protecon Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 Hey Guys Been toying with the idea of running a valve pre, instead of the SS one I'm currently using in conjunction with a couple of SS monoblocks. The class A monoblocks are extremely transparent and almost a little too clinical, especially when sometimes paired up to some electrostatics. Thought I could "warm" up the sound with a decent valve preamp and get the best of both worlds? Having a bit of difficulty trying to satisfy all of my requirements and end up sacrificing one major component just to tick the other boxes when shopping around. Main requirements would have to be; - Valve (preferably no sneaky opamps in there) - Remote (volume and source controlled aka girlfriend friendly) - Balanced outputs (only input on monoblocks) - Price (I'd be lying if I didn't include this!) Had a bit of a look around Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, Cary Audio etc and seems like trying to satisfy the balanced design requirement is shifting the focus away from possibly better line stage models? Any other recommendations I should be looking at? Cheers
proftournesol Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 protecon, are your mono blocks actually balanced (the circuitry) or do they just have XLR plugs on them?
protecon Posted June 27, 2011 Author Posted June 27, 2011 Yeah bit silly to say price was a factor without saying how much lol Probably looking around $3k but willing to increase that depending on features/quality. Don't really want to shell out $9k for a LS26 only to go back to using SS pre, if unsatisfied. The monoblocks are running full balanced circuitry (why I wanted to take advantage of a balanced pre), or is it not worth the trouble?
2Brix Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 I guess you've also considered their LS17 model which has very good press reviews. Within your preferred budget Vincent Audio do a balanced pre with rrp around $2500 Unfortunately i haven't seen either of these on display in Perth. Cheers, Ed
Quark Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 I'm running one of these: www.osbornloudspeakers.com.au/stereoknight/enigma.html - meets most of your criteria (price is marginal) and I've been pleased with it. Price here: www.osbornloudspeakers.com.au/stereoknight/skmain.html A review: www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=771 Greg will normally do a 30 day trial with cost limited to freight.
proftournesol Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 I'd agree with Quark that StereoKnight make some great quality stuff at any price. You can look at the Enigma, better with the separate power supply, or just remove most of the guts and look at a fully balanced dual mono Silverstone B&R passive. I've tried the Vincent in my system - lots of dynamics but bloated bass and no detail (IMHO of course).
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 Main requirements would have to be; - Valve (preferably no sneaky opamps in there) You would be better advised to examine a range of preamps, in your price range, without regard to technology. The choice of valves (or transistors) may not be the solution. - Remote (volume and source controlled aka girlfriend friendly) Fair enough. - Balanced outputs (only input on monoblocks) Not necessary. Balanced systems are only required in very noisy environments. It is simple enough to connect an unbalanced preamp to a balanced power amp. Watch impedances though! I suggest you exclude this factor from your choice. If the preamp has balanced outputs, then fine. If it doesn't, there will be no penalty, sound-wise. - Price (I'd be lying if I didn't include this!) ?
protecon Posted June 27, 2011 Author Posted June 27, 2011 You would be better advised to examine a range of preamps, in your price range, without regard to technology. The choice of valves (or transistors) may not be the solution. Yeah you could be spot on - I've been meaning to get into the city to demo a few options. I used to visit Frank Prowse when it was down the road but since that moved, I'm not up to speed with local stores. Popped in to see Scott at IQ and he recommended this model which seems to tick most boxes. Not necessary. Balanced systems are only required in very noisy environments. It is simple enough to connect an unbalanced preamp to a balanced power amp. Watch impedances though! I suggest you exclude this factor from your choice. If the preamp has balanced outputs, then fine. If it doesn't, there will be no penalty, sound-wise. Yeah I'm currently running 6ft RCA interconnects with RCA>XLR adaptors with no audible noise problems - I guess I could drop that requirement (it certainly would expand the available considerations!). Thanks for the suggestions.
snaggs Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 What are you running at the moment? You really can't get away from having to spend some $$$ on a pre-amp eventually. Daniel.
