Issues with new Cambridge CXN V2 ... firstly, Spotify Premium

[gregmacc]

I've just purchased and setup the unit. It's my first experience with streamers/network players. Prior to the CXN I was streaming Spotify Premium from my mobile phone to a HP Mini Notebook ... USB to Schitt Bifrost Multibit DAC and on to the rest of my system ... sounded great. However, with the CXN V2 in the system (HP Notebook and Schitt Bifrost removed) the sound is flat. Much like what I remember standard Spotify to sound like on my system. I doubt that it's just the difference between the CXN's on-board DAC and the Bifrost because when I play 44.1/16 FLAC files from the CXN's front USB thumb drive port it sounds great. 

In the Spotify settings on my phone, when the CXN is selected as the playback device,  several of the options are greyed out and not available ... including the music quality options. Is that telling me something? Any similar experiences? Remedies?

 

[Hi-Fi Whipped]

Unfortunately no experience with the cxn but a couple of things that may help:

 

you are not playing the music from your phone, you are throwing it from the phone to the cxn and then controlling the spotify software in the cxn from the phone. The cxn would already have the highest output settings as default.

 

spotify premium doesn't improve the sound quality, just the user experience by being able to create playlists etc.

 

i do have the same streaming module in my CXR200 and there's no special settings to stream spotify and you should be in the same boat.

 

if you still have the bitfrost maybe output the signal from the CXN via digital to see if the sound is more to your liking.

[gregmacc]

Thanks for the reply Hi-Fi Whipped ... I'll take your point about the way the streaming actually works ... but as far as I am aware Spotify Premium is streamed at 320 kbps and free Spotify is streamed at a lower (maximum) rate ... but I could be wrong. I still have the Bifrost and my next move was going to be as you suggest ... but would be disappointed in the analogue Spotify output from the CXN if the Bifrost sounded significantly better. 

Edited December 28, 2019 by gregmacc

[Wimbo]

10 minutes ago, gregmacc said:

Thanks for the reply Hi-Fi Whipped ... I'll take your point about the way the streaming actually works ... but as far as I am aware Spotify Premium is streamed at 320 kbps and free Spotify is streamed at a lower (maximum) rate ... but I could be wrong. I still have the Bifrost and my next move was going to be as you suggest ... but would be disappointed in the analogue Spotify output from the CXN if the Bifrost sounded significantly better. 

Yes, Spotify Premium is streamed at the higher Bitrate but you have to select it.

[blakey72]

Are you signed in to Spotify?

[Hi-Fi Whipped]

1 hour ago, Wimbo said:

Yes, Spotify Premium is streamed at the higher Bitrate but you have to select it.

Ok my bad

[gregmacc]

Wimbo ... thanks for the reply ... thought so re the Premium higher bitrate than free. As things are at the moment the music quality/bitrate is not selectable (it's greyed out and says "not available now") on the phone app when the CXN is selected as the playback device. All settings are available on the app when any other playback device is selected.

 

[blakey72]

2 minutes ago, gregmacc said:

Wimbo ... thanks for the reply ... thought so re the Premium higher bitrate than free. As things are at the moment the music quality/bitrate is not selectable (it's greyed out and says "not available now") on the phone app when the CXN is selected as the playback device. All settings are available on the app when any other playback device is selected.

 

Yeah just having a look on mine and the same thing happens. I'm sure I had this trouble at the start also and I can't remember how I fixed it. I have the CXN V1

[gregmacc]

Cheers blakey72 ... yep, signed in ... 

So are you saying you had the non-selectable music quality issue and now it's there? ... did you feel the sound quality was initially not great but is now good?

Edited December 28, 2019 by gregmacc

[blakey72]

Yeah there was something I did that changed the quality. I think I had to read through manuals and google to find out how. And yeah the quality improved. There's nothing wrong with the quality on mine so fear not.

[gregmacc]

hmmmmm ... so hope you are right 

[blakey72]

After doing some reading it says it should be 320k automatically. Not sure now, it could have been Tidal I had trouble with.

[blakey72]

Make sure all the software/apps are up to date. 

[blakey72]

So does it really sound yuck?

[Kaynin]

Spotify greys out those areas you mention when you're listening on another device.  The CA CXN has Spotify "Connect".  This is a direct Spotify stream through your internet to the CXN and not, alternatively, being "cast" from your phone to the CXN.  I'm not familiar with you Bifrost set-up, but I doubt it's a "Connect" stream based on what you've said. 

 

I've compared between casting between my iDevice (Airplay) and Spotify Connect, and the Connect is a far better result.  I choose that every single time.

