Tweaky Posted July 4, 2019 Posted July 4, 2019 I thought about getting a smart trainer ages ago, but stationary riding whilst looking at a the readout of a Garmin screen or the like, seemed like boredom personified. I've never tried Zwift, I suppose it must have something going for it since so many use it, but to me it just seems too much like a video game, fine for some, but I already play a lot of video games, I wanted a different experience. What finally changed my mind was the way Veloreality goes about indoor training. I'd read about it a few year ago, but it's not one you see mentioned in cycling circles very often. Since the actual software is free, and I had nothing better to do the other day, I thought I might as well finally download and install it and see if it is actually any good.......it is, and it was the reason I went and bought a Wahoo Kickr Snap the next day [The reason I didn't go with a Kickr CORE or Kickr18 is I know I'd get sick of taking the wheel off to mount the bike to either of those trainers, and then putting back on again, and there would be a strong possibility that the bike might end up permanently mated to the trainer,....which is a definite no-no for several reasons] So what's different about Veloreality's V-Ride software you might be thinking, well as far a metrics go, nothing really. I've already got a Garmin 820 with speed/cadence and heart rate monitor, and the Kickr Snap provides a relatively accurate metering of my power output, so all that is needed is a ANT+ USB dongle [with a USB extension cord to run it close to the bikes ANT unit from the PC], all these parameters are shown on screen at the same time when running V-ride, plus quite a few more. First of all V-Ride is a PC program, you can run it on a MAC under Duel boot/BOOTCAMP. What is different about it is that it uses special cycling videos of some of the best and famous cycling routes in the world, these videos are available at the Veloreality website, it's basically what they make their money on......I worked out on average, at current exchange rates, each video costs around AUS$18 All of the videos are available in 1080p, and all of the latest ones they have done are also available in 4k. You can buy individual videos in 1080p and download them, or buy HD's with a mass of rides already preloaded onto them, but the 4K versions are ONLY available preloaded onto 1TB or 2TB HD's. which makes them pricey. Imagine a camera mounted to the front of your bike whilst you were riding Alp D'huez, and all the gradient /distance etc info was embedded into the video as you were riding the course, then when you played that video back to ride along to it, that same info was sent to your smart trainer so you got the same experience again......if you ride slower or faster the video plays back to match your speed.....that's basically is what's different about Veloreality. There is lot's of other neat things you can do with the software, like taking the metrics from different sections of several different videos and making your own 'Super Course'. Well worth downloading and trying it out. When you download the software there is a small 1080p video included with it that loops [3.5GB] some rural area of Holland I think, you can test both if it will work on your PC and your smart trainer....works with most Wahoo, TACX etc, or any pretty much any other trainer that is compatible with ANT+™ FE-C profile. There is also a free 4K test video you can download [3.5GB].....somewhere in UTAH, looks similar to Monument Valley , this is more to test if your PC/MAC is up to the task of playing the 4K versions back, a RED/YELLOW or GREEN light will appear in the software HUD to tell you how well your PC is doing. I've got a i7 with 32GB RAM and a Nvidia GTX970 and had no problem playing the 4K video, I guess these propitiatory 4K videos don't carry the 4k HDCP that 4K Blurays and games do, that need the HDMI 2.2 compatibility I was running this PC into my 65" 4K TV, so it was already upscaling the 1080p to 4K which I though looked impressive anyway, but when I finally had finished downloading the 4K video and played it back it was jaw droppingly good. You can find out everything you need to know from the website below. I'd strongly recommend you download the software's manual first and read it before installing, preferably on a drive other than your C/: drive.....make a new folder on a different drive [call it V-Ride], download the zipped software and place it in that folder, then right click and select extract files here. Once that's done, in that same folder, create a new folder and name in Downloaded videos or something similar. The software and first 1080p test video will install on your C/: Drive, but any further video you download will ask you where you want to download them to, that why you made that Downloaded Videos folder on the other HD, download the 4K video to that folder if you want to try it out [well worth it if you think your PC is up to it] https://veloreality.com/products/trainer-software/
