Professional Calibration

[Guest Flex1503561254]

Hello,

I have recently completed my HT setup and I have the following gear:

- 40" 1080i Samsung LCD panel

- Yammy 2700B AVR

- Focal Chorus 826V front, 800V centre

- Yammy bookshelf rear

- Yammy C350 DVD player

- Velodyne CHT-12R sub

I bought myself a sound meter from Dicksmith and follow all the instruction written to calibrate my HT setup. I just don't feel right and believe I can achieve more from my existing system.

The living room is L shape and there is a sliding window next to the right side of my right speaker. The sitting area is 3 metres away. then there is a open area on the left side of my left speaker.

I am just wondering how much it will cost for me to hire a professional to calibrate my HT system. is there a service like that?

Also, I upgraded my cheap Sony satellite speaker to a proper Yammy bookshelf speakers, however I didn't feel any improvement or any significant impact from the new yammy. why??? I am now kinda regret not to buy the Focal rear. they might cost me more. anyway, any comments are appreciated.

[Tyrus]

Is there any reason why you didnt use the provided YPAO mic and run the auto-calbration that is built into the 2700 ?

quoting from the Yammy web-site...

"YPAO system enables convenient, accurate and trouble-free calibration of your listening environment. In one simple process, the included calibration microphone monitors a variety of test signals produced by the receiver, and adjusts a number of parameters (such as frequency response, speaker delay and channel level) to optimise the audio performance of your home theatre system."

Run this and see how it sounds and how it evaluates your speakers in terms of size and distance. At the very least, it is a good starting point.

Cheers

Edited October 10, 2008 by Tyrus

[Guest Flex1503561254]

Is there any reason why you didnt use the provided YPAO mic and run the auto-calbration that is built into the 2700 ?

quoting from the Yammy web-site...

"YPAO system enables convenient, accurate and trouble-free calibration of your listening environment. In one simple process, the included calibration microphone monitors a variety of test signals produced by the receiver, and adjusts a number of parameters (such as frequency response, speaker delay and channel level) to optimise the audio performance of your home theatre system."

Run this and see how it sounds and how it evaluates your speakers in terms of size and distance. At the very least, it is a good starting point.

Cheers

Well, I use the YPAO initially but didn't feel that accurate so I went for the SPL for manual calibration. Maybe I've done a bad job. so any precise instruction is urgently needed!

[Tyrus]

Well, I use the YPAO initially but didn't feel that accurate so I went for the SPL for manual calibration. Maybe I've done a bad job. so any precise instruction is urgently needed!

In that case it sounds as though your more in need of reassurance which I agreee is best coming from a professional installer. I would go back to the dealer that sold you the receiver and ask if they can provide some on-site asistance. If not themselves, they usually have a few contacts they can recommend at reasonable rates.

Good luck.

[MrBurns84]

In that case it sounds as though your more in need of reassurance which I agreee is best coming from a professional installer. I would go back to the dealer that sold you the receiver and ask if they can provide some on-site asistance. If not themselves, they usually have a few contacts they can recommend at reasonable rates.

Good luck.

No offence mate, but i think getting professional calibration for mid-priced gear is not going to do wonders for the system and is not $$ well spent. Instead, if you find YPAO inaccurate for some reason and did the manual calibration yourself and still not a happy camper, perhaps try to correct the room accoustics to minimise reflections and reposition things. If you have a dedicated room with expensive electronics and have put in room treatment and still not happy with the sound, then yeah go for it.

What u'll find is that playing around with speaker positions can make a difference. Also sometimes depending on how we feel can impact the way we perceive the sound. Ask yourself, whats lacking in the sound? Too muddy, too clinical, too much bass? Perhaps by answering some of these questions will give you a starting point, and the rest of us to assist better. Professional calibrations are indeed a last resort measure as they do cost a bit as a service, along with the recommendations that they provide, will cost more in "re-novating" your HT area to improve the sound.

[50mxe20]

With respect, it's not an easy area when you are new to all this.

If one can afford a professional calibrator, why not get one and use him/her?!

Edit add: I have had my plasma calibrated and was worth it.

Sound I have not (yet) but I've considered it.

