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Belt-Driven Turntable, The Best Option, (My Opinion)


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Hi,

On first inspection, a direct-drive turntable is seen as the perfect system. The platter is centre driven (spins like a fan), motor wear is uniform, (good engineering principals).

However, in terms of musical reproduction, a second observation reveals a different story. The motor produces friction and vibration noise that is transfered through the spindle to the record surface and stylus, this results in loss of clarity.

One of the key factors in turntable design is motor isolation, the very reason why the suspended sub-chassis was developed.

For the enthuasiast that is a keen listener, a belt-driven turntable is the best option.

Regards, Vince

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For the enthuasiast that is a keen listener, a belt-driven turntable is the best option.

Oh...Sure thing ...says the man selling belt drives.

Are you trying to be "Ivor Tiefebrun" in 2010?

If you are, you have to try harder than that these days. There are cheap junk plastic light plater direct drives and then there are some well designed direct drives many of which were never seen outside of Japan. Your blanket statement does not wash.

Edited by jaspert
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I have just been doing some reading on the Funk firm site and they have some very interesting solutions to the problems that belt drive can have.

All my turntables were belt drive suspended units and I loved them all , each presenting a different view of the music.

I think belt drive is still the simplest way of getting good sound but not necessarily the best way.

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I better throw out my Garrard 401 then

FR

Have you got it in a plinth yet FR? You might as well not bother mate............stick it on ebay instead and go buy one of those superior bouncing belt drives!:)

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Have you got it in a plinth yet FR? You might as well not bother mate............stick it on ebay instead and go buy one of those superior bouncing belt drives!:)

I have speaker cabinet projects coming up and will do the plinth at the same time Keith

In the end you use and listen to what tickles your fancy

Hence the upgrade or refurbish itch

FR

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I have speaker cabinet projects coming up and will do the plinth at the same time Keith

In the end you use and listen to what tickles your fancy

Hence the upgrade or refurbish itch

FR

Fair enough FR and good luck with your projects. BTW, I was only joking about getting rid of the Garrard mate!:)

Cheers,

Keith

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Fair enough FR and good luck with your projects. BTW, I was only joking about getting rid of the Garrard mate!:(

Cheers,

Keith

Yeah Wal, it could get interesting.:) Over the past 40 years or so I've heard that argument put about belt drives, direct drives and rim drives etc being the best........... and you know something, they all thought they were right too, in their opinions of course!;)

Cheers,

Keith

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Yea!!!!!! I have something that "is the best option"

At last I'm there and it cost me $40

I'm being silly - again - but it's good to see someone post so positively about their thoughts on a sometimes, 'don't go there,' subject.

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Yeah Wal, it could get interesting.:) Over the past 40 years or so I've heard that argument put about belt drives, direct drives and rim drives etc being the best........... and you know something, they all thought they were right too, in their opinions of course!;)

Cheers,

Keith

Keith,

i can't make up my mind so i keep all 3 types...:(

Edited by jaspert
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Yea!!!!!! I have something that "is the best option"

At last I'm there and it cost me $40

I'm being silly - again - but it's good to see someone post so positively about their thoughts on a sometimes, 'don't go there,' subject.

Congratulations mate, I've always enjoyed listening to your tuntable too.;)

Keith,

i can make up my mind so i keep all 3 types...:)

Yeah mate, if you can't make up your mind...............in your case, you're really making sure!!:(

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My TT has a belt, but with all that sintered Gypsum it don't bounce, Rock steady too. :)

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Thinking of doing some mods to my SL1200 see how good it can sound.

interesting review from Tone Audio of the Sound hifi moded sl1200

http://www.soundhifi.com/images/Tone%20SL-1200.pdf

Dude, you don't have time to be doing mods, nor posting on here for that matter... you're supposed to be getting my ebay order ready and shipping it out to me :)

Not going to get into the belt v direct drive debate.... they all have their positives and negatives.

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LOL - sorry sir, just packing it now! they'll be there quick smart!!!

Yeah, get back to work Mr Vinyl Eye and stop mucking around posting here...............!!:)

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My direct drive Sp-10 mkII is much better than my belt drive SL-BD20, therefore by my reckoning all direct driven turntables are better than all belt driven.

Seriously though, I'd question how much friction a direct drive motor adds to the equation. Most of the magnetic resistance in a DD is also seen in a BD, it's just been moved to the other end of a rubber band. In a BD you've really got a few extra sources of friction because there's a bearing in the motor + one in the turntable, plus both bearings are being pulled into their vertical walls by the rubber band - on DD there's just 1 bearing and it's being pushed down rather than pushed down + pulled by the rubber band. Besides, my old Rambler DD turntable seems to spin forever when you cut the power.

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This thread has prompted me to post this thread on the idea of "the best". What is "the best" drive system for a turntable anyway, is it determined by the type of technology, the implementation, the overall set of compromises the designer chooses, the type of arm/cart used with the TT? How about the type of music you play or even your own musical preferences, or the synergy of each component?

Aren't there so many variables even in belt drive: position of the motor; 1 motor or 2, AC v DC, speed control of the motor, 1 belt, multiple belts, flat or round belts, vector drive, suspended or mass loaded, setup etc? Is it possible to make a definitive statement?