blybo Posted July 4, 2019 Posted July 4, 2019 There are others that do this. I use Zwift via Apple TV to a 55” tv and a TACX Neo. We put an industrial fan on the wall and works well to keep heat in check. 2
Tweaky Posted July 4, 2019 Author Posted July 4, 2019 15 minutes ago, blybo said: There are others that do this. I use Zwift via Apple TV to a 55” tv and a TACX Neo. We put an industrial fan on the wall and works well to keep heat in check. Looks like a pretty permanent setup you have there blybo....a very nice thing to have. I see you have used what seems to be remnants of several different bikes and builds for your stationary unit [Cyclecross front wheel, Frame with lugs for direct pull rear brakes] I can't seem to work out that White cable running from your handlebars to the rear of your bike is doing, or what it is connected to ? Have you ever tried those TACX Videos ? I was interested in them for a while, but from what I read at the time, it meant pretty much buying into TACX hardware/software system as a whole if you wanted to use them to their full ability, that sort of put me off......reminds me too much of the Audio equivalent of DAT/ MINIDISC [Insert format that not longer exists or is used] I could use ZWIFT if I ever choose to do so with V-Ride [never say never], the same applies for other software. The thing missing from the Veloreality videos is sound. Now I know that might seem strange, but audio clues make as much of an experience as visual ones........they need some sort of ambient sound field to be played with them to give the sense of space. Currently I'm improvising by experimenting listening to internet radio stations streamed from the areas the videos are from, whilst riding a video. It can be quite funny listening to traffic and weather details in Italian or French, and then listening to what music is popular ATM in those countries
Mendes Posted July 4, 2019 Posted July 4, 2019 (edited) Keep it simple Sergio My indoor gym, a big fan of resisting gravity Why?...........because it works. Edited July 5, 2019 by Mendes spellig 2
blybo Posted July 4, 2019 Posted July 4, 2019 @Tweaky Yes the room is now a permanent cardio room with occasional office duties. The bike is a Soma Double Cross. Custom build with Sram cable disc brakes (before Hydro was available). The White cables are Yokozuma shift and brake cables, they are brilliant cables if you ever need a set. At the time of the build you could not buy an "off the peg" disc road bike. It was used for many years as a commuter with pannier and also to tow a Chariot trailer when my girls were toddlers. Now it used as a gravel bike when out with the family with 40mm tubless gravel tyres. I've kept it 10 speed (Sram Rival and X10 mtb combo) as my wifes road bike is also 10 speed and we can swap the bikes over. 1 downside of a wheel-less trainer is compatibility. I really enjoy the "game" aspect of Zwift. I can ride virtually with a mate that now lives in QLD, I can test my self on timed sprint or climb segments, join group rides etc etc. With a Neo I can also feel when riding on gravel or over rough boards, so makes it a little bit more realistic. I find the competitiveness of the game makes me push harder and for longer than I ever would on a normal trainer We have a iMac in the room as well so even though Zwift does have ambient sounds I can play Roon thru the inbuilt speakers or sometimes use a Bose bluetooth speaker. The treadmill also has an older Apple TV in front of it so can also watch a GCN show while riding Zwift if just turning the legs over.
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted July 5, 2019 Volunteer Posted July 5, 2019 Interesting thread. I’ve never managed to stick with any kind of indoor training. I’ve had and sold treadmills, wind trainers, weights etc must say the swift-type thing is intriguing though
blybo Posted July 5, 2019 Posted July 5, 2019 2 hours ago, Sir Sanders Zingmore said: Interesting thread. I’ve never managed to stick with any kind of indoor training. I’ve had and sold treadmills, wind trainers, weights etc must say the swift-type thing is intriguing though I never could either... and to be honest I don't use Zwift as much as I should, but I can easily do a pretty tough hour session on it (they even have training plans and workouts built in) whereas on a normal trainer I want off after 20 minutes, hated them with a passion. There are thousands of riders around the world riding at most times so you don't feel alone and you can even draft people to get a break, amazing technology. I used to regularly ride with my QLD mate and draft him for an entire 1 hour session because he's fitter than me and chat via mobile with my wireless Apple Airpods. Almost like riding together for real.