[Mr. Whippy]

No offence mate, but i think getting professional calibration for mid-priced gear is not going to do wonders for the system and is not $$ well spent. Instead, if you find YPAO inaccurate for some reason and did the manual calibration yourself and still not a happy camper, perhaps try to correct the room accoustics to minimise reflections and reposition things. If you have a dedicated room with expensive electronics and have put in room treatment and still not happy with the sound, then yeah go for it.

What u'll find is that playing around with speaker positions can make a difference. Also sometimes depending on how we feel can impact the way we perceive the sound. Ask yourself, whats lacking in the sound? Too muddy, too clinical, too much bass? Perhaps by answering some of these questions will give you a starting point, and the rest of us to assist better. Professional calibrations are indeed a last resort measure as they do cost a bit as a service, along with the recommendations that they provide, will cost more in "re-novating" your HT area to improve the sound.

No offence either, but I couldnt disagree more. I only have mid priced gear as well and I got everything professionally calibrated, both the display and the amp. While some may count the improvements as small, a professional using professional equipment will always be superior to using a $50 SPL from Dick Smith (which is what I did first time round). As well as being a huge learning experience in terms of understanding a rooms dynamics, I am confident that after having my amp calibrated I am getting the best out of my system and that it was worth every cent. I think from memory it cost between $200-$300. Horses for courses but some people would spend more than that on a single interconnect.

Best,

El Whippo

[Tyrus]

No offence either, but I couldnt disagree more. I only have mid priced gear as well and I got everything professionally calibrated, both the display and the amp. While some may count the improvements as small, a professional using professional equipment will always be superior to using a $50 SPL from Dick Smith (which is what I did first time round). As well as being a huge learning experience in terms of understanding a rooms dynamics, I am confident that after having my amp calibrated I am getting the best out of my system and that it was worth every cent. I think from memory it cost between $200-$300. Horses for courses but some people would spend more than that on a single interconnect.

Best,

El Whippo

I agree.

The point I was making, is that after spending $3k-$5k and I wasnt totally happy, then $200 to $300 is well spent if for nothing else but reassurance that I didnt waste my original investment.

[MrBurns84]

No offence either, but I couldnt disagree more. I only have mid priced gear as well and I got everything professionally calibrated, both the display and the amp. While some may count the improvements as small, a professional using professional equipment will always be superior to using a $50 SPL from Dick Smith (which is what I did first time round). As well as being a huge learning experience in terms of understanding a rooms dynamics, I am confident that after having my amp calibrated I am getting the best out of my system and that it was worth every cent. I think from memory it cost between $200-$300. Horses for courses but some people would spend more than that on a single interconnect.

Best,

El Whippo

True, i would agree that professional calibration would bring out the best from one's equipment, however, to justify the cost for a couple of hundreds for equipment that is mid range doesnt qualify as the best return on my investment(in my opinion). Not to mention that if you change/upgrade the equipment or move the speakers, it would require re-calibration. But also on that note, if you have exhausted your options on DIY calibration and still seem unhappy with the sound, then for sure, go for it. Please do not think that I am anti-calibration, but i'm just a firm believer to on the fact of understanding what the limitations are, reading up on solutions and bouncing ideas of ppl, giving it a go until i've exhausted my options, then as a fallback, call in someone who can fix it. If one doesnt have the time for this and prefers to get it right from the start with minimal hassles, then again, go for it. There is no right & wrong here, just an opinion..

[MACCA350]

Audio calibration is best started in the design phase. It all depends on how far the customer wishes to go to get the best audio experience. If you are planning to employ an audio calibrator I'd advise you do it at the earliest possible stage, not after you have spent monies on treatments etc, as you may be wasting your money on treatments that are unnecessary or not optimal.

A calibrator will be able to give you real information on what you can do get the most out of your room. It's then up to you how far you wish to go with it, and what changes you are happy to make. There can be compromises(more so in existing setups) to what is possible to achieve due to customers financial and decorative preferences which only you can decide.

Have a read through some material on the HAA website. It will give you a better understanding of what an audio calibration is.

cheers

Edited October 18, 2008 by MACCA350

[momaw]

I agree.

The point I was making, is that after spending $3k-$5k and I wasnt totally happy, then $200 to $300 is well spent if for nothing else but reassurance that I didnt waste my original investment.

