fatmansings Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 I'm wanting to get the best dac for my $ which is around the $3-$5k mark depending on how well I manage the missus. I want the dac in a streaming setup, currently using a touch, rdac, slee headphone amp and some grados and senns 650s. Speakers can come next year. I like female vocal, jazzy stuff and like a crystal clear sound rather than the warmish tuby sounds. I was considering a linn magic DSi or an olive but as I have the streaming and the storage (XP PC) already I'm thinking maybe better to focus the $ on a dac only. Any suggestions on dacs or set ups would be appreciated. ps: prefer to buy thru a nz dealer if possible. Cheers
tkr001 Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 For a bit less than your budget is the Stello DA100 Signature. In 24/192 mode it exhibits the characteristics you like. Strawberry Sound in Ponsonby does them.
Ernie1553552694 Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 The PS Audio Perfectwave DAC is coming. A bit more than $5k. Should be good. Sim Audio @ around $3G. Also nice for the money.
NeilNZ Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 The PS will be closer to $6K I suspect... if not more. The Stello is nice as is the Moon stuff... its becoming a competitive sector of the market it seems.
Beeman Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Hi - How about my Wavelength - it is a wonderful machine http://72.34.51.41/~audioenz/forums/showthread.php?t=11013 I would be happy to audition it for you - cheers
King Size1553552683 Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 You should also consider the Naim DAC - it is at the top end of your price range but taking into account the information given in your post it should at least be on your audition list.
curiousgeorgenz Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Probably not available for audition, but Jason Parmenter could get Weiss DAC2 (pro audio version of Minerva NOT DAC202) for less than $5K. If you're willing take a bigger punt then the Wyred For Sound DAC-2 is getting lots of good press. You could land this in NZ for $2.5-3K. There was a Wavelength Cosecant for sale on Trade Me recently too.
Beeman Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Hey man - read the post 2 above I am offering the Wavelength Cosecant (the one on TM) I have never seen another in NZ. I am amazed by the lack of interest in it. I am considering looking for a Dac/preamp but will keep it & go the full upgrade path if no one jumps soon :rolleyes: Attached files
damocles Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 If you could find someone in NZ with an Audio-gd Ref 5 or Ref 7 DAC, try and have a listen. Audio-gd ship globally (note - may have to get these DACs electrically certified). I have heard the Ref 5 and was very impressed. Here is a blog (not mine) with some comments http://ravenda.wordpress.com/2010/06/20/audiogd-reference5/ (edit PCM1704UK may no longer be readily available)
Electra Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Cyrus DAC + is a very good option too - most people forget about the wee box brand, but their very, very good.
curiousgeorgenz Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Damocles;135123 wrote: If you could find someone in NZ with an Audio-gd Ref 5 or Ref 7 DAC, try and have a listen. Audio-gd ship globally (note - may have to get these DACs electrically certified). I have heard the Ref 5 and was very impressed. Here is a blog (not mine) with some comments http://ravenda.wordpress.com/2010/06/20/audiogd-reference5/ (edit PCM1704UK may no longer be readily available) Audio-gd have a distributor in NZ, http://www.intoaudio.co.nz/index.html
damocles Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 curious_george;135130 wrote: Audio-gd have a distributor in NZ, http://www.intoaudio.co.nz/index.html Nice - I would certainly recommend a listen then
fatmansings Posted October 9, 2010 Author Posted October 9, 2010 beeman;135105 wrote: Hi - How about my Wavelength - it is a wonderful machine it sure is a beauty but correct me if im wrong isnt it a specialist usb only dac ?. i need spdif for my logitech SB touch plus most of the dacs suggested above seem to have a range of connections which appeals to me if i decide to run other devices through it in the future. As for the dac suggestions, are any of them going to beat the pants off a linn DSi ? In my research today I saw that the perfect wave is the bees knees at the moment (NZ$6449) but when i scoured the forums there was debate on whether it was any better than a Linn so not really a clear and obvious winner there i think. Mind you those linn fans are pretty one eyed thats making me think that maybe I cant get a "super" dac for my $ so maybe the Linn is the best option. What do the experienced guys here think is going to give me the best SQ performance for my $.. linn or DAC ?
