Bookshelf horn speaker!

[dsan]

Well, the title may be a bit of an oxymoron, but that is effectively what I want to try and build.

 

1. I want to experiment with some form of horn enclosure

2. I want to use a single driver, without a crossover (if possible)

3. I want it to be reasonably compact, with dimensions suitable for stand mounting.

 

These are the main inspiration behind the idea:

http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/D3-1.htm and http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/D4-1.htm

 

Here are a few other ideas that I like:

 

Horizontal spiral:

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-horizontal.html

 

Linear spiral:

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-linearmodel.html

 

Angular spiral:

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-angular.html

 

Vertical spiral:

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-vertical.html

 

or this: http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Solo103.html (although it is a reflex cabinet)

 

I’m probably looking to use Fostex drivers from here, but am open to any other suggestions.

 

I have a budget of around $300 for components, this doesn’t include wood.

 

I’m just hoping to get suggestions, comments and feedback on my idea please, as I’m very new to this (feel free to tell me I’m crazy).

 

I’m not interested in (or capable of) working out complicated enclosures myself, so if someone wants to contribute their own design idea, it would be most welcome and greatly appreciated. There could be rewards of a box of beer, or a bottle of wine if someone is willing to help with the technical side of things.

 

Cheers guys.

Dan

[Jon1553552729]

You could try the Frugel Horn...

 

Check out the gallery, the last pics give you an idea of size.

 

It is a corner horn, so may not be suitable for you and your room.

[Owen Y]

Inspirational stuff, esp the japanese Spiral 'horns'.

 

Supergluing coils of cable together is genuinely innovative!

There's also the Disk Method (using MDF) & the Angular spiral (not so ideal I think).

 

You'd have to study the FResp plots & measuing conditions to assess real performance to be expected.

 

Keep us advised.

dsan;92483 wrote:

Here are a few other ideas that I like:

 

 

 

Horizontal spiral:

 

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-horizontal.html

 

 

 

Linear spiral:

 

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-linearmodel.html

 

 

 

Angular spiral:

 

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-angular.html

 

 

 

Vertical spiral:

 

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~hanbei/eng-vertical.html

 

[Ernie1553552694]

Intriguing Dsan. I'll look forward to watching this thread.

[aarond1553552714]

 

dsan;92483 wrote:

There could be rewards of a box of beer, or a bottle of wine if someone is willing to help with the technical side of things.

 

 

 

Cheers guys.

 

Dan

 

And for the recovering alcoholics???

 

Seriously, good luck and I will be looking forward to seeing how it goes!

[Omegaspeedy]

There seems to be positive feedback on the Solo103. It looks like a great little speaker. Good luck and I look forward to following this thread.

 

Cheers James.

[dsan]

Thanks for the encouraging comments guys.

 

 

 

You could try the Frugel Horn...

 

Check out the gallery, the last pics give you an idea of size.

 

It is a corner horn, so may not be suitable for you and your room.

The Frugel Horn does look very interesting, but unfortunately anything floor standing just isn’t practical the student flatting situation that I’ll be in for the next year and a half. Otherwise, I would have been very keen to join in the group speaker build project.

 

 

 

Inspirational stuff, esp the japanese Spiral 'horns'.

 

Supergluing coils of cable together is genuinely innovative!

 

There's also the Disk Method (using MDF) & the Angular spiral (not so ideal I think).

 

You'd have to study the FResp plots & measuing conditions to assess real performance to be expected.

 

Yes, the spirals really appeal to me, although I'm sure the photos on the website are not really indicative of how messy and fiddly they would be to construct. I can just imagine myself ending up with two fingers glued together, or a spiral glued to my forehead!

 

What would make the Angular spiral not as ideal as the others? It looks much easier. Would there be any sonic disadvantage of using the MDF stepped disc method, as opposed to the smoother surface of the cable spiral?

 

Unfortunatley I have no idea what I should be looking for in those FResp graphs. :confused: I'm really a novice at this.

 

 

 

And for the recovering alcoholics???

Home brew ginger beer? Although i can't guarantee that it will be completely alcohol free.

 

 

 

There seems to be positive feedback on the Solo103. It looks like a great little speaker. Good luck and I look forward to following this thread.

Yes, it does look like a nifty wee speaker. It should be reasonably easy to construct, so maybe I can knock it up quickly to try it out. I suppose that way I get to listen to, and burn in the drivers while I’m working on more ambitious cabinets!

 

I think the best way for me to get the ball rolling is to order the drivers, that way there is no turning back! :eek:

The Fostex FE103E looks like the best way to go to me, as there are a number of different cabinet options (spiral and Solo103) that use this driver, and they fit nicely within budget. Can anyone think of other drivers I should consider, or a reason why I shouldn’t go with the FE103E?

 

Does anyone have the technical know-how to design something like this: http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/D4-1.htm for the FE103E?

 

Sorry for such a long post!

[Owen Y]

Fostex are hi quality drivers.