Wouldn't your ears be the test of whether your original investment was a waste? What if after $200-$300 it sounds the same? Are you suddenly satisfied? Personally I think that kind of cash for an incremental improvement (which as stated would require another calibration as soon as something is changed) on something you are already dissatisfied with would be better put toward replacing the unsatisfactory piece with something that does what you want. That is not to say don't get a calibration (they are great to squeeze everything out of your setup), just to think before your do what kind of improvement you would need to be happy with something you currently find not to your taste and whether it is feasible a calibration might be the solution. Some pieces of equipment will never sound "right" to some no matter how well calibrated.

[Kazz]

Some pieces of equipment will never sound "right" to some no matter how well calibrated.

I have to agree with that, I recently replaced my 8 month old Yamaha 3800 with a Marantz 7002 because no matter how much I calibrated and fiddled with the settings on the Yammy it just didn't sound right. I was lucky enough to have a friend with a 7002 who brought it around to try in my system, once I'd heard the difference I knew what the problem was and no amount of calibrating would have made the system sound right with the yammy.

I'm not trying to denigrate the 3800 here, but in my system it was totally wrong.

[momaw]

I have to agree with that, I recently replaced my 8 month old Yamaha 3800 with a Marantz 7002 because no matter how much I calibrated and fiddled with the settings on the Yammy it just didn't sound right. I was lucky enough to have a friend with a 7002 who brought it around to try in my system, once I'd heard the difference I knew what the problem was and no amount of calibrating would have made the system sound right with the yammy.

I'm not trying to denigrate the 3800 here, but in my system it was totally wrong.

This is why auditioning is so important and preferably in your own home. Sadly with so many specialist stores being replaced by box movers we are heading towards a purchase and hope situation

[Juicester]

even specialist stores are hard pressed to allow home demos. I've been knocked back so many times for gear costing around the 3k mark for a home demo - even after offering drivers license etc as 'insurance'.

[-geejay-]

Wouldn't your ears be the test of whether your original investment was a waste? What if after $200-$300 it sounds the same? Are you suddenly satisfied? Personally I think that kind of cash for an incremental improvement (which as stated would require another calibration as soon as something is changed) on something you are already dissatisfied with would be better put toward replacing the unsatisfactory piece with something that does what you want. That is not to say don't get a calibration (they are great to squeeze everything out of your setup), just to think before your do what kind of improvement you would need to be happy with something you currently find not to your taste and whether it is feasible a calibration might be the solution. Some pieces of equipment will never sound "right" to some no matter how well calibrated.

That’s a good point Momaw.

But getting a calibration person in may be a viable option for some people who are still in the process of developing their skills in appreciating quality sound reproduction -and who don’t quite know what to do to take things further.

For example, if a calibrator comes in and performs their magic as best they can, and then says “that’s as good as we can get it at the moment”, and “to go any further you would need to change / improve xxxx” -where xxxx could be an equipment item or an unhelpful room characteristic.

So the owner has then benefited by seeing how his equipment performs in his own environment when optimally set up by a professional for the best results possible, and also knows what his goals are for any further steps should they be necessary (and perhaps when finances permit).

I guess it’s up to an individual to decide if the amount charged is worth it. And for some, they may well consider that it is a useful stage to go through to get better results, set goals, and also learn something along the way.

Just a thought,

Cheers

[MrBurns84]

That’s a good point Momaw.

But getting a calibration person in may be a viable option for some people who are still in the process of developing their skills in appreciating quality sound reproduction -and who don’t quite know what to do to take things further.

For example, if a calibrator comes in and performs their magic as best they can, and then says “that’s as good as we can get it at the moment”, and “to go any further you would need to change / improve xxxx” -where xxxx could be an equipment item or an unhelpful room characteristic.

So the owner has then benefited by seeing how his equipment performs in his own environment when optimally set up by a professional for the best results possible, and also knows what his goals are for any further steps should they be necessary (and perhaps when finances permit).

I guess it’s up to an individual to decide if the amount charged is worth it. And for some, they may well consider that it is a useful stage to go through to get better results, set goals, and also learn something along the way.

Just a thought,

Cheers

Ditto!

[momaw]

even specialist stores are hard pressed to allow home demos. I've been knocked back so many times for gear costing around the 3k mark for a home demo - even after offering drivers license etc as 'insurance'.

