Guest JohnA Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 Shane,I got it to see if you are talking bull. Luckily you're not. More eye candy. John, you didn't quite finish your question? Shane could answer it better I think. hmmm my post went funny. Have fixed it now
NellyJamba Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 (edited) Had the privilege to hear and see it recently. It looked better than it appears in this picture. Stunner. It is a Salma Hayek that could sing like Jennifer Warnes. And the tonearm...don't even get me started. That kind of precision engineering is a work of art. The parts are CNC EDM and wire cut. This kind of technology is still expensive today so you can imagine how exclusive it was 20 years ago. Actually it is still exclusive today Edited June 25, 2010 by NellyJamba typo
theophile Posted June 25, 2010 Author Posted June 25, 2010 One of these definitely beckons.The suggestion of any urgency in getting one,in my case,is surely moderated by the performance of the optioned(power supply),and mag-lev supported Yamaha direct drive..The lure of the P3 for me,is that they are out there,and that the performance really is on the top-shelf of what the Japanese were doing back then with direct drives. I do think that some of the modern direct drives,like the Grand Prix Audio Monaco and the Teres Certus,embody a serious effort at a contemporary implementation of the principle.An effort which stands them in worthy comparison with the giants of the Japanese golden era of direct drives.I'd love to hear a Certus or Monaco pitted against a SP 10 Mk3 or the P3 or my own deck.The price/performance yield of the vintage direct drives over the new ones would vastly tilt the value equation in favour of our beloved vintage DDs.If the new ones had any advantage over the old,it would come at a hefty price premium.That assumes that there was an advantage to be had.The truth may be otherwise. Maybe next year. Enjoy your toys fellows!
Guest Muon Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 Wow! Never seen one of these before, It's a gorgeous turntable alright
djb Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 glanced at this thread 6 months ago and the nuances were lost ON me. sad to say they now make sense! such is my slide down the slippery tt slope not that the thread posters will remember their anticipation awaiting the arrival of their first mc cart. i have listed all the tts mentioned here for [im]possible purchase any more vintage models i should add that r in this category or a little below it? any sleepers?
theophile Posted June 25, 2010 Author Posted June 25, 2010 If we tell you....they won't be sleepers now,will they?
theophile Posted June 26, 2010 Author Posted June 26, 2010 (edited) My first Moving Coil was the Supex SD900E bought in 1979.The first of three Supexs.I was using it on a Pioneer 510A direct drive,Technics SU 7700 amp and Chadwick(Aussie)speakers.The Supex was way out of place,much too good for the system.I liked it much more than the Stanton 681EEE I was using at the time. There are some good discussions about Direct Drive TTs on many forums. Edited June 26, 2010 by theophile
metal beat Posted June 26, 2010 Posted June 26, 2010 (edited) He just can't help himself our Jaspert congrats again mate on a mighty fine TT. Now i have a question, what are the main differences (sound wise also, with all other things been equal) between the P3 and P10 Hi John, The P3 mechanically is built to a higher spec - It was the best turntable Pioneer could make back. Cost 600,000 yen back in 1981 Similar appearance from the outside, however the P3 had more powerful motor with very high torque, the entire chassis ( motor,platter & tonearm etc) are floated via spirng suspension and entirely isloated from the wooden plinth. the tonearm while they look very similar has bigger bearings etc etc. see the link that gives a better run down than i will be able to do. http://audio-database.com/PIONEER-EXCLUSIVE/player/p3-e.html The P10 is more closley related to the Pioneer PL-70, but built to a higher spec. the morot unit and platter look the same. the suspension is a simple spring based on all four feet, however the chassis/motor/tonerarm are not isloated from the plinth - so you do get more resonance than the p3. Still isolates extremely well. the suspension is looser than the P3, so that may account for the slightly looser sound. more specs etc in link. http://audio-database.com/PIONEER-EXCLUSIVE/player/p10-e.html Pretty much what I said initially. the P10 sounds wonderful and has that DD drive in the bass and freedom from overhang throught the upper bass/lower midrange. It is a bit looser overall. The P3 just has a bit more of everything, more precise and majestic sounding. the P10 sounds pretty good with any cartridge, however the P3 is more revealing, so more work is required in dialing in the damping etc. The arm wands are very similar between the P10 and P3, so I can set up on the P3 and move over to the P10 without changing alignment some more pics, then I will stop my love fest. Edited June 26, 2010 by turntable 1
Guest JohnA Posted June 26, 2010 Posted June 26, 2010 thanks for all the info TT. I do like the look of them. I have been thinking of grabbing a technics sp10 mk2 but may look into these also. Damn you people
metal beat Posted June 26, 2010 Posted June 26, 2010 Technics SP10 Mk2 is very good table. Plinth can be the limiting factor whereas the Exclusve tables are set to go. In theory the slotless linear Pioneer DD motors are superior, however Jasper has a SP10, so I am sure he can let you know about the sonic differences in his system. djb. Quite a few Japanese DD tables are sought after and highly recommended. Theo's Yamaha GT2000 and various versions are well regarded and from memory like the Exclusive, only sold in Japan. Denon DP80 or the ultra expensive DP100 Kenwood L-07D Pioneer PL-70 Technics SP10 Mk2 or Mk3 Sony PS-X9 As Theo said, there are more and most of the upper moldel are built to last.