Tweaky Posted July 5, 2019 Author Posted July 5, 2019 12 hours ago, blybo said: I never could either... and to be honest I don't use Zwift as much as I should, but I can easily do a pretty tough hour session on it (they even have training plans and workouts built in) whereas on a normal trainer I want off after 20 minutes, hated them with a passion. There are thousands of riders around the world riding at most times so you don't feel alone and you can even draft people to get a break, amazing technology. I used to regularly ride with my QLD mate and draft him for an entire 1 hour session because he's fitter than me and chat via mobile with my wireless Apple Airpods. Almost like riding together for real. The technology IS truly amazing now days. While researching about this stuff, I came across a Blogger that had done a lot more research beforehand.....he's pretty much got a handle on everything that is available at the time of writing, or was in development...staggering amount of different software. http://darrencope.com/cycling-software/ I have just purchased, a 90 ride @1080P pre loaded HD from Veloreality....all 140+ rides are made available, you just choose which ones you want to be loaded onto the HD. After reviewing the difference between the test ride [1 at 1080p and the other at 4k] it seemed to me that my TV upscaled the 1080p signal so well, that purchasing the 4K versions wasn't really worth the premium [which is basically 35%-40% more over the 1080p versions] They have a 30% off 4th of July sale ATM, that runs until the 7th of July, so that's why I bit the bullet on this rather expensive purchase now, rather than buying rides separately and downloading them over months I suppose [each ride is 10-30GB]...with the lousy exchange rate, it ended up costing me more than the Kickr Snap at AUS $876 delivered, works out at $9.70 a video. I choose a wide variety of rides across Spain, Italy, France, Belgium, Ireland, USA and the Canary Islands ...no UK rides available strangely enough. I avoided buying some of the really torturous rides....I thought what's the point, they are too challenging at my age [I can still manage to do the Sydney 2000 Olympic RR course which is in my neighborhood....12-32 cassette helps with those steep but short climbs], I'm after variety more than anything else
Tweaky Posted July 8, 2019 Author Posted July 8, 2019 I just got a email from Veloreality regarding my purchase of a HD preloaded with 90 rides of my choice. Your drive got copied on the weekend. You purchased 90 rides, they are all on the drive. We filled it with all our other rides, including some in the 500 series that will be released end of August. There are 300+ videos on the drive, although only your package of 90 will be licensed. For the rest, we provide the media in case you are tempted to rid some others in the future. Your tracking is with Canada Post, at canadapost.com That's brilliant news that I wasn't expecting, as after I reviewed my ride selection after the order was placed, I found that I had only ordered 3 rides out of the 5 that make up the Grand Tour of the Amalfi Coast. I also guess they must of put them all on a 2TB HD instead of a 1TB one that was part of the order, as I'm not sure they would all fit on a 1TB drive. It's smart business practice by them I suppose, as it's so very tempting to just purchase the codes to make the locked videos available, rather than having to download them at a later date, it also saves having to stuff about with a specialized download manager program that they recommend using due to the file sizes. The only PITA is going to be now making up a further 210+ ride descriptions in a word document. I spent 12 hours over the weekend doing so for the 90 I have got. My preference is to have all the individual rides printed out in a folder so I can see what distance / difficulty / where they are / what terrain etc is available before I start looking for them on the HD, as trying to remember that when just viewing a file name isn't very likely , at least at first , plus it makes it easier for anybody else who wants to give it a try a visual representation of what they would be up for. Looks like Google Earth is going to get a huge workout over the coming months as I make the individual routes up.
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted August 13, 2021 Volunteer Posted August 13, 2021 Coming back to this old thread. I’m thinking of getting an indoor trainer thingie. A friend bought a Wahoo Kikr Snap recently and is pretty happy with it. He’s paired it with zwift as well. my question… what are the alternatives or is wahoo/zwift the best hardware/software combination?
Guest thethrowback Posted August 13, 2021 Posted August 13, 2021 (edited) On 04/07/2019 at 8:24 PM, blybo said: There are others that do this. I use Zwift via Apple TV to a 55” tv and a TACX Neo. We put an industrial fan on the wall and works well to keep heat in check. There is only one thing missing: Edited August 13, 2021 by thethrowback
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted August 14, 2021 Volunteer Posted August 14, 2021 19 hours ago, sir sanders zingmore said: Coming back to this old thread. I’m thinking of getting an indoor trainer thingie. A friend bought a Wahoo Kikr Snap recently and is pretty happy with it. He’s paired it with zwift as well. my question… what are the alternatives or is wahoo/zwift the best hardware/software combination? There must be some indoor cyclists on SNA, surely?
eso Posted August 14, 2021 Posted August 14, 2021 Wahoo kikr, ipad on a stand. Big mother of a fan. Works well for me. I’ve previously used other roller type trainers but rear cassette based ones feel more realistic. Haven’t blind tested though 1
buzz lightyear Posted August 15, 2021 Posted August 15, 2021 On 13/08/2021 at 6:05 PM, thethrowback said: There is only one thing missing: Haha best time of the year great for sprint workout sessions. Down My way we ride out to Little River there is one particular Maggie that’s extremely aggressive strikes repeatedly lol.