Full Range Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 My advise is to get sponsor Earle Weston to make one for you FR
Guest Bodhisattva Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 (edited) Hey GuysBeen toying with the idea of running a valve pre, instead of the SS one I'm currently using in conjunction with a couple of SS monoblocks. The class A monoblocks are extremely transparent and almost a little too clinical, especially when sometimes paired up to some electrostatics. Thought I could "warm" up the sound with a decent valve preamp and get the best of both worlds? Having a bit of difficulty trying to satisfy all of my requirements and end up sacrificing one major component just to tick the other boxes when shopping around. Main requirements would have to be; - Valve (preferably no sneaky opamps in there) - Remote (volume and source controlled aka girlfriend friendly) - Balanced outputs (only input on monoblocks) - Price (I'd be lying if I didn't include this!) Had a bit of a look around Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, Cary Audio etc and seems like trying to satisfy the balanced design requirement is shifting the focus away from possibly better line stage models? Any other recommendations I should be looking at? Cheers Just to throw another herring in the ring Prot, I am currently using an Ayon CD-5s tube cdp as my digital source, dac & tube pre-amp. The CD-5s has an extremely well done tube pre-amp with 4x 6h30EB tubes and a true balanced output stage fed by a massive Class A power supply with bridge tube rectification. I recently did an a-b shootout vs an Aesthetix Janus tube pre and my CD-5s paddled it's tail (review coming soon), and that is a $9k pre over here! There are op amps in the CD-5s, however they can be upgraded at minimal expense such as to eliminate the usual gripes associated with op amps. Another thing which hits you when you read up on this player is it's exceptional figures, indicating well executed circuit topology. The Ayon is made in Austria & is a very well sorted player. See pic below; the 5s has 2 inputs (one single ended & one balanced, plus analogue outs (eg: sub). There are an array of digital inputs as you can see. There is also further potential to roll the tubes & op amps as I mentioned. Unless you're planning on buying $25-30k monoblocks anytime soon, it is doubtful you would need or want a better pre than this, and you're shortening the signal path and saving one pc & a pair of balanced ic's in the process. Plus you could sell your current cdp & dac and just use the one unit. Less components usually = better WAF as well. I noticed you mentioned CJ in your list above. One of the comments my AE Dallas Clarke (Clarke Audio) made when he inspected my CD-5s was that whoever designed that player must have had a good look inside a CJ pre-amp. The CD-5s has big polypro caps & plenty of tubes like a CJ. The sounds is certainly sweet, though I would say less euphonic than CJ. Here is a link to Ayon's product page fyi. Cheers, Bodhi Edited June 27, 2011 by Bodhisattva
maximus Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 +1 for the Ayon Bodhi, nearly stretched to it. Settled for the Bladelius idun due to cost. Hasn't Dalami got a Modwright LS100 for sale. Protecon it might be worth giving him a call. This is one brilliant pre. As good as it gets IMO.
Chewbacker Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 How much does this CD5S Cost landed ? Looks (and sounds) interesting...
Jliang70 Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 How much does this CD5S Cost landed ?Looks (and sounds) interesting... More than $10000, I don't know why people suggest a product costing 3 times of the budget of OP. Ayon has great CD/pre in CD5 but it is way beyond the budget. Preamp like the one made by Weston Acoustics or Melody 1688 ( is PMG still the main distributor for Melody ?) are more appropirate suggestions.
soundfan Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 More than $10000, I don't know why people suggest a product costing 3 times of the budget of OP. Ayon has great CD/pre in CD5 but it is way beyond the budget. Preamp like the one made by Weston Acoustics or Melody 1688 ( is PMG still the main distributor for Melody ?) are more appropirate suggestions. I'm with you. As good as the Ayon may be, I'm sure for the OP's budget he would be better off buying a dedicated pre.
Guest Bodhisattva Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 I'm with you.As good as the Ayon may be, I'm sure for the OP's budget he would be better off buying a dedicated pre. The CD-5s should not be taken as a $10k preamp, but rather as a world-class tube cdp, dac & pre-amp. In that sense it is a tremendous value, but this is just another option, and yes may be out of the OP's price range.
Graywulf Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 Yeah bit silly to say price was a factor without saying how much lolProbably looking around $3k but willing to increase that depending on features/quality. Don't really want to shell out $9k for a LS26 only to go back to using SS pre, if unsatisfied. The monoblocks are running full balanced circuitry (why I wanted to take advantage of a balanced pre), or is it not worth the trouble? I'd suggest looking at the Ming Da pre-amps, or although it looks a bit indistrial with the cage fitted, I own an Antique Soundlabs aq10006 (now the 2006) all it needed was the 2 main caps replaced on the pre amp..... a bloody good pre, very open and detailed... although I am using Valve monoblocs
MrBurns84 Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 There is a Weston Acoustics "Tune" preamp that is for sale in the Classifieds. Worth a look.
hgholden Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 anyone know much about the Monarchy Audio NM24, its got great wraps as a pre-amp and does other things as well. Its within the budget. hg
The Hun Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 Hi Protecon I have a Cary 98 SLP and think they are brilliant - very occasionally you see them second hand - I love it dearly - I have listened to many pre's (new. secondhand and other peoples) and the most recent very positive surprise was a ME25 (yes I know they many converts - but it was astounding for the money Regards Peter
ozcal Posted June 28, 2011 Posted June 28, 2011 Hi P , we have our own valve pre amp manufacturer he in WA in the form of Supratek : http://www.supratek.biz/ Prices are very reasonable for the sound quality and the design can be customised to your requirements. Gordon
metal beat Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 Go to the caxton audio web site and have a look at the used /specials on conrad johnson pre aps. He has a few I think.
maximus Posted June 30, 2011 Posted June 30, 2011 Sorry Protecon got the cd-05 mixed up with cd-7. Can't go wrong with all above mentioned. Just a matter of trying out. Have heard a CJ setup with 2905 Quads...Sublime. Ya just gotta put up with the guy in the brown suit, can't remember his name.
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