theophile Posted June 26, 2010 Author Posted June 26, 2010 Turntable, I LOVE that first photo.Do you have a shot of the platter alone,perhaps one of it's underside?
metal beat Posted June 26, 2010 Posted June 26, 2010 [ATTACH=CONFIG]19729[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]19728[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]19727[/ATTACH]Theo, I don't have a photo of the platter by itself. here are a couple more when I first got the table. You can see [ATTACH=CONFIG]19726[/ATTACH]the 3 screws on top of the motor. This is where the platter sits. remove screws and screw down direct to the motor housing. I assume your yammy is similar? [ATTACH=CONFIG]19725[/ATTACH]
theophile Posted June 26, 2010 Author Posted June 26, 2010 o[uOTE=turntable;378237][ATTACH=CONFIG]19729[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]19728[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]19727[/ATTACH]Theo, I don't have a photo of the platter by itself. here are a couple more when I first got the table. You can see [ATTACH=CONFIG]19726[/ATTACH]the 3 screws on top of the motor. This is where the platter sits. remove screws and screw down direct to the motor housing. I assume your yammy is similar? [ATTACH=CONFIG]19725[/ATTACH] The GT 2000 is entirely different.The platter is supported by the spindle itself.No-sub-platter. I wanted to see the P3 platter itself(and especially the underside)to see whether it was cast or machined,plus the way that the mass is distributed via the cross-sections.The GT 2000's platter is vacuum forged and machined.The side elevation thickness of the GT 2000 platter is maintained all the way from the rim through to the spindle.It is one thick large diameter hunk of alloy.The Gun-Metal optional platter for the GT 20000,is the same cross-section and dimensions but weighs 15 KG(I think). The implementation is different,the result is high performance in either instance.The 'best approach' may be something different again....who knows?I am certain that as more people continue to experience the sound of top-shelf Direct Drives and share their experiences,that there may be added incentive for talented designers to make their mark with novel,never before considered presentations of the principle.
djb Posted June 26, 2010 Posted June 26, 2010 thanks tt u can edit the post away now dont want to annoy theo;)
Asteroid Posted June 26, 2010 Posted June 26, 2010 Interesting that the motor is separate from the platter. The Technics have it integrated with the platter. http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/showthread.php/13409-Sp-10?p=211871&viewfull=1#post211871
theophile Posted June 26, 2010 Author Posted June 26, 2010 Here's a picture(topside)of the GT 2000's platter.The bolts are a homemade improvised solution to the fact that the owner of this 2000 does not own the threaded lifters which came with the deck when bought new. I stole this photo from the AudioKarma site.The owner's moniker is Duffinator.