King Size1553552683 Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Linn, like most brands tend to have a 'house sound' (for want of a better phrase) that fans of the brand indentify with. Personally I find this sound lacking in emotion and musicality, however if you like it, it might just be the ticket for you. Some might prefer the Linn solution, others the Ayre, Bel Canto, Lavry, Naim, Stello, Wavelength, Weiss etc. As Neil notes it is a very competitive market, but they're are all different and everybody's tastes differ so the best thing you can do is draw up a list and audition the DACs on the list and see what you like/don't like and take it from there.
damocles Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Kingsize is right - find a few DACs you think you may like and take it from there. You may get a pleasant surprise. Also - this is a good forum http://www.head-fi.org/forum/list/7
Ernie1553552694 Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 fatmansings;135135 wrote: it sure is a beauty but correct me if im wrong isnt it a specialist usb only dac ?. i need spdif for my logitech SB touch plus most of the dacs suggested above seem to have a range of connections which appeals to me if i decide to run other devices through it in the future. As for the dac suggestions, are any of them going to beat the pants off a linn DSi ? In my research today I saw that the perfect wave is the bees knees at the moment (NZ$6449) but when i scoured the forums there was debate on whether it was any better than a Linn so not really a clear and obvious winner there i think. Mind you those linn fans are pretty one eyed thats making me think that maybe I cant get a "super" dac for my $ so maybe the Linn is the best option. What do the experienced guys here think is going to give me the best SQ performance for my $.. linn or DAC ? I guess Linn enthusiasts would say that. The PerfectWave is likely to be more versatile in the long run. It will synergise with more gear than the Linn. There is an adage out there that "Linn works best with Linn". That is fairly much the case, although there are guys and gals out there that mix and match. When you get to drop $5k+ on a piece of kit you should rightly expect it to work better, with out the tweaking and experimentation inherent with buying a DAC and accessories required to make your music sound good. Linn, Naim and PS Audio have interfaces that you can get started with from the get go. Linn has a number of iPhone apps to choose from. PS Audio has it's own streaming interface which will play nicely with Sonos and other UPnP based appliances. Naim have focussed more on the hardware and left the software development to a third party company. They are probably the least developed in this area. That said, Naim owners usually choose Naim for how it sounds. PM me if you like. I'd rather live a life less exciting at the moment. I don't have enough time to put my flame suit on.
kaka Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Damocles;135138 wrote: Kingsize is right - find a few DACs you think you may like and take it from there. You may get a pleasant surprise. Also - this is a good forum http://www.head-fi.org/forum/list/7 Traditionally the quality of advice of HeadFi is variable - I find Computer Audiophile useful There are some useful reviews there Interested to some of those Audio-Gd dacs use the Sabre32 chipset. Chris Connaker of Computer Audiophile really rates the new Weiss 202 which is based on that chipset, but of course implementation is everything.
fatmansings Posted October 10, 2010 Author Posted October 10, 2010 well after researching the dacs suggested above i think i have narrowed it down to a shortlist . Yes there are others but my head is bursting to the seams with DAC mumbo jumbo right now so need to unload my thoughts before I short circuit. PS Audio - fantastic reviews but $6.5k here i feel is overpriced (NZ$4.1K in the USA, NZ$5k in aussie ) is that a typical NZ price difference ? Wyred4Sound DAC2 - 6 moons reckon its a winner (Curious George reckons it can be brought here for $2.5 to 3k) so that seems like good value Audio-gd Ref 7 DAC - supposed to sound as good as $10k dacs for $2.7k Stello DA100 Sig - similar to the Audio --performs way above its price bracket and last but not least is the Berkeley Alpha, this DAC seemed to be the one reviewers were using as the benchmark comparison with many claiming it to be the best digital sound they had ever heard. I see a 2nd hand one on Audiogon for US$3900 (NZ$5200) . Thats in my budget but not sure about purchasing from some guy in CA and shipping and possible GST and damages and rip offs and not knowing what im doing etc etc etc so will probably just leave that for another year/s I guess i now need to go and listen to what i can. I only know so far of the stello and the ref 7 as being possible to demo.
eRaS1553552749 Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 Hi Fatman. There are a couple of DAC threads on StereoNet.au. The Wyred4Sound is compared to several other similar offerings. Consider also the Metric Halo LIO-8 which I hear is also very good, but I have not heard it myself. The ULN-2 is better priced, but not of the same family as the ULN-8/LIO-8 in terms of sound quality.