 

Solo:

I'm wondering why it needs a xover?

Essentially a reflex vented box.

 

Spiral Horns:

The LF output depends greatly on the horn-mouth size/area - bigger the better. Note that the 'horn' needs to expand from a smallish 'throat' area, to a biggish 'mouth' area. The expansion rate (flare rate) can get technical, but probably not too critical with small designs like these.

 

The smooth, spiral design looks much better than stepped methods, IMO - providing they end up rigid & strong, as LF energy can be substantial.

 

Yes, the gluing looks tricky - I'd be looking for slow-acting, 'gel' type superglue - or maybe a more conventional 'construction-adhesive' (No More Nails), may be easier to handle. Or... 'hot-glue gun adhesive.

 

HTH.

[Papa Hemi]

You could try a tqwl design

 

simple to build, and IM(L)E very nice sounding

 

Theres a lot of info on the design of them on the web

 

a folded pipe will be quite compact for the fostex with a 80hz bottom end it will need abot 1m pipe length, so with a fold you could get the cabinet height down to 600mm

 

front load the horn and close placement to walls becomes less of a problem

 

then again - what do I know

 

I live in Gisborne

 

;-)

[dsan]

 

 

Solo:

 

I'm wondering why it needs a xover?

 

Essentially a reflex vented box.

This is what is says on the website: “All that is used here is a simple notch filter to lower the midrange output level to match the bass and treble better” But I’m sure it’ll be fine without it.

 

I think I might experiment with a few cabinet types. They are all reasonably small, so shouldn’t take too long, or use up too much wood in the construction.

 

 

 

You could try a tqwl design

 

simple to build, and IM(L)E very nice sounding

 

Theres a lot of info on the design of them on the web

 

a folded pipe will be quite compact for the fostex with a 80hz bottom end it will need abot 1m pipe length, so with a fold you could get the cabinet height down to 600mm

 

front load the horn and close placement to walls becomes less of a problem

 

then again - what do I know

 

I live in Gisborne

 

Thanks for the pointer; I’ll see if I can find some plans for something that compact. Still might be a bit big though, and I’m not sure how they’d look (or sound) on stands.

 

Hey, no need to knock Gisborne; you guys are the centre of innovation with that railtrack running through the airport runway. :eek: Why hasn’t anyone else thought of that?

 

I'll order the drivers in the next week or so, after I get these pesky end of semester assignments out of the way (this project has proved to be quite a distraction already).

[ilikecrumpets]

This is very interesting - once some bastard out there hires me and I start making money again I'll have a go at these, they should work well in my Kingrex second system.

Please keep us updated, and it goes without saying pics would be appreciated!

[Harvey66]

The Tang Band W4 1337 has gained quite a following in the DIY community. I have seen them used as a dipole midrange in 3 way applications and full range with no crosssover for computer speakers, for best results they do require a little loving to tame a rising HF response.

 

http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1230_04/w4-1337sd.htm

 

This project adds a little baffle step compenstion as well;

 

www.parts-express.com//projectshowcase/indexn.cfm?project=3CRTi#Crossover%20Design

 

Why it has 5 ports (2 internal and 3 external)I'm not sure, I can only quess that it improves the LF output and/or reduces port chuffing that can occur with only one.

[sedge]

They aren't horns but check out the Fonkens http://www.planet10-hifi.com/fonken.html and I like the look of this http://www.audiocraftersguild.com/Loudspeakers/oneZ/oneZ_index.html

 

From what I've read the Fonkens sound fanatastic, I'm tempted to build a set myslef

 

Cheers,

 

Sedge.

[Owen Y]

Yup... another good range of mini-box ideas.

 

The Fonken is probably a reference to the legendary 'Onken' vintage big bass cabs.

 

I rather like the 'Classic Golden Ratio' design... offends our sense of 'symmetry' but probably works v well in distributing internal cabinet resonances.

[Omegaspeedy]

 

sedge;92715 wrote:

They aren't horns but check out the Fonkens

http://www.planet10-hifi.com/fonken.html

and I like the look of this

http://www.audiocraftersguild.com/Loudspeakers/oneZ/oneZ_index.html

 

 

 

From what I've read the Fonkens sound fanatastic, I'm tempted to build a set myslef

 

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

 

Sedge.

 

Yes that Fonken looks like another great little idea. I think I will have to try something like that myself once I can afford a set of drivers. The wood is dirt cheap.

[dsan]

 

 

This project adds a little baffle step compenstion as well;

 

http://www.parts-express.com//projec...sover%20Design

 

Why it has 5 ports (2 internal and 3 external)I'm not sure, I can only quess that it improves the LF output and/or reduces port chuffing that can occur with only one.

Wow, that looks quite interesting, thanks. I think I'm going to stick with the Fostex for now, as there are a number of existing plans that I can work from. Also, I don't think I could trust a designer with a haircut like that

I do like the look of the Tang Band drivers. I tried rather hard to pursuade them to sell me just the driver and plans to the D4-1, but they wouldn't unfortunately.

