear above 15kHz, even at very high sound pressure levels.

 

Such reductions in hearing acuity begin quite early in adult life. I commented on this recently in another thread, as  reproduced in part below. I note that the graphs don't show the tapering off for frequencies above 6kHz, which would even more pronounced than the tapering off at 6kHz!

Well, you're talking to a doctor with hearing loss, so let's just say I'm aware of this, and I regularly go to live concerts and always chose the seats closer because I preferred the sound there even when I was 20. But that doesn't answer the actual question I asked - we all know our hearing is affected over time, but does a live acoustic performance sound subjectively worse now?

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On 18/06/2021 at 6:32 AM, Ittaku said:

I regularly go to live concerts and always chose the seats closer because I preferred the sound there even when I was 20.

I have always preferred seats close up, particularly for listening to the soloist.

 

On 18/06/2021 at 6:32 AM, Ittaku said:

but does a live acoustic performance sound subjectively worse now?

As is the case for most people, I can remember sound in extreme detail for only about 3 seconds!  However the level of emotional excitement, and the general impression,  can be remembered for decades; well at least to an approximation!

 

Let me express it this way. If I am seated well to the back of the auditorium, these days the sound seems horribly lacking in treble and generally faint.  I can say fairly confidently that from that seating position the live experience is so diminished that it is not a patch on what it was when I was in my 20s. (I'm now in my 60s.)  But at a closer seating position I find the live experience still very worthwhile indeed, and exciting.

 

People who accompany me can vary in their hearing, and many have more impaired hearing than I have.   If I say things like the following to a person in their 50s, or older:

  • "the air-conditioning noise was a bit intrusive, don't you think?"
  • "I wish the first violinist wouldn't sniff quite so loudly" [a technique to enable the other players in a small ensemble to come in at the same time]

there's a good chance I'll draw a blank. What was annoying to me, was not even noticeable for them!  Despite that, they keep attending live concerts, and say they enjoy them.

Edited by MLXXX
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