LHH Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 I have the Weiss DAC2 and it's a great DAC (and at the right price). It may be worth looking at, and the Metric Halo also. It has been my experience that you get a lot more for your money with Pro DACs, although you do miss out on the looks.
fatmansings Posted October 11, 2010 Author Posted October 11, 2010 eRaS;135176 wrote: Hi Fatman. There are a couple of DAC threads on StereoNet.au. The Wyred4Sound is compared to several other similar offerings. Consider also the Metric Halo LIO-8 which I hear is also very good, but I have not heard it myself. The ULN-2 is better priced, but not of the same family as the ULN-8/LIO-8 in terms of sound quality. thanks for that, the stereonet threads are very good reading, some guys on there who certainly know their electronics. As for the LIO-8, i just been looking at that and it looks a bit daunting with all those 8 channel mixing controllers, i think this would drive me mad as i would be constantly fiddling with them. I think I prefer a what comes out is what you get type device. LHH;135194 wrote: I have the Weiss DAC2 and it's a great DAC (and at the right price). It may be worth looking at, and the Metric Halo also. It has been my experience that you get a lot more for your money with Pro DACs, although you do miss out on the looks. I dont care about looks as I prefer bedroom listening so Im the only one looking at it apart from the missus and in fact the least attractive the least expensive it will probably appear. THe weiss is a fireware interface only isnt it ? I dont have any experience with firewire so not sure if im backing myself into a corner with that type of dac. I just want a multipurpose best sounding dac i can/cant afford that will be the foundation/source for my system which i intend to build around over the next couple of years. I have arranged to audition a couple of dacs so quite excited to get to listen to probably the best SQ my relatively inexperienced ears have ever heard.
markvetnz Posted October 11, 2010 Posted October 11, 2010 King Size;135136 wrote: Linn, like most brands tend to have a 'house sound' (for want of a better phrase) that fans of the brand indentify with. Personally I find this sound lacking in emotion and musicality, however if you like it, it might just be the ticket for you. I could not have put it better. I recently had a quick listen at the Demo Room to a Linn DAC (not exactly sure which name or model). To me the sound was lifeless and quite flat. I was told that it was the recording but it seemed to be like that on all tracks I listened to. I was not interested in the product at all - just popped in to kill some time and was shown the system concerned. Linn speakers too. I'm not sure how much of it was due to me being so used to my own system or whether it was really as dull as it sounded.
nixon76 Posted October 11, 2010 Posted October 11, 2010 fatmansings;135174 wrote: and last but not least is the Berkeley Alpha, this DAC seemed to be the one reviewers were using as the benchmark comparison with many claiming it to be the best digital sound they had ever heard. I see a 2nd hand one on Audiogon for US$3900 (NZ$5200) . Thats in my budget but not sure about purchasing from some guy in CA and shipping and possible GST and damages and rip offs and not knowing what im doing etc etc etc so will probably just leave that for another year/s The Berkeley was Computer Audiophiles DAC-of-choice until the Weiss DAC202 came along, so it would be a solid option. But as you've pointed out there is 'risk' in purchasing (esp with second hand).
kaka Posted October 11, 2010 Posted October 11, 2010 The Berkeley was the top choice playing from a mac, but that mac had a pricey Lynx card installed in it. It wasn't just the dac being tested. The downside of the Berkeley for streaming is it doesn't have USB or Firewire connectivity. I'm not sure why Computer Audiophile has never formally reviewed the Metric Halo/Sonic Studio firewire dacs. There are reader comparisons with the Berkeley on the CA forum, and usually they have preferred the Metric Halo. Their advantage is that the dac takes control of the data flow timing, unlike Berkeley SPDIF or the older non-async flavours of USB. My Altmann+Offramp usb/spdif converter combo is a bit flabby/vague in comparison with the Metric Halo LIO8. While it would be interesting to hear the latest asnyc Offramp, Firewire delivers an excellent solution straight out the back of a mac.
ajst2duk Posted October 11, 2010 Posted October 11, 2010 Just a cheeky chip in from over in red roo land - I'm getting a PDX dac from Lenehan audio and also getting a Teddydac from www.teddypardo.com - both are supposed to be pretty good for the $$ around A$1500 for the PDX (I have a growing collection of gear from Lenehan audio) and around EUR1200 for the Teddys dac. These may come in at a level under your target budget but I did a huge deal of research on dacs around the 2-3K mark and these seemed to be the top two -very subjective I realise.
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