 

 

 

They aren't horns but check out the Fonkens

http://www.planet10-hifi.com/fonken.html

and I like the look of this

http://www.audiocraftersguild.com/Lo...neZ_index.html

Thats great, thanks Sedge. The Fonkens are kind of like the solo 103 turned on it's side, it's a shame they don't have a plan for the FE103 driver.

The styling of the oneZ is rather post modern isn't it!? I suppose it fits with the 80's revival we're going through at the moment :eek: Looks interesting though. The tounge & groove joins might be overcomplicating it a bit, but it could be a good option with a few constuction and styling tweaks.

 

Just one more uni assignment to go, then the ball will really start rolling!

[dsan]

Well I just ordered the drivers, so no turning back now!

 

Does anyone know where I can find decent binding posts/terminals? Don't really want to spend more than $30 for a pair.

 

I'm looking for something like this (but in NZ):

 

http://darcheraudio.com.au/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=10_19&products_id=6

 

I think I'll just use cat5 for internal wiring, unless there are any other suggestions?

Thanks, Dan.

[Omegaspeedy]

Hi Dan, exciting stuff! Where did you order the drivers from? did you get a good deal? Re the binding posts, you could purchase those ones off TM and remove them from the ugly plastic surround and re-mount them onto a nice bit of polished hardwood or something. They would look very nice as the gold over brass part looks nice but it's just the plastic part that lets it down.

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Electronics-photography/Home-audio/Speakers-and-stands/Other/auction-218836539.htm

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Electronics-photography/Home-audio/Home-theatre/auction-220940820.htm

 

 

 

Looking forward to following your progress.

 

Cheers James.

[dsan]

 

omegaspeedy;92996 wrote:

Hi Dan, exciting stuff! Where did you order the drivers from? did you get a good deal? Re the binding posts, you could purchase those ones off TM and remove them from the ugly plastic surround and re-mount them onto a nice bit of polished hardwood or something. They would look very nice as the gold over brass part looks nice but it's just the plastic part that lets it down.

 

 

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Electronics-photography/Home-audio/Speakers-and-stands/Other/auction-218836539.htm

 

 

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Electronics-photography/Home-audio/Home-theatre/auction-220940820.htm

 

 

 

Looking forward to following your progress.

 

Cheers James.

 

Great, thanks for the links. That's a good idea to pull apart the plastic cover - I spotted those, but never thought of that! I just want something low profile that I can mount resonably flush with the back panel. Pretty good price too, I'll look into it.

I bought the drivers from here

$156 AU (approx $195 NZ) including postage, which I thought was pretty reasonable. Really good service so far too. Fingers crossed they arrive in one piece!

[dmann1553552739]

 

dsan;92871 wrote:

 

I'm looking for something like this (but in NZ):

 

 

 

http://darcheraudio.com.au/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=10_19&products_id=6

 

I've been using these ones from Jaycar.

[Adam_B]

 

dmann;93120 wrote:

I've been using

these ones from Jaycar

.

 

Ahhh so that's why they're always out of stock. I got the last two a couple of weeks back.

I haven't checked if they've restocked, but I need a couple more.

[Omegaspeedy]

Dan just spotted these?

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Electronics-photography/Home-audio/Speakers-and-stands/Other/auction-222751470.htm

[dsan]

great, thanks for the links guys, they all look like good options. Hopefully this isn't a silly question but do the single sockets need any isolation from the wood, or are they ok to go straight into the drill holes?

 

I've spent my all my pocket money on buying cd's from a forum member, so I might have to wait until the drivers arive to get the rest of the parts. This hobby is pure trouble - I just realised that I'll 'need' a 2nd amp after I finish these! :rolleyes:

[dsan]

I’ve been thinking about materials for the cabinets, and I guess ply is the way to go? Is the generic stuff from Mitre10 going to cut the mustard, or do I need to find a specialist supplier? Any recommendations?

 

I also thought it would be cool to make them from bamboo ply, does anyone know where I can find some in NZ? Otherwise, I might just pop down to a flooring shop and check out some bamboo flooring samples. In theory laminated/compressed/ ply bamboo should be good acoustically, might be a bastard to work with though.

[Owen Y]

dsan,

Ply from Mitre10 would be NZ Radiata Pine plywood & you would need to check the 'face grade' in order to check out knots, defects, filling etc - for clear finishing you need a 'A' or 'B' face grade, both faces if the design means 2 faces are visible, eg, horn-mouths.

 

A specialist Ply supplier is better... but you don't need the most costly stuff.

 

Bamboo ply is a great idea - I have no hands-on experience with the material, but samples are VERY hard & stiff. Surface is a bit textured/rattan patterned. The ply is only thin though (4mm?), AFAIK. The Bamboo Flooring may be better - comes in narrow plank sizes, but thicker.