It's certainly not easy these days. I can only do it with a couple of places because I have built a relationship with them. For a beginner starting out it would be very hard. But I guess that's another reason why specialist stores are so important as they will at least have everything set up there for an audition even if you can't try at home.

That’s a good point Momaw.

But getting a calibration person in may be a viable option for some people who are still in the process of developing their skills in appreciating quality sound reproduction -and who don’t quite know what to do to take things further.

For example, if a calibrator comes in and performs their magic as best they can, and then says “that’s as good as we can get it at the moment”, and “to go any further you would need to change / improve xxxx” -where xxxx could be an equipment item or an unhelpful room characteristic.

So the owner has then benefited by seeing how his equipment performs in his own environment when optimally set up by a professional for the best results possible, and also knows what his goals are for any further steps should they be necessary (and perhaps when finances permit).

I guess it’s up to an individual to decide if the amount charged is worth it. And for some, they may well consider that it is a useful stage to go through to get better results, set goals, and also learn something along the way.

Just a thought,

Cheers

Good point

[Brendon]

Hi,

I have had getting a proper room calibration and PJ calibration on my wish list for a long time now and from comments I have heard from the guys who have had it done it sounds a throughly worth while investment.

I would be interested in it as a learning experience and would happily pay for some extra time if the guy doing it was prepared to give me decent commentary on whats going on.

Maybe the original poster could add a little more detail about his room ie floor coverings ,curtains etc and a few photos showing speaker placement listening position etc and the guys may be able to offer some more suggestions.

Re room treatments how does one know what is needed where with out some form of measurement or do you just try trial and error ?

Brendon

Edited October 18, 2008 by brendonc

[skippyboy1503561353]

"I bought myself a sound meter from Dicksmith and follow all the instruction written to calibrate my HT setup. I just don't feel right and believe I can achieve more from my existing system."

Try this "http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/" they have got all sorts of free downloads for your sound meter.

[Mitcon1503562253]

I know a few people who have still been unhappy after having their system professionally calibrated, there is just too many variables and then everyones "taste" is different. If you are open to learning to listen to a correctly set-up system and re-educate your sound pallet then this may work out ok for you but most people prefer to enjoy sound the way they think it should sound in their own opinion/taste.

If you are truely unhappy with the sound of your current set-up after basic calibration then I think it's more a matter of room acoustics or the gear in use just isn't right for your tastes. As already said, finding the right gear for your room and sound pallet/taste is not a simple or easy matter and should take alot of thought, time and planing before you buy. The only true way is getting the gear set-up in your listening environ and hearing it which is very hard to do often in the real world. The next best thing is to hit forums such as this with info about your sound taste/pallet/likes, your room and the furnishings so others who have a good idea or have already gone through this that many times will be able to give you some good feedback and thoughts on what may suit. If you just buy gear blindly and strictly to a budget rather than a need or want then it will be difficult to get it to sound just perfect for your tastes. But just moving speakers and working with room acoustics can make a huge difference, IMHO there's no point in calibrating a system untill you have tweaked the room acoustics as much as you can (within reason and always with SWMBO as if she's not happy no matter what I do to tweak my system I still hear screeeching lol).

So, seeing as you already have the gear, I would think the next best step would be let people here know what it is your not happy with rather than just saying the "sound"...Is it boomy, bass heavy maybe too bright...etc... It may be standing waves. So after letting folks know how it's lacking is sound to your ears/tastes then let us know about the room size/shape and the furnishings and then it will be easier for people to suggest what to try to improve your current set-up. I think in the end the best set-up or calibration is the one you enjoy listening to the most, I know people who say it's pro calibrated but still dont enjoy the way it sounds as their taste is different.

The other side of the coin is some people are very critical in their taste and listening and are always changing/upgrading their system to find the purity they are after to match their pallet. Nothing wrong with chasing perfection and this is the reason why there is so much different gear and also why so much gear sounds different as we all have different tastes. I know one system I set-up for some people is very poorly calibrated IMHO and I think it sounds horrid as it's so bass heavy and boomy, but this is in-fact what the person liked and was after. Each to their own is all I can say, I have nothing wrong with the idea of pro calibration as long as you are willing to open yourself to ideas and different sounds.