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Hi,

Spindle friction noise also occurs in belt-driven turntables, but to a lesser degree. Remember to keep the bearing well lubricated and use the correct length drive-belt. The belt should be a loose fit without slipping.

Regards, Vince

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Hi,

On first inspection, a direct-drive turntable is seen as the perfect system. The platter is centre driven (spins like a fan), motor wear is uniform, (good engineering principals).

However, in terms of musical reproduction, a second observation reveals a different story. The motor produces friction and vibration noise that is transfered through the spindle to the record surface and stylus, this results in loss of clarity.

One of the key factors in turntable design is motor isolation, the very reason why the suspended sub-chassis was developed.

For the enthuasiast that is a keen listener, a belt-driven turntable is the best option.

Regards, Vince

Vince .

i have no question regarding your opinion .

but in my opinion there is no such thing's that called " The best " in this audio world . Think about it .

No pun intended .

Cheers

Lovetube

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Vince .

i have no question regarding your opinion .

but in my opinion there is no such thing's that called " The best " in this audio world . Think about it .

No pun intended .

Cheers

Lovetube

There is also no such thing a perfect

Its simply a state of mind

FR

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Vince .

i have no question regarding your opinion .

but in my opinion there is no such thing's that called " The best " in this audio world . Think about it .

No pun intended .

Hi,

For the enthuasiast that is a keen listener, a belt-driven turntable is the best option.

I agree Duc, it just so subjective and the amount of variables just make that statement a nonsense. I've posted a few times here and all my posts have deliberately been made with tongue planted firmly in the cheek for that very reason. Does it mean that if you don't use a BD turntable that you are simply not enlightened? Does it mean if you don't use a BD turntable that you aren't an enthusiast or a keen listener?

BTW Duc, what is the pun you're not intending mate?..........I can't see it.:)

Cheers,

Keith

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Vince

I'm sure with all your years of owing and servicing all sorts of turntables, you can speak from experience and first hand knowledge.That's a real asset for us here on stereo net.

Although most will have an opinion, very few will have the knowledge gained from years of experience. Therefore opinions should be separated from what remains, the facts.

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Although most will have an opinion, very few will have the knowledge gained from years of experience. Therefore opinions should be separated from what remains, the facts.

if you want to know the fact then I can tell you this.

in my own experience and knowledge , the quietest turntable don't necessary give you the best sound reproductions. here I means musical presentation / dynamics range / rhythm and enjoyment , isn't all this made us want to listen to musics ?

this is not my opinion but is the fact.

again no pun intended .

Cheers

Lovetube

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Vince

I'm sure with all your years of owing and servicing all sorts of turntables, you can speak from experience and first hand knowledge.That's a real asset for us here on stereo net.

Although most will have an opinion, very few will have the knowledge gained from years of experience. Therefore opinions should be separated from what remains, the facts.

I'm waiting for more "facts" to spill forth..

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This thread has prompted me to post this thread on the idea of "the best". What is "the best" drive system for a turntable anyway, is it determined by the type of technology, the implementation, the overall set of compromises the designer chooses, the type of arm/cart used with the TT? How about the type of music you play or even your own musical preferences, or the synergy of each component?

Aren't there so many variables even in belt drive: position of the motor; 1 motor or 2, AC v DC, speed control of the motor, 1 belt, multiple belts, flat or round belts, vector drive, suspended or mass loaded, setup etc? Is it possible to make a definitive statement?

I don't susbscribe to only one "best way" to vinyl playback, it's the implementation. There're many ways to skin a cat.

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Vince

I'm sure with all your years of owing and servicing all sorts of turntables, you can speak from experience and first hand knowledge.That's a real asset for us here on stereo net.

Although most will have an opinion, very few will have the knowledge gained from years of experience. Therefore opinions should be separated from what remains, the facts.

Thats rather an arrogant statement. And there are quite a few here with many years of experience under their belt (pun intended) in regards to turntables.

In my opinion, all the OP did was state his opinion, and thats no fact at all.

Chris

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Thats rather an arrogant statement. And there are quite a few here with many years of experience under their belt (pun intended) in regards to turntables.

In my opinion, all the OP did was state his opinion, and thats no fact at all.

Chris

Agreed Chris with that................and finally a pun I can recognise!:)

Cheers,

Keith

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Hmmm. here we go again, but these debates are fun and meaty.

I have a fully spec'd 1991 Linn LP12, Lingo, Cirkus etc etc with Naim ARO. Your classic suspended belt drive that effectively killed off the DD drive busniess through world class Ivor speak and great solid engineering combined with the lack of Japanese marketing expertise in the 70's.

I also have a current production German mass non suspended TW Acustic table with two tonearms. Again, built to last.

I also have a 30 year old Pioneer Exclusive P3 DD table. Fully spirng suspended DD table and built to last another 30 years ( touch wood)

There you go, a pretty wide cross section of technologies except for rim drive.

Guess what, they all sound great and all have their strengths and weaknesses.

But overall, if I was only allowed one table to keep. I would keep the Exclusive P3 first, the TW Acustic 2nd and the Linn LP12 would be the first to go. This is basically driven by which table gets the most play time and self enjoyment.

Luckily I am not in that position as of today, so I can enjoy all.

bottom line, enjoy what you have as there is no BEST turntable technology.

Edited by turntable
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