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted August 15, 2021 Volunteer Posted August 15, 2021 5 hours ago, eso said: Wahoo kikr, ipad on a stand. Big mother of a fan. Works well for me. I’ve previously used other roller type trainers but rear cassette based ones feel more realistic. Haven’t blind tested though I assume you mean a kikr or a kikr core (but not a “snap”). What’s the difference between them? and do you use Zwift on the iPad or some other software?
buzz lightyear Posted August 15, 2021 Posted August 15, 2021 (edited) 23 hours ago, sir sanders zingmore said: There must be some indoor cyclists on SNA, surely? I bought My Tacx Flux 2 during last years lock down. It was the only one I could get at the time due to shortages of smart trainers. These days I just use it for 1/2 hour workout sessions. More cardio and strength training it’s done wonders. Zwift is ok it’s what I mainly use . As in different trainers I’m sure there is better but I will kill this trainer before I decide to upgrade. During last years LD I was roped in doing a 100km in door session. Never again one of the most boring time wasting ride. But I prefer out doors riding, like I said it’s great for those times when one hasn’t got a lot of time. Just crank up some metal tunes and go hard Edited August 15, 2021 by buzz lightyear 1
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted August 15, 2021 Volunteer Posted August 15, 2021 3 minutes ago, buzz lightyear said: But I prefer out doors riding, like I said it’s great for those times when one hasn’t got a lot of time. I much prefer outdoors too, I guess I’m looking for something for when I don’t have a lot of time and want more of a “spin class” type workout 1
buzz lightyear Posted August 15, 2021 Posted August 15, 2021 2 minutes ago, sir sanders zingmore said: I much prefer outdoors too, I guess I’m looking for something for when I don’t have a lot of time and want more of a “spin class” type workout https://gplama.com/tag/smart-trainer/ This is guy does some great reviews, top guy met him at a Daylesford organised ride. I can’t complain for what I use mine for. Sure has improved my fitness especially leading up to the criterium season. 1
eso Posted August 15, 2021 Posted August 15, 2021 I use the smart trainer not the core. No experience with the newer core unfortunately. I don’t do much spin type sessions but plenty available. I’ve used zwift and fulgaz on the i pad. Zwift can be quite addictive when riding against you buddies. Unfortunately more sculduggery than past tour cheating. I found setting up a real pain and a deterrent to having a session. Ideally have a semi permanent setup with old bike. With the smart trainer you can set the trainer software to simulate loads, so don’t use gears. Not my prefered option but makes riding a clunker instead of your usual road bike possible.
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted August 15, 2021 Volunteer Posted August 15, 2021 25 minutes ago, eso said: I use the smart trainer not the core. Sorry for the dumb questions but on the Wahoo website “smart trainer” refers to the Kikr, the KikrCore and the KikrSnap. So I’m not sure which one you actually use? Also , with the Kikr and the KikrCore do you need to buy a cassette separately?
buzz lightyear Posted August 15, 2021 Posted August 15, 2021 Most trainers will need to purchase a cassette, just buy the cheaper cassette eg shimano 105. Depending what you run easy to set up . I think 99bikes have the kickr set up for trial. I know the one down my way used to.
eso Posted August 15, 2021 Posted August 15, 2021 Apologies, I use the kickr, the one with the large flywheel. Unfortunately you need to buy a rear cassette. I suppose it makes sense as you need to match the gear set on your bike. I just used my old cassette off my rear wheel and bought a new one for road use. 1
buzz lightyear Posted August 15, 2021 Posted August 15, 2021 Probably not the right place to post. Would be great to organise a SNA group ride in spring. Down famous beach Rd Sunday morning.
blybo Posted August 16, 2021 Posted August 16, 2021 On 13/08/2021 at 5:47 PM, sir sanders zingmore said: Coming back to this old thread. I’m thinking of getting an indoor trainer thingie. A friend bought a Wahoo Kikr Snap recently and is pretty happy with it. He’s paired it with zwift as well. my question… what are the alternatives or is wahoo/zwift the best hardware/software combination? From my understanding the Tacx Neo or Neo 2 is the most realistic and also allows you to pedal or freewheel downhill realistically as well. But also the most expensive unless you go the whole hog and get a smart stationary bike. Most people use Zwift as the software is regularly updated and incorporates gaming like features to keep you entertained and distracted. If you just use something to simulate riding in the country or up a hill, you will get bored or uncomfortable pretty quick. Zwift also incorporates group riding facilities and races. I've also ridden with my best mate a few times during lockdown... even though he lives on the Gold Coast now. Here is a list of supported "direct drive" trainers which will give you more of the full Zwift experience https://support.zwift.com/en_us/direct-drive-trainers-B1oH2meS You will really want an industrial style fan!!! 1
blybo Posted August 16, 2021 Posted August 16, 2021 (edited) I spent the $$$ on the Neo because it was the quietest... and because it's the only one that simulates different riding surfaces in game, but then the need for a noisy industrial fan makes the quietness of it a bit pointless. If you have a AC unit in the room you ride a quiet machine might be more important. We are considering upgrading our stationary bike to a smart one, so I could be in the market to sell my trainer, which would have had less than 100 hrs use. Edited August 16, 2021 by blybo 1
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