 

TBO, I'd suggest that the Spotify Connect is a sound you're not used to.  I'd say that the Bifrost set-up has colouration which you like or have become accustomed to but, as I said, I'm not familiar with that set-up.

 

[blakey72]

Which app are you using?

[gregmacc]

I'm using Spotify for Android  and/or Cambridge Connect for Android ... they are both behaving the same.

[Wimbo]

I'm using Moode now through a Rasberry PI 4 into a Topping D10.

Prefer it to Tidal but that might be the coloration I like. Prefer my Vinyl to both of course.

[blakey72]

1 hour ago, gregmacc said:

I'm using Spotify for Android  and/or Cambridge Connect for Android ... they are both behaving the same.

Yeah I use the same...From what I've read the phone only acts as a remote. All the settings and streaming is done by the CXN. That's probably why the settings are greyed out. On the Spotify for Android I set my streaming to extreme before connecting to the CXN. Then when it comes up grey it's showing Extreme. Probably doesn't change the settings on the CXN though. Does it sound 'brighter' through the Cambridge? You said it sounded dull?

[TD19]

This is what I see from Spotify Premium on Samsung T350 tablet -> Spotify Connect on Antipodes server -> iFi Micro DSD:

 

 

There is some discussion here about how 320kbps gets to be 44.1/16:

 

https://forum.psaudio.com/t/spotify-cd-quality/9105

 

Edited December 28, 2019 by TD19

[gregmacc]

36 minutes ago, blakey72 said:

Yeah I use the same...From what I've read the phone only acts as a remote. All the settings and streaming is done by the CXN. That's probably why the settings are greyed out. On the Spotify for Android I set my streaming to extreme before connecting to the CXN. Then when it comes up grey it's showing Extreme. Probably doesn't change the settings on the CXN though.

... As Kaynin has said and after a closer look I can confirm this greying-out is normal and makes sense ... when I think it through.  Nevertheless, the sound of Spotify Premium from the CXN is flat to my ears compared to my Notebook to Schitt Bifrost via USB. It sounds like a reduced bitrate mp3 ... no depth or sparkle ... vocals are not as clear. I will experiment with playing from the optical CXN output to the Bifrost and get back here with "my perception" of the results

 

47 minutes ago, blakey72 said:

Does it sound 'brighter' through the Cambridge? You said it sounded dull?

... not sure what you mean here ... do you mean the Cambridge app? and if so ... no ... I think we agree that the Cambridge Connect app and the Spotify Android app are merely acting as remote controls ... using either to control the inbuilt Spotify Connect in the CXN sounds equally disappointing. 

[blakey72]

2 hours ago, gregmacc said:

... As Kaynin has said and after a closer look I can confirm this greying-out is normal and makes sense ... when I think it through.  Nevertheless, the sound of Spotify Premium from the CXN is flat to my ears compared to my Notebook to Schitt Bifrost via USB. It sounds like a reduced bitrate mp3 ... no depth or sparkle ... vocals are not as clear. I will experiment with playing from the optical CXN output to the Bifrost and get back here with "my perception" of the results

 

... not sure what you mean here ... do you mean the Cambridge app? and if so ... no ... I think we agree that the Cambridge Connect app and the Spotify Android app are merely acting as remote controls ... using either to control the inbuilt Spotify Connect in the CXN sounds equally disappointing. 

Sorry I wasn't clear with what I said. I find the CXN dacs are a little brighter than the other Topping D10 and Schiit Modi dacs I have. It's strange that you don't get any sparkle. It really shouldn't sound dull, should be the other end from what mine sounds like. Has to be a setting somewhere, I'm just not sure where.

[Bunno77]

I never used Spotify with the CXN

but know the CXN reasonably well. 

Have you updated the unit? 

 

Is there a menu on the CXN to select the bit rate for Spotify? Maybe in the app? 

 

Try to Chromecast Spotify rather than Spotify Connect to see if there is a difference. 

 

You could always connect a PC via USB just to see if there is a difference too. 

 

[blakey72]

4 minutes ago, Bunno77 said:

You could always connect a PC via USB just to see if there is a difference too. 

 

Yeah that is what I'd do. Just get a printer cable and hook it up to a lappy. TBH I only use the CXN for general listening with Spotify connect. Sound quality is still good to my ears and not dull as described. But for serious listening I use Tidal from my lappy to a Topping D10 via 5m of this. Usually try to find the music in MQA but HiFi is also good. 

 

Doesn't help your problem though. I found this which says that all hardware streams at 320bps with Spotify connect. Not sure what's going on with you CXN. I'm still looking. 

[blakey72]

I've read V1 and V2 manuals and there's nothing. Got me stumped...