metal beat Posted November 21, 2024 Posted November 21, 2024 I just realised last Sunday, November 17 I have owned the mighty Pioneer Exclusive P3 for 15 years. 15 years of trouble free musical pleasure. special thanks to my friend Travis who found one in Japan, had Pioneer service it and the tonearm, pack it perfectly and ship it to me all those years ago. Having straight and S shaped arm wands gives one the ability to get the best out of almost any cartridge. no need for isolation as it has build in isolation down to 5hz for the table and tonearm which is isolated completely from the wood plinth. Once you get used to the start stop in in less than a split second, it's hard to use anything else. a modern day vintage classic if there ever was one and still ahead of the game in many respects 45 years after it was released in Japan only. - they only ever kept the best for themselves back in those days. 11 3
theophile Posted November 26, 2024 Author Posted November 26, 2024 Given that I, a non-P3 owner started this thread over 24 years ago, I will be the first to congratulate you and underline that a superior turntable will continue to be a joy to use. If you divide the number of years of emjoyment by the cost in dollars it is great value. 2
metal beat Posted November 26, 2024 Posted November 26, 2024 (edited) 48 minutes ago, theophile said: Given that I, a non-P3 owner started this thread over 24 years ago, I will be the first to congratulate you and underline that a superior turntable will continue to be a joy to use. If you divide the number of years of emjoyment by the cost in dollars it is great value. Thanks Theo. Wonderful value and sound indeed But it was only 15 years ago Edited November 26, 2024 by metal beat
cafe67 Posted November 27, 2024 Posted November 27, 2024 On 21/11/2024 at 6:18 PM, metal beat said: I just realised last Sunday, November 17 I have owned the mighty Pioneer Exclusive P3 for 15 years. 15 years of trouble free musical pleasure. special thanks to my friend Travis who found one in Japan, had Pioneer service it and the tonearm, pack it perfectly and ship it to me all those years ago. Having straight and S shaped arm wands gives one the ability to get the best out of almost any cartridge. no need for isolation as it has build in isolation down to 5hz for the table and tonearm which is isolated completely from the wood plinth. Once you get used to the start stop in in less than a split second, it's hard to use anything else. a modern day vintage classic if there ever was one and still ahead of the game in many respects 45 years after it was released in Japan only. - they only ever kept the best for themselves back in those days. What cartridges have you used with it?
metal beat Posted November 27, 2024 Posted November 27, 2024 2 hours ago, cafe67 said: What cartridges have you used with it? WOW, testing my memory now: Most I still own. MM's - Technics EPC100mk4 - one of the best carts ever, period Elac ESG 795 ADC XLM MK111 Nagaoka MP50 Orotfon and Stanton carts - can't recall the models Audio Technica AT95 Audio Techica AT25 Linn K9 MC's Dynavector XV-1 Dynavector XV-1s Lyra Delos Lyra Kleos Lyra Etna SL Lyra Atlas SL Lyra Atlas SL Lambda Ortofon A90, Ortofon GM Royal Ortofon GM Classic Denon 103R Denon 103R ESC'd Denon DL-S1 Linn ESC'd Troika Phasemation PP2000 1
cafe67 Posted November 27, 2024 Posted November 27, 2024 21 minutes ago, metal beat said: WOW, testing my memory now: Most I still own. MM's - Technics EPC100mk4 - one of the best carts ever, period Elac ESG 795 ADC XLM MK111 Nagaoka MP50 Orotfon and Stanton carts - can't recall the models Audio Technica AT95 Audio Techica AT25 Linn K9 MC's Dynavector XV-1 Dynavector XV-1s Lyra Delos Lyra Kleos Lyra Etna SL Lyra Atlas SL Lyra Atlas SL Lambda Ortofon A90, Ortofon GM Royal Ortofon GM Classic Denon 103R Denon 103R ESC'd Denon DL-S1 Linn ESC'd Troika Phasemation PP2000 Wow indeed - from memory don’t you have an SP10 as well
metal beat Posted November 27, 2024 Posted November 27, 2024 24 minutes ago, cafe67 said: Wow indeed - from memory don’t you have an SP10 as well Yes, SP10MK3 1
TP1 Posted November 27, 2024 Posted November 27, 2024 I am still very happy with my P3a - I haven't had many cartridges but I do love the Lyra Etna . These turntables are heirloom items that will work just as well in future decades. 1 1
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